Pro and Con 1588

Posted 1-23-11

Cassini's picture of a storm on Saturn shows how thin Saturn's rings are. The barely visible thin line shows the thickness of the rings. The broad bands are its shadows.

http://apod.nasa.gov/apod/ap110119.html

HUGE CMES IN THE PAST FEW DAYS (video)

http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/data/LATEST/current_c2small.gif

Incoming e-mail, Re: "Pope appoints 24 new cardinals: Italian set to be 'next pope'"

Pope Benedict XVI is to appoint 24 new cardinals on Saturday, 10 of whom will be Italian – making the prospect that his successor will be Italian more likely.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/the-pope/8147164/Pope-appoints-24-new-cardinals-Italian-set-to-be-next-pope.html

My reply

Thanks for this interesting article. It made me think of St. Malachy's prophecies concerning the last Pope, "Peter the Roman."

"POPE APPOINTS 24 NEW CARDINALS: ITALIAN SET TO BE 'NEXT POPE'"
By Nick Squires, Rome, 19 Nov 2010

"The new appointments will boost the number of Italian cardinals to 25, giving them huge clout when it comes to electing a new pontiff on the death of Benedict XVI....

"The "Italianisation" of the Catholic Church's hierarchy fuelled speculation that after Benedict, a German, and his Polish predecessor, John Paul II, the leadership of the world's one billion Catholics could swing back to Italy."

That could bring a "PETER THE ROMAN," to power as prophesied by St. Malachy. Would that fit the Beast or False Prophet mentioned in The Revelation of Jesus Christ?

THE "BEAST" AND THE "FALSE PROPHET"

Many speak of these two men as Antichrist and the False Prophet. 1Jn 2:22 says, "Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? HE IS ANTICHRIST, THAT DENIETH THE FATHER AND THE SON." Since the Pope has not gone public with a denial of the Father and the Son, I will stick with the "Beast" and the "False Prophet." These names are Biblical.

Rev 16:13 says, "And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon (Satan), and out of the mouth of the BEAST (first beast of Rev. 13), and out of the mouth of the FALSE PROPHET" (second beast of Rev. 13).

Rev. 13:1-18 says, "And I stood upon the sand of the sea (Rev. 17 :15 says that 'The waters which thou sawest, where the whore [the Mystery Religion of Babylon] sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.'), and saw a beast (the 'great red dragon' of Rev. 12:3) rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns TEN CROWNS (then this time is after the first Rapture; see Rev. 17:12-14), and upon his heads (all 7, leaders of Babel, Babylon II, Media-Persia, Greece, Holy Roman Empire, Ecclesiastical Roman Empire, and Babylon III) the name of blasphemy (Pontifex Maximus, which started with Nimrod at the Tower of Babel and is used by the leaders of all 7 kingdoms).
2 And the beast which I saw (i.e., the great red dragon) was like unto a leopard (like Greece, Dan 7:6), and his feet were as the feet of a bear (like Media-Persia, Dan 7:5), and his mouth as the mouth of a lion (like Babylon II, Dan 7:4): and the dragon (Satan) gave him (the 6th head, the Beast, leader of the Roman Ecclesiastical Empire) his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3 And I saw one of his (the great red dragon's) heads (the 5th, the Holy Roman Empire) as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed (it became the Ecclesiastical Roman Empire): and all the world wondered after the beast (the Pope).
4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast (the Pope), saying, WHO IS LIKE UNTO THE BEAST? (no one) who is able to make war with him? (no one)
5 And there was given unto him (the Pope) a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies (claiming to be the Pontifex Maximus like Nimrod); and power was given unto him to CONTINUE FORTY AND TWO MONTHS (the first half of the Tribulation). (The Pope is already in power at the time of the Rapture, Rev 17:10 says, 'FIVE ARE FALLEN [leaders of Babel, Babylon II, Media-Persia, Greece and the Holy Roman Empire], ONE IS'; [the Pope, leader of the Ecclesiastical Roman Empire])
6 And HE (the Pope) OPENED HIS MOUTH IN BLASPHEMY AGAINST GOD, TO BLASPHEME HIS NAME, AND HIS TABERNACLE, AND THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN (i.e., the first Rapture has just taken place, and he was left behind).
7 And it was given unto him to make WAR WITH THE SAINTS (the foolish virgins left behind), and to overcome them: and POWER WAS GIVEN HIM OVER ALL KINDREDS, AND TONGUES, AND NATIONS (i.e., after the first Rapture; Rev. 6:2 says, 'and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer').
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are NOT written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be KILLED WITH THE SWORD. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
11 And I beheld ANOTHER BEAST (Satan) coming up out of the earth (Mid-Trib, Rev 17:8 says, "The beast that thou sawest was [in Judas Iscariot], and is not [in man now]; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit [Mid-Trib], and go into perdition [the second son of perdition, the False Prophet]); and he (Satan) had two horns (two comings to power) like a lamb (Christ), and he (the Satan-possessed False Prophet) spake as a dragon (Satan).
12 And he (the Satan-possessed False Prophet) exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him (so he is probably a Pope), and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the FIRST BEAST, WHOSE DEADLY WOUND WAS HEALED.
13 And he (the False Prophet) doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast (the first beast); saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should MAKE AN IMAGE TO THE BEAST, WHICH HAD THE WOUND BY A SWORD, AND DID LIVE.
15 And he had power to give life (pneuma, breath, figuratively a demon) unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast (the first beast) should be killed.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a MARK in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six."

