Pro and Con 1107

Posted 3-20-04

Incoming email, Re: Shroud of Turin

(It is interesting to note that the negative of the shroud of Turin shows either WHITE OR LIGHT BLOND HAIR, and John in Rev. 1:14 says in regards to Jesus," His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire." Please read the paragraph in the article about the color of the hair and see what other exciting fact that this same paragraph shows.)

My reply

Thanks much. I'd hate to miss these three interesting articles. I also hope to see part 4, to be published 3-18-04. Excerpts from parts 1-3 are below.

To me, instead of seeing "the image of the lifeless body," as Pope Pius XII said, it seems to be the flash image of life returned to the body. Dr. Gilbert Lavoie noted that "the shadows of the face and the fall of the hair indicate that the man was upright and suspended when the image was made." If Jesus stood up before the image was made, wouldn't his feet have changed position?....

I think the first view we get of Jesus after the Rapture, we will see him as in Rev. 1.12-16. Verse 14 says, "His head and his hairs were WHITE LIKE WOOL, AS WHITE AS SNOW; and his eyes were as a flame of fire."

"Pope John XXIII declared, "Digitus Dei est hic" ("The finger of God is here". That reminds me that Isa. 52:5,6,10 says, "...saith the LORD (YHVH, Yahweh); and my name continually every day is blasphemed (maybe because the Jews say HASHEM or ADONAI instead of YAHWEH). Therefore my people shall know MY NAME: therefore they shall know in that day that I (YHVH, Yahweh) AM HE (YHVH of hosts, the redeemer, Isa. 44:6, Yeshua) that doth speak (the Son of God is the one that speaks and interacts with mankind): behold, it is I...The LORD (YHVH, Yahweh) hath made bare HIS HOLY ARM in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation (yeshuwah, i.e., Yeshua/Jesus) of our God." Isa. 53:1,2,3,5 says, "Who hath believed our report? and to whom is THE ARM OF THE LORD revealed? For HE (Yeshua) shall grow up before him (YHVH, Yahweh) as a tender plant, and as a root out of dry ground...He is despised and rejected...But he (Yeshua) was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed."
The Shroud of Turin (Part 1), By Fr. William P. Saunders, 2/26/04

...St. William of York Parish is hosting a special exhibit on the Shroud of Turin....

Pope Pius XII stated, "A precious treasure, the Holy Shroud, which displays, both to move and comfort us, the image of the lifeless body and tortured face of Christ." And Pope John XXIII declared, "Digitus Dei est hic" ("The finger of God is here").

...As Cardinal Saldarini of Turin stated, "It’s not Christ, but something that brings us back to him. Salvation is not in the Shroud, even if it truly wrapped the martyred body of Jesus, even if it was mysteriously given by God to His Church. Salvation is that which is given to us by Christ" (Columbia, June 1998)....

The real scientific investigation into the Shroud began in May, 1898, when Secundo Pia photographed the Shroud. When he was developing the film plate, he discovered that the negative image is actually the positive, and vice versa: Basically, when one looks at the Shroud with the naked eye, he sees a light yellow-brownish figure of a man; but when one looks at a photographic black and white negative, he can see the image in greater detail....
Scientific History of the Shroud (Part 2)
By Fr. William P. Saunders, 3-4-04

...While I personally believe that the Shroud is authentic, the Church has not declared it so, and therefore, this article will refer to the image of the Shroud as that of an anonymous "man" rather than our Lord Jesus Christ; yet, the parallels between the two will be noted.

Here is a brief overview of the major scientific findings: The Shroud is a long, linen sheet about 4.36 meters long by 1.1 meters wide. Jesus would have been laid down on top of the Shroud, and then it would have been folded over Him. Interestingly, the frontal image is a little short, and the cloth covers only part of the right foot....

Egyptian linen wrappings on mummies at least 4000 years old survive to this day, which means the Shroud could have been produced at the time of Christ.

The weave is a herringbone pattern with the twist of the yarn being a "z" twist (meaning the spindle was rotated clockwise). The cloth also has a high thread count which produced a fine cloth.... Moreover, cotton fibers particular to the kind of cotton found in Palestine are also present in the linen cloth....

