Pro and Con 1326

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Pro and Con 1326

Posted 3-25-07

Here is the coin minted in 13 and 14 AD. It has Augustus on one side and Tiberius on the other, showing that Tiberius was Co-Rex with Augustus.

Incoming e-mail, Re: The Most Important Message in 2000 years

Marilyn, you have just written your most sacred and blessed message. In my heart and soul I feel you are serving the Lord as you have never done before. This is the most important message in 2000 years. The year 2007 is the time without a doubt. Pentecost is spot on.

I and many others have been blessed by your example and thank the Lord for His servant.

May He be with you always, shalom

My reply

Wow! That can't be true, because the New Testament days would be included, but thanks for making my day. It is nice to be appreciated. Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: Thank you

Marilyn, I apologize for any offense to you with my issues on your teaching on the Penecost rapture--- it took a great deal of effort to respond to my E- mail to you and it shows the character of a true woman of God to respond. The issue is the heart of a watchman....not on differences...in Hebrew we call it Beit Midrish.

Tng is brilliant on the numerics for First Fruits and Dan Matson's numerics are in tandem...Dan leans to Pentecost and I lean to First Fruits due to numerics and my address of 11701 Wedd when I moved from the Rocky Mountains back to KC..which is the 17th day of the1st month..the Lord spoken 217/117/917 to me for years.

If First Fruits does not lead to the rapture...everyone will be watching Pentecost...the sum total of information gathered yields a vector to accuracy...all of us yearn for the Rapture....maybe it could be tonight....my sister may need brain surgery...and she could die on the operating table and she loves God---PRAY FOR HER>>BARBARA...the issue is a heart right with God leading others with him....where ever teachers differ..the knives must sharpen each other...communicate with all the great teachers like Tng,Bramlett, Matson,Lindsey.....the EVENT must be very soon . Shalom

My reply

Thanks for your kind words. We are doing our best to search the scriptures for clues to when the Rapture might take place. Jesus demanded for us to watch. He also will reward us for our patience. Rev. 3:8-10 says, "I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name. Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie (i.e., things like British Israelism); behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Because thou hast kept the word of my patience (hupomone, patient endurance), I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation (the Tribulation, the 70th week of Daniel), which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown."

> > I lean to First Fruits due to numerics and my address of 11701 Wedd when I moved from the Rocky Mountains back to KC..which is the 17th day of the1st month..the Lord spoken 217/117/917 to me for years.

I'm afraid my head don't understand that kind of thing too well. I'm more into what does the Bible say. I figure that the Bible interprets itself, so what is it that I have missed? and I keep looking. I also try to keep up on world events. Prophecy is being fulfilled right under our noses these days. I watch for signs. If there ever was a time for signs, it should be now that we are in, or are fast approaching, the ends of the ages.
1Cor 10:11 (LITV) says, "And all these things happened to those as examples, and it was written for our warning, on whom THE ENDS OF THE AGES HAVE COME."

I looks like the ends of all three 2000-year ages, the Age of the Gentiles, the Age of the Jews, and the Age of the Church, run concurrently during a stretch of time leading up to the Day of the Lord that is also the Day of God's Wrath. The 70th week of Daniel runs during the last seven years, but according to Dan. 8:13,14, it is to be shortened to 2300 days.

Dan 8:13,14 (KJV) says, "How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice (i.e., the first half of the 70th week of Daniel), and the transgression of desolation (MID_TRIB), to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot (i.e., during the rest of the Tribulation)? And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed." It looks like the 70th week of Daniel will be shortened from 7 years to 2300 days. I think it will run from Pentecost in 2009 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2015. The Pre-Trib Rapture is drawing near.

When I worked several years on Bible Chronology, it seemed that the 6000 years would end in l998. Did we enter the time of the end then? Maybe. Things have been getting worse ever since.

Dan 12:4 (KJV) says, "But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to THE TIME OF THE END: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased." We have planes to run us to and fro, and with computers, knowledge is increased. We must be in the time of the end. If so, we should be able to understand Daniel. What does Daniel say that means more than people have thought in the past? Agape

PS. I prayed for Barbara. Others will also.