VICARIUS FILII DEI, REPRESENTATIVE OF THE SON OF GOD, A TITLE USED BY THE POPE, = 666


Vicarius means Vicar (Representative). Filii means son. Dei means God.

The 10 kings have not yet received their kingdom (Rev 17:12) when the first Rapture (Rev 17:14) takes place.

Rev 17:12-14 says, "And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received NO KINGDOM AS YET; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast (i.e., the Satan-possessed False Prophet).
13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast (the False Prophet).
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and THEY THAT ARE WITH HIM (i.e., have already been caught up in the Rapture) ARE CALLED, AND CHOSEN, AND FAITHFUL."

ST. MALACHY'S PROPHECIES ABOUT THE POPES

The Kabbalist, St. Malachy O’Morgair, Archbishop of Armagh, Ireland (1094-1148) was canonized as the first Irish Saint in the Catholic Church by Pope Clement III in 1190.

In 1139, when making a pilgrimage to the Vatican, Malachy fell to the ground in a trance when he saw Rome and began murmuring cryptic short phrases in Latin. There were 112 of them, each supposed to describe the last 112 Popes, beginning with Pope Celestine II, who was elected in 1143.

He wrote them down and entrusted the list to Pope Innocent II in 1140. It was lost in the Vatican for 400 years, then discovered in 1595. The cryptic phrases are all the more interesting since St Malachy accurately predicted his own death in Clairvaux, France, on All Souls Day, Nov. 2, 1148. Some claim that 90% of the phrases have fit the Popes.

The last three Popes in Malachy's list are the most interesting now. The phrases are supposed to represent No. 110, John Paul II (Karol Josef Wojtlya, b. 1920 in Wadowice, Poland - d. 1978) (beatification at the Vatican will be May 1, 2011, last step before sainthood), No. 111, Benedict XVI (Joseph Ratzinger, German, b. 1927, elected April 19, 2005) and No. 112, a final Pope called Peter the Roman.

If the Rapture takes place on Ascension Day, May 29, 2011, as I think it might, Benedict XVI could still be in office until Mid-Trib, when Peter the Roman would come to power. "Peter the Roman" would reign until the Feast of Trumpets, probably Sept. 14, 2015, the Day of the Lord that is also the Day of God's Wrath.

110. "FROM THE TOIL OF THE SUN" - JOHN PAUL II, ELECTED OCT 16, 1978

His phrase, "De Labore Solis" (From the toil of the sun) is said to fit him, because there was a nearly Total Solar Eclipse seen in Europe when he was born on May 18, 1920, and a Partial Solar Eclipse seen in the Americas when he died April 2, 2005. That can be checked out at Fred Espenak's NASA web site. Also, like the Sun, he has circled the globe while doing his work. He has traveled more than 3/4 million miles (more than any other Pope), visiting most of the countries in the world.

Most of the Popes have been Italian. John Paul II, one of the yougest Popes to be elected, was the first one that was not Italian in the last 456 years. Maybe Peter the Roman will fit the last one, which might turn out to be the False Prophet.

As far as I know, no other Pope in history ever called for a New World Order, and John Paul waited until he had been in office over 25 years before he did. That seems significant. The first time I heard the President of the USA mention the New World Order was the first President Bush.