Dr. Max Frei of the University of Zurich and founder of the Zurich Criminal Police’s Scientific Service found...pollen from halophytes, plants typical of the desert regions around the Jordan Valley and adapted to live in the soils with the high salt content found ALMOST EXCLUSIVELY around the Dead Sea area....

Interestingly, the nail at the wrist would have penetrated a nerve and caused the thumb to snap into the palm. The thumbs of the man in the Shroud are hidden due to this nailing.

The Shroud does show a wound to the right side, as where the soldier’s lance would have pierced the heart of our Lord. The spear passed through the fifth and sixth ribs, and pierced the pericardium and the right auricle, causing the flow of blood and pericardial fluid....

Clearly, the victim was whipped very methodically, and over 120 wound sites are present.

The blood is definitely human blood. The STURP team determined that the stains were human blood of the AB group. This finding has been corroborated by others: Professor Pierluigi Baima Bollone, Professor of Medicine at the University of Turin, reported in 1978 that the blood stains were indeed human blood with traces of aloes and myrrh and belonging to the group AB. French geneticist Professor Jerome Lejeune also concluded that the blood sample he obtained was human hemoglobin....
The Continuing Mystery of the Shroud (Part 3)
By Fr. William P. Saunders, 3/11/04

...In 1979, Jesuit Father Francis L. Filas of the Loyola University of Chicago, using the STURP research, observed on the right eyelid of the man four letters "UCAI" which formed a crown around the crook of an augur’s staff; this image corresponds to the symbol on a small COIN KNOWN AS THE DILEPTON LITUUS STRUCK IN 29 AD during the procuratorship of Pontius Pilate (26-36). The coin covering the left eye was later identified by Professors Bollone and Balossino as THE LEPTON SIMPULUM, WHICH ALSO WAS STRUCK IN 29 AD. The ancient Jews used coins to hold down the eyelids. Also, Father Filas noted that later Byzantine coinage was engraved with an image of Christ Pantocrator which bore a striking resemblance to the facial image of the shroud, which would attest to the shroud’s presence in Constantinople.

In 1978, Piero Ugolotti reported that he had detected barely visible traces of letters and words in Greek, Latin and Hebrew near the face on the shroud, which were corroborated by philologist Aldo Marastoni of the Catholic University of Milan. In 1995, scientists with the Paris Institut d’Optique also reported FINDING LETTERS AND WORDS ON THE SIDES OF THE FACIAL IMAGE on the shroud. An example would be In Necem, an abbreviation of the Latin death phrase, In Necem Ibis ("You will go to death"), Nazarennus ("Nazarene") and Pezo which means "to accomplish" in archaic Greek but in the sense of "celebrating a sacrifice."

The image also has unique, three-dimensional information encoded in it....

The photographs of the shroud also seem to be like X-rays with the images of bones visible. Dr. Michael Blunt, Challis Professor of Anatomy at the University of Sydney, noted that in the hands one can see metacarpal bones and three phalange bones of each finger. Professor Alan Whanger of Duke University noted that the skull is visible.

Dr. Gilbert Lavoie in his Unlocking the Secrets of the Shroud presented another intriguing discovery. The negative image of the shroud as compared with the negative images of photography reveals that the man in question had either WHITE OR LIGHT BLOND HAIR. HE NOTED ANOTHER PECULIARITY: THE SHADOWS OF THE FACE AND THE FALL OF THE HAIR INDICATE THAT THE MAN WAS UPRIGHT AND SUSPENDED WHEN THE IMAGE WAS MADE, WHILE THE BLOOD MARKS INDICATE THE MAN WAS IN THE SUPINE POSITION ON TOP OF THE CLOTH WITH THE REST FOLDED OVER HIM. Dr. Lavoie concluded that this upright image was made after the blood had stained the cloth: "This finding is intellectually exciting to anyone who contemplates the possibility that THIS IMAGE REFLECTS THE MOMENT OF THE RESURRECTION" (p. 182)....


John 20:1-10

(Ill. The oriental custom of the napkin. When a man with servants was eating a meal, he would often use his napkin to signal them during the course of the meal. If he left the table and wadded his napkin up, it meant that he was finished and would not be back. If, however, he neatly folded the napkin, it told his servants that he was stepping away for a moment, but he would be back! Jesus was telling His disciples, "I may be out of your sight right now, but I'll be right back!" When Peter and John arrived at the tomb, they feared the worst. Perhaps they thought robbers had come, or that the Jews had taken His body away. Even Mary missed the napkin and supposed the gardener had moved the body of the Lord, John 20:15. Yet, John, who had been raised with servants, Mark 1:20, probably knew this custom and quickly grasped the meaning, v. 8.)