Incoming e-mail From Cindy Busch, FWD from 5 Doves site, Re: to Marilyn Agee

Marilyn thank you for your wonderful work. My question is why do you propose a two year delay between the Rapture of the church on Sivan 6-7 2007 and the beginning of the Tribulation Sivan 2009? Cindy

My reply

Thanks for your kind words.

There are two figures God has given us for the length of a generation, 40 years and 48.33 years. There has to be a good reason. It looks to me like God gave us the two lengths of a generation, because the first Rapture is 40 years after the Sign of the End of the Age, the Six-Day War of 1967, and the second Rapture is 48.33 years after 1967.

The 40 years is from the 40 years the Israelites wandered in the desert while one generation died off before they went into the Promised Land. That 40 years relates to us, because we are going into our Promised Land at the Pre-Trib Rapture. The number 40 means testing and probation. It looks like the church has been tested during the last 40 years, as Israel was tested in the desert.

The 48.33 years is from Mt. 1:17. It says, "So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations." If you count the people mentioned in the KJV, you will come up short by one name. In the Du Tillet Hebrew manuscript, it says that Abichud begat Avner, and Avner begat Eliakim. Counting Avner makes it come out right.

I think the 48.33 years relates to the Day of the Lord, which is the day of the Coronation of Christ, the Pre-Wrath Rapture, the Marriage of the Lamb, the Judgment Seat of Christ in Heaven, and the Day of God's Wrath on Earth. This will be like no other day -- ever. At this time, all the saints will be gathered to the "general assembly" (Heb. 12:23; Mt. 24:31; Mark 13:27) in Heaven and all unbelievers will be left on Earth.

If the first Rapture is on Pentecost (in the 3rd month, Sivan 6 and 7) and the second Rapture is on the Feast of Trumpets (in the 7th month, Tishri 1 and 2), there are 4 Jewish months between them. Four months is one third of a year. It works out perfectly, too good to be an accident. Obviously, it was planned that way from the beginning.

A door is a symbol of a Rapture. We are the Temple of the Holy Spirit. The Holy of Holies symbolized Heaven. It's floor of gold was to remind us of Heaven's streets of gold. There were two doors to "Heaven picturing the two Raptures.

Rev. 3:8-10 tells us of one door. It says, "I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee AN OPEN DOOR, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name....Because thou hast kept the word of my patience (hupomone, patient enduring), I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation (the Tribulation), which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth."

Luke 21:36 says, "Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to ESCAPE all these things that shall come to pass (i.e., in the Tribulation), and to stand before the Son of man." This escape is the Pre-Trib Rapture.

Mt. 24:32-34 says, "Now learn a parable of the fig tree (Israel, Joel 1:6,7); When his branch (klados, scion broken off for grafting, i.e., modern Israel) is yet tender (apalos, young, i.e., 19), and putteth forth leaves (Gaza Strip, Golan Heights, Sinai and West Bank), ye know that summer is nigh (the Six-Day War began June 5, 1967; summer began June 21): So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it (the Kingdom of God, Luke 21:32) is near, even AT THE DOORS (plural, 2 doors, i.e., 2 Raptures). Verily (Amen, so be it) I say unto you, THIS GENERATION shall not pass, till all these things (plural) be fulfilled."

Luke 21:25-32 says, "And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars (lit., constellations); and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring; Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud (they see the Sign of the Son of Man in the sky, Christ sitting on his throne) with power and great glory. And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh. And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree (Israel), and all the trees (nations); When they now shoot forth (i.e., in the Six-Day War), ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand. So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS NIGH AT HAND. Verily I say unto you, THIS GENERATION shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled."

I think it will be 48.33 years from the Six-Day War to when Christ is crowned King of kings and Lord of lords as the Millennium begins.

Rev 11:15-19 tells us about THAT DAY, as it is often referred to in the Old Testament. It says, "And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come (the Second Advent is 7 months future; Eze. 39:12,13); because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth. And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail" i.e., when the two stones are smashed into Earth, as when Moses broke the two stone tablets at the foot of Mt. Sinai because the Israelites were worshipping the golden calf.