John Paul II kissed the pagan Qur'an and said that Islam and Christians had the same God. That suggests the end times. To me, Allah is the pagan Moon God.

John Paul II was very dedicated to Mary, calling her the Queen of Heaven. To me, that term goes back to the mother/goddess system established by Nimrod, Semiramis and Tammuz at the Tower of Babel.

In the Old Testament, Jer 7:18 warned, "The children gather wood, and the fathers kindle the fire, and the women knead their dough, to make cakes to the QUEEN OF HEAVEN, and to pour out drink offerings unto OTHER GODS, that they may provoke me to anger." The Queen of Heaven mentioned in Scripture was a pagan goddess. Didn't John Paul know that was in the Bible? He sure seemed dedicated to re-establishing the Mother-goddess system.

Where is this headed? In Rev 17:3, John said, "So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness (eremos, desert, i.e., in the land of Shinar where the Tower of Babel was built): and I saw a woman (symbol of a religious group) sit upon a scarlet coloured beast (the great red dragon), full of names of blasphemy (then the name of blasphemy is on the 6th and 7th heads), having seven heads and ten horns." Then this is when the name of blasphemy appears on the seventh head, i.e., Mid-Trib. I wonder if he will be called "Peter the Roman."

Regarding the woman (a religious group) that will be seated at Babylon III Mid-Trib, Rev 17:5 says, "And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH." The Mystery Religion started by Nimrod and Semiramis at the Tower of Babel (Babylon I) will have come to Babylon III.

111. "FROM THE GLORY OF THE OLIVE," BENEDICT XVI, JOSEPH RATZINGER, ELECTED APRIL 19, 2005

De Gloria Olivæ, "From the glory of the olive," fits Pope Benedict XVI.
It refers to the Benedictine Order that was established in 1313 by St. Benedict Tolomei at Accona, south of Siena, Italy, where olive trees are plentiful. Their symbol is the olive branch. Members wear white habits and are called Olivetans. St. Benedict prophesied that before the end of the world the Olivetans would triumphantly lead the Catholic Church in its fight against evil. The Olivetans think they are to prepare the world for the Tribulation Jesus spoke of in the Olivet Discourse.

The olive branch has also been associated with peace. In his first declaration, the new Pope explained the name Benedict as having the motto Peace and Consolation. Pope Benedict XVI will probably be the one to strengthen the Peace Treaty of Dan 9:27.

The earlier Pope, Benedict XV, tried to be a peacemaker in WW I. He set forth seven points that were supposed to forestall any more world wars. However, he was not asked to attend the negotiation and ratification of the Treaty of Versailles. It seems that Benedict XVI wants to succeed as a peacemaker where Benedict XV failed. It looks like he just might do that after the Rapture takes place.

The previous Benedict, XV, ruled during World War I. He tried but failed as a peacemaker, setting forth his Seven Points to forestall any future world wars. Neither the victorious allied leaders nor the vanquished invited Benedict XVI to attend the negotiation and ratification of the Treaty of Versailles. His public neutrality during the war had soured warring Christian European leaders on both sides. Only US President Woodrow Wilson took the pope's peace plans seriously. He adopted some of the pope's ideas as the basis for his Fourteen Point Plan submitted at the Versailles peace negotiations. The original St. Benedict was a peacemaker too.

Ratzinger as the next Benedict may intend to succeed as a peacemaker where the previous Benedict failed.

Joseph Ratzinger, the oldest Pope elected since Clement XII in 1730, was born in Marktl Am Inn, near Traunstein, Germany in 1927. He was raised in "Nazi Germany," and is said to have deserted the Nazi army at the end of WW II. It sure seems strange to have a former Nazi soldier as a Pope.

When the Cardinals elected him, they were hoping for a Pope who could bring Protestants into the Roman Catholic system. He will probably try to bring all religions into the Catholic church. John Paul II worked at that.

112. THE LAST POPE, PETRUS ROMANUS, PETER THE ROMAN

More than that, St. Malachy is supposed to have prophesied that "In extreme persecution, the seat of the Holy Roman Church will be occupied by Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations, at the term of which the city of seven hills (i.e., Rome) will be destroyed, and the formidable Judge (i.e., Christ) will judge the people."

