Pro and Con 1195

Posted 4-10-05

Incoming e-mail, Re: Saturn--the third heaven? P/C 1187 and 1192

...I have enjoyed sharing your updates to your Home Page(s) with those whom I am able to influence regarding "end times". In my neck of the woods (brush) it seems the earthly church is asleep regarding biblical prophecy. My concern is that the great delusion is already upon the world. They see the signs but the mostly cannot discern them. Yes, as for dates on Ascension or Pentecost, I cannot consider the Greco-roman calendar or the earthly churches established dates for these events. One of my greatest puzzlement is why the church desires to remain so mired in traditions of a Judeo-free religion. Teaching outside of their box is difficult indeed. The question always persists, "Is it Satan clouding the big picture, man's own arrogance, or The LORD veiling His plans from the unrighteous? Of course I always revert to the first and blame Satan on all the confusion when the answer is all three....
Your brother in-Christ,

P.S. I sincerely meant everything I have said in my previous e-mail. Your works in my opinion are above all the Eschatologists bar none. After all few hold to the position of a duel two (pre and post) tribulational Raptures when they know or strongly suspect of both Raptures. They haven't the guts to preach/teach outside of the traditional box which they view for fear of ridicule and offense. As a result of their fears, many will miss the pre-tribulational Rapture as result of not overcoming and transforming from carnal to spiritual (conversion) due to sin and a real desire to have a personal relationship with a Living God, Named Jesus, The Christ. Most only have a form of religion and try on the outside to act spiritual when in reality, they are spiritually dead. Time will tell of my narrow view of the whole.

My reply

> > ...I sincerely meant everything I have said in my previous e-mail.

You are so kind. Thanks much. May God bless you richly. Agape

Incoming email, Re: the sun in Aries, is it the beginning of the Hebrew Sacred calendar?

From: Cindy Busch
Hi John, Marilyn and Doves,

I’m trying to clarify something, does the Hebrew sacred calendar year begin this year on April 23, 2005 (Nisan 14 the PASSOVER)? If it does shouldn’t it be called Nisan 1?

Re: On April 23, 2005, (Nisan 14, 5765), the Sun will be in Aries.

Josephus said that the Sun was in Aries on Nisan 14. and I knew from my studies that the Hebrew Sacred Year started when the Sun was in Aries.. . . .

. . .Josephus in Antiquities of the Jews says the Passover was sacrificed “in the sign of Aries,” the “Lamb,” at the season when Israel came out of Egypt. He wrote, “. . . On the fourteenth day of the lunar month, when the sun is in ARIES, (for in this month it was that we were delivered from bondage under the Egyptians), the law ordained that we should every year slay that sacrifice which . . . was called the PASSOVER” (Ant., bk.3, 10, 5). . . .

Just trying to understand. God’s richest blessings to you

My reply

> > the sun in Aries, is it the beginning of the Hebrew Sacred calendar?

It was in 30 AD. It is not at the present time.

> > > Josephus said that the Sun was in Aries on Nisan 14. and I knew from my studies that the Hebrew Sacred Year started when the Sun was in Aries

Sorry, I should have qualified that so it couldn't be misunderstood. In 30 AD the Sun was in Aries, both on Nisan 1, 3790 (March 25) and on Passover, Nisan 14, 3790 (April 7). The Sun is not quite to Aries yet on Nisan 1 now. However, the Sun is in Aries on Passover, Nisan 14 (April 23, 2005), as Josephus said it was in those days. Agape

The Jewish Hebrew Calendar

Yom Yerushalayim - Day of Jerusalem - Iyar 28 - June 6, 2005

...Explanation of the calendar cycle

The Hebrew calendar is a lunar calendar based on 19-year cycles. The following sections explain the principles of this calendar.

The Torah (Old Testament) inscribes to follow the lunar calendar, which contains exactly 29 days, 12 hours, 44 min, 3 1/3 seconds.

July 21, 1969, a retro reflector array left on the Moon by Apollo 14 astronauts. A 2-foot wide panel studded with 100 mirrors pointing at Earth. Lunar laser ranging works by firing pulses of laser light at reflectors on the Moon's surface and catching the returning photons.