To figure the 48.33 years, Abraham was born in 2008 AH. The Flood was in 1656 AH. Noah lived another 350 years, and Abraham was born 2 years after Noah died. 1656 + 350 + 2 = 2008 AH, which was 2035 BC. Subtract 5 years, because Jesus was born in 5 BC. That gives us 2030 years to divide by 42 generations -- 48.33 years for a generation.

I thank God that he has given his saints these two doors to Heaven. Rev 4:1 tells us about the first door. After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet (i.e., the first trumpet of God, I Thess. 4:16,17) talking with me; which said, Come up hither".

The "last trump" of God (I Cor. 15:51,52) will call the Tribulation saints up to the "general assembly" in Heaven. Mt. 24:31 tells about the gathering of the saints that are already in Heaven. It says, "And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other." Mark 13:27 tells us about the Tribulation saints being caught up. It says, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the EARTH to the uttermost part of heaven." Agape

Incoming e-mail, Re: Question

I wanted to get your opinion on something I’ve been thinking about. It came up recently in a Five Doves message from Jim Bramlett posted March 23rd, 2007. In it he reviewed some reasons for believing that the Matthew 24:36 passage may have been meant for those Jesus spoke to at that time. Matthew 24:36 (NKJV) says “But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only.” Jim gives good reasons for believing the way he does, and I am inclined to agree, but had another point that I’m not sure has been made.

When Jesus speaks of coming “like a thief”, is that phrase reserved for His second day (pre-wrath rapture)? If so, then the other passages that Jim used to make his point would make even more sense to me. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-2 (NKJV) says “But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.” The Day of the Lord is the pre-wrath rapture, right? If so, then this would seem to link the “thief” theme to the second rapture.

Revelation 3:3 says “…if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.” That seems to indicate that the one who does not watch will not be ready and will not be part of the first rapture, but will be left to be part of the second rapture.

I have also heard (somewhere) that if the second rapture is on the Feast of Trumpets it would make sense that no one would know the day or hour because this day is determine by the new moon which cannot be exactly known until it actually occurs and is observed (not sure if that is exactly right). Therefore, the approximate time might be known, but not the exact hour / day. This could very well be the day of the second rapture since it is the Feast of “Trumpets” – seven trumpet judgments.

I guess a summary of these thoughts would be that those who are watching are the ones who are "ready and waiting" and that they will be like the wise virgins, whereas the ones who don't watch (meaning that they aren't "ready and waiting") will be like the foolish virgins. These would then be part of the second rapture where Jesus will come as a thief. Thanks

My reply

> > In it he reviewed some reasons for believing that the Matthew 24:36 passage may have been meant for those Jesus spoke to at that time.

Mt 24:36 says, "But of that day and hour KNOWETH no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only."

In English, "knoweth" is present tense, but in Greek, "eido" is past tense. Strong's says, "A primary verb; USED ONLY IN CERTAIN PAST TENSES". That settles it in my mind. No man knew up to that moment. Jesus said nothing about what we could or couldn't know today in that verse.

> > When Jesus speaks of coming “like a thief”, is that phrase reserved for His second day (pre-wrath rapture)?

Yes, the Pre-Wrath Rapture, the Day of the Lord, and the Day of God's Wrath are on the same day, the first day of Christ's millennial kingdom.

> > 1 Thessalonians 5:1-2 (NKJV) says “But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night.” The Day of the Lord is the pre-wrath rapture, right? If so, then this would seem to link the “thief” theme to the second rapture.

Yes, the Pre-Wrath Rapture is on the Day of the Lord, which is also the Day of God's Wrath, but the Pre-Wrath Rapture happens before God's wrath is poured out on unbelievers left on Earth. The Rapture happens between the 6th and 7th seals. God's wrath is poured out after the 7th seal is broken.

Rev. 6:12-17 says, "And I beheld when he had opened the SIXTH SEAL, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together (i.e., the Sign of the Son of man is seen in the sky, they see Jesus sitting on his throne); and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks (i.e., asteroids), Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For THE GREAT DAY OF HIS WRATH IS COME; and who shall be able to stand?"