The Judgment Seat of Christ will take place on the Day of God's Wrath, but Vatican City will probably be burned when the False Prophet moves his headquarters to Babylon.

Rev 17:15-18 says, "And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore (Mystery Babylon the Great), and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
18 And the woman (Mystery Babylon the Great) which thou sawest is that great city (i.e., Vatican City), which reigneth over the kings of the earth."

Incoming e-mail, Re: Will the Bride Be Here at Mid-Trib?

...We have spent a great deal of time on Rev 4 and 5 in our Bible study, and interpretations are challenging.

Our pastor teaches that there is no stipulation in the passage that the Elders are 12 Patriarchs of Israel and 12 Apostles of Israel. Moreover, he teaches that English translations fail to capture the precise meaning of the syntax of the passage in the original Greek.

While it may seem that the phrase 'out of every kindred, and tongue, and nation... cannot possibly refer to only twenty-four individuals; in fact, it does, because the meaning of 'out of' in this Greek passage is best translated as "from among the many...".

Our hearts & spirit hope your interpretation is correct, but our pastor has studied the original Greek scriptures for many years, and we wonder if his interpretation is actually the correct one--especially now since we appear to be within Daniel's Seventieth week and we are still here.

Thanks again for your hard work & help over the years to help us understand.

My reply

Ed is still bedfast, can sit on edge of bed after I help him sit up, but can't stand up, can't hold on to walker with his hands to stay up if someone lifts him up. His hands hurt too much. Thanks for your prayers.

Rev 5:9.10 says, "And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on (epi, on or over) the earth.

> > While it may seem that the phrase 'out of every kindred, and tongue, and nation... cannot possibly refer to only twenty-four individuals; in fact, it does, because the meaning of 'out of' in this Greek passage is best translated as "from among the many...".

However, if the 24 elders are the 12 patriarchs and the 12 apostles of Israel, they are only out of one country. The saints in Rev. 5:9 are out of "every...nation." How many nations were there, 70? Yet, there are only 24 elders.

Neither Strong's nor Thayer's gives the definition "from among the many".

Of "ek", Strong's says,
"A primary preposition denoting origin (the point whence motion or action proceeds), from, out (of place, time or cause; literally or figuratively; direct or remote): - after, among, X are, at betwixt (-yond), by (the means of), exceedingly, (+ abundantly above), for (-th), from (among, forth, up), + grudgingly, + heartily, X heavenly, X hereby, + very highly, in, . . . ly, (because, by reason) of, off (from), on, out among (from, of), over, since, X thenceforth, through, X unto, X vehemently, with (-out). Often used in composition, with the same general import; often of completion."

Of ek, Thayer's says,
"1) out of, from, by, away from
Part of Speech: preposition
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: a primary preposition denoting origin (the point whence action or motion proceeds), from, out (of place, time, or cause; literal or figurative"

It says, "And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of EVERY (pas, all, the whole) kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation".

Here, all the saints out of every nation sing the new song. In the second Rapture, only the 144,000 Israelites can sing the new song.

Rev. 14:3-5 says, "And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."

There are different ranks in the First Resurrection. 1Co 15:23 says, "But every man in his own order (tagmati, rank): Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming." Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: The Trojan Horse Threat to America

Oblivious of the Enemy within. From the horse’s mouth of one who dealt with it.

How could a backward third world nation defeat a super power? By betrayal from within and it has still not been routed out.

A REMINDER IN HISTORY FROM NORTH VIETNAM'S GENERAL VONGUYEN GIAP

General Giap was a brilliant, highly respected leader of the North Vietnam military. The following quote is from his memoirs currently found in the Vietnam war memorial in Hanoi :

'What we still don't understand is why you Americans stopped the bombing of Hanoi . You had us on the ropes. If you had pressed us a little harder, just for another day or two, we were ready to surrender! It was the same at the battle of TET. You defeated us! We knew it, and we thought you knew it.

But we were elated to notice your media was helping us. They were causing more disruption in America than we could in the battlefields. We were ready to surrender. You had won!'

General Giap has published his memoirs and confirmed what most Americans knew. The Vietnam war was not lost in Vietnam -- it was lost at home. The same slippery slope, sponsored by the US media, is currently underway. It exposes the enormous power of a Biased Media to cut out the heart and will of the American public.

A truism worthy of note: ... Do not fear the enemy,
for they can take only your life.
Fear the media,
for they will destroy your honor.