A laser pulse shoots out of a telescope on Earth, crosses the Earth-moon divide, and hits the array. Because the mirrors are "corner-cube reflectors," they send the pulse straight back where it came from.

It able them to track exactly a full mouth cycle. The results came to be exactly 29 days, 12 hours, 44 min, 3 1/3 seconds. God most likely know what he was talking about....

The Biblical date of creation is used as the basis for the Hebrew calendar. Reverse calculation gives the time of the first new moon of Year 1 as 5 hours and 204 parts from the beginning of the second day of the week (Monday). This date corresponds to October 7, 3761 BCE, using the Julian (not Gregorian) calendar. For later arithmetic convenience, we will define the preceding Sabbath as day number 0, so that this date, 1 Tishrei of Year 1, is day number 2....

A year in theHebrew calendar is normally twelve months: Tishrei, Cheshvan, Kislev, Tevet, Sh'vat, Adar, Nisan, Iyar, Sivan, Tammuz, Av, and Elul. An extra month (Adar is replaced with Adar I and Adar II) is intercalated in seven of every nineteen years (years 3, 6, 8, 11, 14, 17, and 19). Every 19-year cycle thus contains 235 months. These two cycles of years and months are so close that they diverge at the rate of only 4.5 days every 1000 years....

Besides Rosh Hashanah being the Jewish New Year, there are some other new years within Judaism. Such as the 15 of Shevat: well known as Tu B'shevat. - The New Year for trees, when fruit tithes should be brought.

The first of Nisan: is the New Year for Kings. Nisan is considered the first month, although it occurs 6 or 7 months after the start of the calendar year. And at last the first of Elul: New Year for Animal Tithes (Taxes).

My comments

That's interesting. If the Rapture takes place on June 4 (Ascension Day), we might be celebrating the Day of Jerusalem in New Jerusalem on June 6.

On the date of creation. Maybe they got tired of calculating the NYD (New Year Day) and stopped Oct. 7, 3761, declaring that the date of creation. There is no way that I can see that they got that date out of the information given us in the Bible. I worked on Bible Chronology for a long time, and for the day God rested and this "kosmos" began operating, I got Tishri 1, 283 BJE (before Jewish Era), BC 4044.

Incoming e-mail, Re: Tribulation Pope

I would like to know your thoughts on the current events going on in Rome. With the death of Pope John Paul II, it opens the door for the conclave of cardinals to elect a new pope. I've read a little about the prophecy of St. Malachi and the future popes' successions and it would appear that there were two more left after John Paul's death. Could the next elected Pope be raptured and the final and last elected be the Tribulation Pope? With the deaths of Pope John Paul II and Yasser Arafat and with the future departure from office of UN Secretary General Kofi Annan, (his resignation I mean), this is certainly setting the stage for the antichrist to appear on the world scene. Thanks for your reply and God Bless you and your family.

My reply

> > it would appear that there were two more left after John Paul's death

I thought it was one, but I don't pay a lot of attention to things like that. I go by the Bible.

> > Could the next elected Pope be raptured and the final and last elected be the Tribulation Pope?

Christ will be revealed to believers at the Rapture, which will take place "quickly." At that time, I think the Pontifex Maximus that is to be the first beast of Rev. 13 will already be in office. I think we will know who the first beast is, but will not know who the second beast will be.

The setting. "The Revelation of Jesus Christ" is written as if the Rapture were at hand. It is "at hand" in both the first and last chapters. Rev. 1:1-3 (KJV) says, "THE REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST (the Rapture) which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants (believers) THINGS (coming at the Rapture) WHICH MUST SHORTLY (tachos, QUICKLY) COME TO PASS; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things (fhe first is the Rapture) which are written therein: for THE TIME (i.e., of the Rapture) IS AT HAND."