My comments

The actual face cloth may be the Sudarium of Oviedo. Both the Sudarium, Latin for face cloth, and the Shroud of Turin have type AB bloodstains on them.
"Endtime News: Discerning the Signs of the Times" endtime/feature.php3?cid=1&id=238

(Re: the Shroud of Turin:)
...Furthermore, forensic evidence confirms that the red stains are blood, type AB, and that this blood has elevated levels of bilirubin, presumably caused by the trauma of scourging. Drs. John Heller of the New England Institute and Alan Adler of Western Connecticut State ran a series of blood studies. Pathologists confirmed their work.

Another historical cloth, the Sudarium of Oviedo, known from the first century as being the face cloth of the entombed Christ, also contains bloodstains--type AB....
"Botanist Uses Pollen to Place Shroud of Turin in Mideast at Earlier Date"
By Adelle M. Banks

...Danin said pollen grains of the thistle Gundelia tournefortii were found on both the shroud and the cloth housed in Oviedo. He called them "very hard evidence."

"This plant is growing only in the near East," he said. "It is not growing in Spain. It is not growing in Europe. It is from Middle Eastern origin." The plant, which continues to bloom to this day, blossoms at a certain time of year. "The time of the formulation of the image and the position of pollen on the shroud due to the indicator plants is March/April," he said. "This is a physical and biological indicator, not biblical."

A New Port Richey, Fla. writer who has studied the shroud says the two specific months named in Danin's research are "very significant." John C. Iannone, author of "The Mystery of the Shroud of Turin: New Scientific Evidence" (Alba House, NY 1998) said the finding makes the shroud "consistent with the time of the Passover and the Crucifixion."...

Both the Sudarium and the shroud appear to carry type AB blood stains, and the stains are in a similar pattern, Dr. Danin said. "There is no way that similar patterns of blood stains, probably of the identical blood type, with the same type of pollen grains could not be synchronic, covering the same body."...

Danin identified a high density of pollen of the tumbleweed Gundelia tournefortii. The analysis also found the beancaper. The two species coexist in a limited area, Danin said. “This combination of flowers can be found in only one region of the world,” he said. “The evidence clearly points to a floral grouping from the area surrounding Jerusalem.”...

The flowers placed next to the shroud bloom only an hour a day, so they were picked sometime between 3 and 4 p.m. before being placed next to the body, Danin said. Christ is believed to have died late in the day, so his body would have been prepared shortly after....
by Luigi FOSSATI

...The event that went down in history was not the Exhibition's unusual duration, from May 25 to June 2, 1898, but the taking of the first photograph of the Holy Cloth. The cloth was displayed in a large and artistic frame with the consequent discovery that the imprints that could be seen on it were a perfect negative.

The fortunate photographer, the lawyer Secondo Pia, noticed during the development of the large glass plates (cm 50 x cm 60) that the image on the photographic negative appeared as a perfect positive of a Man composed solemnly in death. He was very amazed at his discovery but arrived at the only conclusion that an expert photographer could draw: if the image on the plate appears as a perfect positive, then the actual object itself must likewise be a perfect negative....

(Secondo Pia wrote:) Apart from what I declared about the normal development procedure I followed, the observation of the "overexposure" is very clearly belied by the first original photograph realized for trial and of which I send a copy to your Lordship. In this photograph, besides the Holy Shroud, is also reproduced the frame and a part of the altar on which the Relic was exposed. Now it is evident that if an "overexposure" of the plate occurred, then the two angels set at its sides would have appeared in "positive" like the Holy Shroud, that is white and therefore appearing black after the printing. It is not possible to conclude that the "overexposure" occurred only in a part of the photographic plate.

Remarks On The Aramaic Of The James Ossuary

The short phrase ahuy d'Yeshua in the James Ossuary
is perfectly acceptable Aramaic for the first century CE.
By Edward M. Cook, November 2003

...In summation, the short phrase ahuy d'Yeshua in the James Ossuary is perfectly acceptable Aramaic for the first century CE. Its morphology and its syntax are consistent with expected developments in Aramaic and are paralleled by other occurrences in other texts from the same period or earlier.