The Pre-Wrath Rapture takes place in Rev. 7, then in 8:1, when the 7th seal is broken, there is silence in Heaven and Earth (Hab. 2:20) while Christ, the judge is being seated at the Judgment Seat of Christ. Only after that court is in session are the 7 judgment trumpets given to the 7 angels. Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

Hab 2:20 says, "the LORD is in his holy temple: let all the earth keep silence before him.

1Th 5:4 says, "But ye, brethren (believers), are NOT in darkness, that THAT DAY should overtake you as a thief."

> > Revelation 3:3 says “…if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you.” That seems to indicate that the one who does not watch will not be ready and will not be part of the first rapture, but will be left to be part of the second rapture.

I think you understand it correctly. Jesus was speaking to the church at Sardis (which means those escaping, i.e., in the Reformation). Not until he addressed the Philadelphians (which means brotherly love) did he say he had set before them the open door. Jesus told these church groups to repent: Ephesus, Pergamos, Thyatira, Sardis and Laodicea. I take it that if they repent, they will end up being in the Philadelphian church group that will go through Heaven's door when Christ says, "Come up hither" at the first "TRUMP OF GOD" (I Thess. 4:16).

Rev. 4:1 ties together the door and first trump of God. It says, "After this I looked, and, behold, a DOOR was opened in heaven: and the FIRST voice which I heard was as it were of a TRUMPET talking with me; which said, Come up hither".

> > I have also heard (somewhere) that if the second rapture is on the Feast of Trumpets it would make sense that no one would know the day or hour because this day is determine by the new moon which cannot be exactly known until it actually occurs and is observed

As you know, it is the new crescent moon they were to watch for. However, the astronomers know exactly when it will occur. It is the new crescent moon that will look like blood from the smoke. My dates are figured according to the official Hebrew Calendar. If the Lord is going by the actual sighting of the new crescent moon, the dates could vary a little.

> > This could very well be the day of the second rapture since it is the Feast of “Trumpets” – seven trumpet judgments.

Yes, it has to be the Feast of Trumpets, because the Day of God's Wrath is on Trumpets and it has already come in the last verse of Rev. 6. Then the raptured Tribulation saints are seen in Heaven in Rev. 7:14.

> > I guess a summary of these thoughts would be that those who are watching are the ones who are "ready and waiting" and that they will be like the wise virgins, whereas the ones who don't watch (meaning that they aren't "ready and waiting") will be like the foolish virgins. These would then be part of the second rapture where Jesus will come as a thief.

I agree. The wise virgins have enough oil of the Holy Spirit, because they have confessed their sins committed after they accepted Christ to bring all their sins under the blood of Christ. All their "old" sins were wiped off the books when they accepted Christ.

Peter gave us a list of things we should do. II Peter 1:4-11 says, "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature (i.e., the Holy Spirit), having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity. For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But he that lacketh these things is blind (i.e., like the Laodiceans), and cannot see afar off (Heaven), and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ." II Peter 3:10 says, "But the DAY OF THE LORD will come AS A THIEF IN THE NIGHT; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up." The two asteroid pieces of Rev. 8:8-11 will impact Earth that day. One will hit the Mediterranean Sea. The other will destroy Babylon, Iraq.

Isa. 22:16-19 says, "What hast thou here? (Babylon) and whom hast thou here (the False Prophet), that thou hast hewed thee out a sepulchre here, as he (Satan) that heweth him out a sepulchre on high, and that graveth an habitation for himself in a rock (i.e., in the asteroid Wormwood, a piece of his planet Rahab that split apart forming our Asteroid Belt)? Behold, the LORD will carry thee away with a mighty captivity, and will surely cover thee. He will surely VIOLENTLY TURN AND TOSS THEE LIKE A BALL INTO A LARGE COUNTRY (not tiny Israel): there shalt thou die, and there the chariots of thy glory shall be the shame of thy lord's house. And I will drive thee from thy station, and from thy state shall he pull thee down."

Do you know how I found that passage? The AEC (Atomic Energy Commission) gave a 22' statue of Isaiah to our president. If I remember right, it was Truman. That seemed like a strange thing for the AEC to do, so when I saw that in the paper, I read Isa. 22 carefully and was stunned when I realized what this part meant. The Lord does work in mysterious ways. Agape

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