Rev. 1:1 (ALT, Analytical Literal Translation) says, ["The] revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave to Him to show to His slaves what [things are] NECESSARY TO OCCUR WITH QUICKNESS" (i.e., the Rapture). Rev. 1:1 (YLT) A revelation of Jesus Christ, that God gave to him, to shew to his servants (believers) what THINGS it behoveth TO COME TO PASS QUICKLY" (the Rapture). Rev 1:3 (Weymouth) says, "Blessed is he who reads and blessed are those who listen to the words of this prophecy and LAY TO HEART WHAT IS WRITTEN IN IT; FOR THE TIME FOR ITS FULFILLMENT IS NOW CLOSE AT HAND."

Rev. 22:10 (KJV) says, "And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for THE TIME (i.e., of the Rapture) IS AT HAND." In Rev. 22:20 (KJV), Jesus signs off with, "Surely I come QUICKLY. Amen." He comes quickly at the Rapture.

This word is specifically given to the Philadelphian church group that has heaven's "open door" set before them (Rev. 3:8), but is also for the rest of the believers in the churches. In Rev. 3:11-13 (KJV) Jesus said, "Behold, I COME QUICKLY: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name. He that hath an ear, let him HEAR WHAT THE SPIRIT SAITH UNTO THE CHURCHES."

In Rev 1:19, Jesus said, "Write the things which thou hast seen (before the Rapture), and the things which ARE (at the time of the Rapture), and the things which shall be hereafter" (after the Rapture).

Rev 17 is like a film clip shot at the time of the Rapture. When the 10 kings "have received NO KINGDOM AS YET," the first "beast" of Rev. 13 is already in office.

Rev. 17:12-14 says, "the ten horns which thou sawest are (present tense) ten kings, which have received NO KINGDOM AS YET; but receive power as kings one hour with THE BEAST (the first one). These have one mind, and shall (in the future) give their power and strength unto the beast. These shall (in the future) make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is (present tense) Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they (the Bride of Christ) that ARE WITH HIM (i.e., those that are with Him in Heaven at the Rapture) are CALLED (past tense), AND CHOSEN (at the Rapture, already past), AND FAITHFUL" (i.e., wise virgins wearing white robes).

Look at the important verse 10. It says, "And there are seven kings (the Pontifex Maximus' of the empires Babel I, Babylon II, Media-Persia, Greece, Rome, Ecclesiastical Rome and Babylon III): five are fallen (Babel I, Babylon II, Media-Persia, Greece, Rome), and ONE IS (the Pontifex Maximus heading up Ecclesiastical Rome at the Rapture), and THE OTHER ("ANOTHER beast" of Rev. 13:11) is not yet come (he comes Mid-Trib); and when he cometh, he must continue a short space." The 2nd half of the Tribulation, called the Great Tribulation, is to be shortened.

Those 7 kings are the seven heads of the great red dragon. The beast of Rev. 13:3-10 is the 6th head. "ANOTHER beast" of Rev. 13:11-18 ("ANOTHER little horn" of Dan. 7:8) is the 7th head, THE SATAN-POSSESSED ANTICHRIST. Isa 9:15 says, "The ancient and honourable (i.e., the Tribulation Pope), he is the head (the 6th); and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail" (because Satan, the tail of the great red dragon, enters into him).

Rev 17:8 says, "The beast that thou sawest (the great red dragon) was (in Judas Iscariot, the 1st son of perdition), and is not (in man at the Rapture); and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit (Mid-Trib, Rev. 12:9), and go into perdition (the 2nd son of perdition, the False Prophet): and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was (in man), and is not (in man at the Rapture), and yet is" (exists).

Rev. 22:6,7 says, "These sayings are faithful and true: and the Lord God of the holy prophets sent his angel to shew unto his servants (believers) the things which must SHORTLY be done. Behold, I come QUICKLY (at the Rapture): blessed is he that keepeth the sayings of the prophecy of this book."

Blessed is he that is called and chosen and faithful at the Rapture. Ascension day, June 4, is looking better all the time. I expect to have a new Pope before that day. God bless you and yours. Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: The Lekarev Report

...Mazuz Draws Wrath with Statement: "UN Above Israeli Law"...
"The UN is building illegally in Maalot Dafna in Jerusalem, without having received any permit or authorization from the Jerusalem Municipality, and in blatant violation of the laws of the State of Israel. Despite my many queries on this issue, and despite the duly-issued stop-work orders, the UN has continued to act as it pleases, all because of the judicial immunity granted it by the State of Israel."...