Is the James Ossuary authentic? Maybe, maybe not. But any final answer will have to come on non-linguistic grounds.

Incoming email, Re: Christian Universalism True Biblical Christianity

This is the Church I was "born again" into.. If it's not the One that Christ set up, I don't want any part of it. But I believe that Christ is the Head of this True Church:

This was written by the Reverend Ken Allen, from whom I received my "reverendship" about five years ago. I believe that Christian Universalism is the "mystery" hinted at by Jesus in parables: [Mat 13:11-13] and later spelled out and spoken of by Paul in Rom 11:25, 16:25: "Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, 26) But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandments of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:"

And 1 Cor 2:7; 4:1; Eph 1:9, 3:3,4; 3:9 [the "fellowship" of the mystery], 6:19; Col. 1:26-28, 2:2, 4:3; 1 Tim 3:9 and 3:16

I like that term, "fellowship" of the mystery, because when God is "all in all," [1 Cor 15:28] heaven will truly be Heaven! Since God is Agape love and all people will have THIS God of Agape love dwelling in them. ["For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure," [Phil 2:13] All of us will be forgiven, and we will forgive all! No one will hold back forgiveness from anyone else. What fellowship!! Granted, it may take some people a few "aions" to get to this point! They know that God commands us to forgive OUR enemies. They just CANNOT BELIEVE that God Himself forgives His enemies! [Especially when they are nailing Him to the cross!] To me, that was the high point of Mel Gibson's, "The Passion ["Suffering"-- archaic Latin form, "passus"] of the Christ." If He forgave people nailing Him to the cross, why can't He forgive everyone? Isn't it possible that He even forgave Judas Iscariot at that time, with those mighty words? Remember, Jesus is Jehovah Elohim. He is the same God as "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth..." [Genesis 1:1] If you look up the God of Genesis 1:1 in your Concordance, you will find it means "Elohim." Then in Colossians 1:16 you find that Jesus created all things. The next verse says that "He is before all things, and by him all things exist." That means Jesus is Elohim. Countless verses show that He is Jehovah also. Can we then suppose His Words that brought forth Lazarus from the grave, had no effect when He asked His Father, "Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do!" Were those words just for the soldiers there, or did His dying for our sins and the "sin of the whole world" [John 1:29] fill the atmosphere of this world from that cross!!! I believe this even took care of the sin that was "unforgiveable" up to that point!

That is Universal Salvation ---to be played out and experienced in this "aion" and in the coming "aions!"

Check this out. See if this is a Church you might like to join.

My reply

> > I believe that Christian Universalism is the "mystery" hinted at by Jesus in parables:

I think the mystery is the church, the Body of Christ, made up of both Jews and Gentiles that have Christ in them.

Col 1:25-27 says, "I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God; Even THE MYSTERY which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints: To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of THIS MYSTERY among the Gentiles; WHICH IS CHRIST IN YOU, the hope of glory."

Eph. 3:3-6 is very important. Paul said, "by revelation HE MADE KNOWN UNTO ME THE MYSTERY [musterion, mystery or secret]; (as I wrote afore in few words, Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in THE MYSTERY OF CHRIST) WHICH IN OTHER AGES WAS NOT MADE KNOWN UNTO THE SONS OF MEN, AS IT IS NOW REVEALED UNTO HIS HOLY APOSTLES AND PROPHETS BY THE SPIRIT; THAT THE GENTILES SHOULD BE FELLOWHEIRS, AND OF THE SAME BODY, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel."

There is another secret, the mystery of God. Col 2:3-10 says, "That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of THE MYSTERY OF GOD, AND OF THE FATHER, AND OF CHRIST; IN WHOM ARE HID ALL THE TREASURES OF WISDOM AND KNOWLEDGE....As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him...FOR IN HIM DWELLETH ALL THE FULNESS OF THE GODHEAD BODILY. And ye are complete in him." Agape

This ties in with Gen. 6:1-4. Before Noah was saved, and before Lot was saved, similar sins brought on judgment. It will repeat in our days, and the third time will be worse than when an asteroid hit Sodom. That time split the Earth from Turkey to Lake Nyassa in Africa. What kind of split in the Earth will the asteroids of Rev. 8:8 and 10 cause? Will it be called the Second Great Rift Valley?