A post by Jennie on Five Doves site

Jennie (18 Jan 2011)
"RE: MARYLIN AGEE" (emphasis mine)
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/jennie118-1.htm

I am sorry I just don't agree with your view points on this matter of the Rapture Timing, so I rather not discuss this any further. You have your views, and I have mine. YSIC Jennie

I found out what Jennie believes by reading her other posts

Jennie (18 Jan 2011)
"Re: Bruce"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/jennie118-2.htm

Thank you. I have had a lot of people argue with me over this Rapture Timing, but how can anyone who is watching not see the Horsemen Loose? We are about to enter a Terrible Time by Spring by food shorting, inflation, destroyed crops. Just today I saw in the news that not only are fish and birds dying, but now OUR FOOD SOURCE. Cows, soon other animals will die. The Horsemen are loose, and I believe we are waiting for a MAJOR EARTHQUAKE that will shake the world, which I also believe the Rapture Happens. The sealing of the 144,000 in Israel is a Spiritual seal, and could be done with a blink of an eye. I personally am looking for this Major Earthquake as predicted to be next in line in the Book of Revelations. I hope the Rapture comes first, but I think it works together. It would be a great way for the dead to rise??? I am no expert, but I have been studying bible prophecy for over 10 years, it's a passion of mine. If you see the Rapture happening in another way, feel free to share? No one know for sure how or when the Rapture will happen, but working together will all of the knowledge that God has given to all of us, we might have some kind of idea. YSIC Jennie

Another post by Jennie

Jennie (17 Jan 2011)
"RE Nicole"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/jennie117-2.htm

My mother just had a vision she saw Jesus pointing people out who were Jews and dividing them into tribes. What she saw is correct. I believe that the sealing of the 144,000 Jewish men is a spiritual seal and it only takes about a moment to fulfilled that chapter. IN REV. CHAP. 7 VERSE 9 IS A MULTITUDE OF PEOPLE THAT NO MAN CAN COUNT. THAT IS THE RAPTURE, the AC hasn't come on the scene yet, so there is no way these Millions of people are Marters. THE WAY I SEE IT IS THE PALE HORSE IS COMING RIGHT NOW. I believe that the Earthquake and the sealing of the 144,000 and the Rapture are all connected together. (kind of like happens back to back). Don't quote me on that, but I have been studying the End times for over 10 years now, kind of like a passion I have. I also faithfully read and watch what is going on around the world, so by doing that, it is clearly that the horsemen are loose. I am an admirer of Dr. Owner, but not completely sure if how he sees the rapture timing is correct. We all have our own interpretation on how and when the Rapture will happen. We are only human, one day we will truly find out. The one thing I do know is that the Rapture WON'T happen on a Jewish Feast day. It's a Day of Mystery, therefore it will happen on a regular day. I have seen the stars fall from heaven in three visions over the last couple of years, so I think it might happen at night fall. Don't quote me on that either, I'm just human. One more thought, I believe the two wit. are Elijah and Enoch. Why? These two men in the Old Testament have not tasted death. Moses completed his mission on earth and died and God took him home, but Elijah and Enoch were Raptured, and therefore they were saved for the future to fulfill God's Teaching during the Tribulations. God has a purpose for them. YSIC Jennie

My comment

We do differ. I think Rev. 7:9 refers to the second Rapture instead of the first.

Another post by Jennie

Jennie (17 Jan 2011)
"Re Candice"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/jennie117-3.htm

The event you might be seeing is REV. CHAP 6, THE SIXTH SEAL A GREAT EARTHQUAKE. I BELIEVE THIS IS NEXT ON GOD'S AGENDA RIGHT AT THE SAME TIME FRAME THE RAPTURE. It will be so horrible God tells us. I saw the stars fall from heaven in Three different visions over the past couple of years. These visions pertain to the Great Earthquake. I feel it in my spirit God is coming and he is coming ASAP. YSIC Jennie

My comment

I think the sixth seal is on the Day of God's Wrath, the time of the second Rapture. Rev. 6:17 says, "For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

Also found on Five Doves site

Mary Adams (19 Jan 2011)
"A seed in a piece of pie"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/marya119.htm

Dear Doves,
Can I say something that perhaps some of you will not like at all?