From 5 Doves site, "Hal Lindsey on the Pope"

Jim Bramlett (6 Apr 2005)

...Luther, a scholar and teacher in the original Greek New Testament in a Catholic Seminary, spent a long period of agony trying to get peace for his sense of guilt that greatly tormented his soul.

His elders urged him to do a pilgrimage to Rome, thinking this would give his conscience assurance. While there, Luther did a “novena” in which he crawled for more than a mile on his knees over cobble stoned streets to the Church of John the Lateran. As he climbed the steps of the Church on bloody knees, he had a vision. He said that he saw across the sky as written in fire, “The Just shall live by faith” a quote from Romans 1:17.

Then there rushed into his mind the many Scriptures he knew from memory that testified to the fact that man can do nothing to earn God’s forgiveness and be made righteous....

My reply

About Martin Luther's vision, I had no idea he saw a vision. I knew of Constantine's vision, but not Martin Luther's. Wonder how I missed that? I need a reference to back that up.

Incoming e-mail, Re: Jewish calender, ascension date

Hello Mrs. Agee - A comment and question. I have heard several pastors make the point that Jesus ascended eight days before pentecost. Their reasoning is that He died on passover which is 50 days before pentecost. Jesus rose the thrid day after passover and was on the earth 40 days before ascending, which works out to ascension being 8 days before pentecost (using inclusive reckoning). The 8th day represents the start of a new order.

My question concerns the Jewish calendar, which gives the current year as 5765. I have seen quite a few chronologies based on the Old Testament, but never one which gives creation as early as 5765 years ago. About the only thing I've found about this date is that it is based on a Jewish calculation of the year of creation. Do you know of any web site or book where the chronology that was used to come up with that date for creation is laid out? Thanks

My reply

I think Jesus ascended 40 days FROM the Feast of Firstfruits that was Resurrection Sunday. That was 10 days before Pentecost. First, we have to figure out how to count the Omer to Pentecost.

Also, we should keep in mind that running time was counted from the next day, as we count time. To us, a week of 7 days is counted from Sunday to Sunday. Day number 1 is Monday. That is the same for the Jews. As someone pointed out to me, if that weren't so, this week would have one day less than last week, etc.

The difference is in counting the days/weeks/years in a block of time. A block is counted by inclusive reckoning. An example is the Six-Day War that lasted from June 5 to 10. To us, that is 5 days. The first day is not included. To the Jews, it is 6 days. The first day is included.

The spring feasts start with Passover and end with Pentecost. Nisan 14 is Passover. Nisan 15 is Unleavened Bread. Nisan 16 is Firstfruits. Remember that all feasts are sabbaths, holy convocations, days of rest. Since Tishri 1, 10 and 15 are the fall feasts, we can easily understand that they do not necessarily fall on the weekly Sabbath. Otherwise, those feasts would have been on the 1st, 7th and 14th. The feasts are all annual sabbaths, regardless of day of the week they fall on.

Passover is the "HIGH DAY". John 19:31 says, "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation (Thursday, Nisan 13, the preparation of the Passover, Mark 15:42), that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the SABBATH day (Friday, Nisan 14), (for that SABBATH day was an HIGH DAY,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away."

Lev. 23:4-6 says, "These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations (i.e., sabbaths, days of rest), which ye shall proclaim in their seasons. In the fourteenth day of the first month (NISAN 14) at even is the LORD'S passover. And on the fifteenth day of the same month (NISAN 15) is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD: seven days ye must eat unleavened bread."

Lev. 23:10,11 says, "When ye be come into the land which I give unto you, and shall reap the harvest thereof, then ye shall bring a sheaf of the FIRSTFRUITS of your harvest (of barley) unto the priest: And he shall wave the sheaf before the LORD, to be accepted for you: on the morrow (NISAN 16) after the SABBATH (i.e., AFTER THE FEAST OF UNLEAVENED BREAD, NISAN 15) the priest shall wave it."