Joel 3:2 says, “I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.”

Jehoshaphat means whom Jehovah judges.

In Noah's day, man was given 120 years, then the Flood came. "Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished" (II Peter 3:6).

In Lot's day, we read, "And the men said unto Lot, Hast thou here any besides? son in law, and thy sons, and thy daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of this place: For we will destroy this place, because the cry of them is waxen great before the face of the LORD; and the LORD hath sent us to destroy it...Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven" (Gen. 19:12,13,24).

This time, II Peter 3:7 tells us that "the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

The Current Drive for One World Government

by J. R. Church

In 1994, an economic summit was held in Miami, Florida, which could cause Americans to lose control of their own destiny. Proponents of FTAA (Free Trade Area of the Americas) say it will improve our economy. But opponents say we will lose our constitutional government and become enslaved to a world bureaucracy.

The Current Drive for One World Government
In 1994, an economic summit was held in Miami, Florida, which could cause Americans to lose control of their own destiny. At that time, a proposal was set forth to establish free trade throughout the western hemisphere. It was called "Free Trade Area of the Americas" (FTAA). Proponents called it "a bold move to foster economic progress, enhance domestic prosperity, and raise living standards."

The goal is to open the borders for "free trade" all the way from Canada in the North, to Argentina in the South, using a single currency. However, opponents say that the proposal is shrouded in deception and misrepresentation. Upon close examination, it was learned that the real objective is to consolidate power, not to expand prosperity.

The FTAA would bring all of the nations in this hemisphere, especially the United States, under the control of a new "regional authority," having none of the checks and balances of our constitution. To accomplish this globalist goal for political control, a step-by-step plan would dismantle every government in favor of a single union, similar to the current move toward the European Union.

The ultimate goal is to establish ten of these regional power blocks around the world. The uniting of all nations in Europe is simply the prototype for uniting North and South America, Africa, the Middle East, the Far East, etc., until the United Nations goal for dividing up the world into ten political/economic regions (ten kingdoms) is achieved....

Incoming email, Re: the Trinity

Peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Here are 2 interesting passages that may help you convince those that reject the Trinity and Lord Jesus Christ, our God and Saviour. I do not know if you have used these before. Thanks for your other insights.

Isaiah 6:2-3: Above it stood the seraphims: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, and with twain he covered his feet, and with twain he did fly. And one cried unto another, and said, Holy, holy, holy, is the LORD of hosts: the whole earth is full of his glory.

Why Holy 3 times? Because God is a Trinity. Agian the same beings cry:

Revelation 4:8: And the four beasts had each of them six wings about him; and they were full of eyes within: and they rest not day and night, saying, Holy, holy, holy, LORD God Almighty, which was, and is, and is to come.

Of course Gen 1:26-27 is definitive.

Genesis 1:26-27: And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Who is God talking to in verse 26? Can't be the angles or any other than God, because in verse 27 it states that God created man. Anyone that cannot explain verse 26 is blinded. Thanks and may the Grace of God be with you,

My reply

Thanks. When God, the three in one, created Adam in his image, Adam turned out to be a three in one himself. He was body, soul and spirit.

I Cor. 15:49 says, "as we have borne the image of the earthy (Adam), we shall also bear the image of the heavenly" (the second Adam, "the Lord from heaven," v. 47).

I John 3:2 says, "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." Agape If you go to this site, you will find a picture of the sudarium. --- The Sudarium of Oviedo: Its History and Relationship to the Shroud of Turin Mark Guscin, B.A. M.Phil. ...Finally, the very fact that the cloth was kept at all is a sign of its authenticity, as it has no artistic or monetary value at all. All the studies carried out so far point in one direction, with nothing to suggest the contrary the sudarium was used to cover the head of the dead body of Jesus of Nazareth from when he was taken down from the cross until he was buried.... The thorn wounds on the nape of the neck also coincide perfectly with the bloodstains on the Shroud. Dr. Alan Whanger applied the Polarized Image Overlay Technique to the sudarium, comparing it to the image and bloodstains on the Shroud. The frontal stains on the sudarium show seventy points of coincidence with the Shroud, and the rear side shows fifty. The only possible conclusion is that the Oviedo sudarium covered the same face as the Turin Shroud....

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