It bothers me when when 5 Doves begins to be beseiged with negative letters condemning others with whom they do not agree. I assumed 5 Doves would be a focus on the soon coming of our Lord.

While I do not agree with others on some things, yet I remember something I was taught a long time ago:
If you order a lucious piece of lemon pie but you find an unwanted seed left in it, do not throw the pie away. Simply remove the seed and keep on eating. For if we were to examine that piece of pie through an electron microscope (God's eyes) no telling what we might find in it that we missed.

So if you find an unwanted seed in what I just wrote, just put it aside and please accept whatever I've tried to say that's good.

Maybe some of it will be God talking.
MARY E. ADAMS

Also Found on Five Doves

Judy Morford (20 Jan 2011)
"RE: Insensitive Words on 5 Doves"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/judym120.htm

Dear John and Doves,
Mary, I fully support your statement, cautioning Doves against shifting their focus to other Doves, in a personal attack.

I was personally hurt by the comments directed towards Marilyn Agee by a person who obviously knew little of Marilyn. Just for added information, Marilyn is a serious scholar appointed by God to publish her work on the Internet. Some of us have come to know her as a person through communications directly. She is a woman of great character, now in her eighties and caring for her beloved bed bound husband who suffers from both Parkinson's and diabetes. Her own health is significantly challenging. She is worthy of respect and honor, whether or not your personal point of view matches the possibilities she offers. She is not unfeeling when words are aimed like arrows at her, nor is the Lord pleased, nor am I and the others who respect this woman.

Thanks again, John for all you do. Surely, it is soon! Humbly awaiting the sovereign Lord's return, Judy M.

Also Found on Five Doves

Rene (21 Jan 2011)
"re: Judy Morford & Marilyn Agee"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/rene121-1.htm

I agree whole-heartedly with Judy's post! Marilyn is a wonderful and sincere Christian lady and I have been reading her website and been blessed by it for many years now! Rene

Also Found on Five Doves

Iracema Reis (21 Jan 2011)
"About Marilyn Agee"
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/jan2011/iracemar121.htm

Dear John and Doves,
I post very rarely but I read the messages posted here every day and I totally agree with Judy Moreford.

I also know Marilyn Agee personally - she really is a wonderful person, anointed by the Lord to be a light unto the world. She is a very humble person and yet, she is more knowledgeable than most self-proclaimed (and real) Bible scholars I know!

Having different ideas is no excuse for rudeness and callousness. People don't have to agree on everything and Marilyn is the first to make it clear that we should all agree to disagree. When she posts she's not trying to impose her findings on anybody - she is just sharing, out of the goodness of her heart and her love for Christ so that we can all be a little more enriched in our own personal searches.

And for all I know, she's always been open to debate, not arguing, so people don't really have to 'dismiss' her like she is just being a mere nuisance! She should be treated with all the dignity and respect that she deserves.

Thank you, John, for all the hard work you put into this site! YSIC,
Iracema Reis

My reply

My dear friends, Thank you for your support. My Goodness, I must have hit the Jackpot and didn't know it. It is sure nice to be appreciated.

I have worked hard ever since at least 1960, 51 years now, to try to understand as much of the Bible as I possibly can. The more we know about the whole Bible, the more we can dig out of one passage. It all works together. Clues are anywhere and everywhere. I can easily tell that God wrote the Bible, whoever his scribe was at the time. There are so many layers of information, we'll never dig them all out. That keeps us from getting tired of studying it. I imagine that when we get to heaven, we will find out all kinds of things we missed.

God packed all that information into one small book we can carry around. If man alone tried to convey that much information, the books would probably need a warehouse to store them. The Lord knows how to cover a lot of ground in a few words.

The prophets themselves did not understand everything they were priviledged to write by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit. They searched like we do to put two and two together to figure it all out.

1Peter 1:10-12 reflects that. It says, "Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: 11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. 12 Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into."

When I'm answering posts and emails, I am just telling it as I see it, and if I find proof that it is different from what I thought, I change my view. I'm not trying to cram anything down anyone's throat. We are all free to believe as we see fit, and the Lord will guide us as we go.

However, I do love to discuss different views back and forth if the other person likes to also. I respect other viewpoints. I think we all profit by discussing things back and forth. No one knows it all, and it seems that the Lord gives insight into certain areas to different people. I think we can all learn more if we put our heads together, and I love to learn something new. That makes my day. Agape

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