Lev. 23:15 says, "And ye shall count unto you FROM THE MORROW (NISAN 16) after the sabbath (NISAN 15), FROM THE DAY THAT YE BROUGHT THE SHEAF OF THE WAVE OFFERING (NISAN 16); seven sabbaths (WEEKS) shall be complete: Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number FIFTY DAYS; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the LORD." Ex. 34:22 calls Pentecost the "FEAST OF WEEKS, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest."

Seven sabbaths are 7 weeks, or 49 days. It is similar when talking about 7 literal weeks or 7 weeks of years. Lev. 25:8 says, "number seven sabbaths (i.e., WEEKS) of years unto thee, SEVEN TIMES SEVEN years; and the space of the seven sabbaths (i.e., weeks or 7s) of years shall be unto thee FORTY AND NINE years" (7 x 7 = 49).

Therefore, we count Nisan 17 as day number one and count off 49 days. If Firstfruits is on Sunday, as in 30 AD, the 49th day will also be on Sunday. Thus, Pentecost will be on the next day, in this case, on Monday (Sivan 7).

Ascension Day was the 40th day, 10 days before Pentecost. After the Resurrection on Firstfruits, Jesus was "seen of them forty days" (Acts 1:3).

This year, 5765, Pentecost (Sivan 7, the 50th day) will be on Tuesday, June 14, 2005. Ten days before June 14 is June 4, Ascension Day.

I can't give you much about the beginning of the Hebrew Calendar. The Jews are said to have picked the date they call the creation of the world, Oct. 7, 3761 BCE, according to TRADITION. Maybe they had figured the date of the New Moon on that day. It certainly is not the true Biblical date of creation. It is an ASSUMED date.

Calendar stats:
According to Jewish TRADITION, the year 1 of the Jewish calendar was the time of "waste and void" referred to in Genesis 1:1. Nothing was yet created, and only a virtual clock started to tick on the first day of that year, heard, as it were, only by the Creator, on the first day of the week (Sunday) the 24th of Elul, (22 August 3760 B.C. in the Gregorian calendar). He said "Let there be light", and He finished the following Sabbath (Saturday) which is the first day of Tishri, year 2.

The Hebrew Calendar:
On the Hebrew Calendar, "Years are counted since the creation of the world, which is ASSUMED to have taken place in the autumn of 3760 BC. In that year, after less than a week belonging to AM 1, AM 2 started (AM = Anno Mundi = year of the world)."

About the Hebrew Calendar:
The Biblical date of creation is used as the basis for the Hebrew calendar. Reverse calculation gives the time of the first new moon of Year 1 as 5 hours and 204 halakhim from the beginning of the second day of the week (Monday). This date corresponds to October 7, 3761 BCE, using the Julian (not Gregorian) calendar. Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: Thanking you

A brief note of my appreciation to you for your extreme generosity of spirit in sharing your years of dilligent, thorough Bible study & exhaustive reading, locating pertinent material in your research, and most candidly explaining the results of these years of your findings. I really missed your site when your computer was down, & just want to THANK YOU for the encouragement you give us in "the blessed hope of the glorious appearing of our great God & King, Jesus Christ." Love in Christ,

My reply

Thanks for your kind words. It is so nice to be appreciated.

I had to take some time off to fight with my computer. I'm sorry to say, "It won." Even after System Recovery, it only opened its eyes and showed the HP blue screen and the Windows screen at Startup. After those two blinks, it went dark. I waited for hours, but it was in vain. No amount of Startup tries worked. I couldn't wake it up, and had to get a new computer after all.

I'm hoping for Jesus to come in the clouds in like manner that he went up into the clouds--on Ascension Day. Agape

   Pro and Con 1196   Or Return   Home

Contact me for more information at:

Send me e-mail now

8641 Sugar Gum Rd, Riverside, CA 92508, USA; (951) 653-4110

© 1996-2005, Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 4-10-05