Pro and Con 14

Incoming e-mail, Re: two witnesses

I first read your book about two years ago. I found it quite interesting. Since then, I have kept your theories in mind as I read and watched shows about other topics I enjoy: world/earth/universe history, archeology, eschatology and such. It seemed to me that many things you put forth made more sense than any other things I had tried to put together. I must admit that setting a rapture date in my mind was unsettling. I much preferred not knowing a date, although I believed it to be very near. My thinking and decision making began to change. I came to the conclusion that even if it doesn't occur on Pentecost, I should be living each day as though it were. It has made me more bold in sharing Christ. I took more risks to present salvation to people that I don't think I would have before. I'd hate to stand before God and have him ask me why I wimped out when it came to sharing his message. Having a deadline on my being on this planet seems to create an urgency I never felt before. So I must thank you for that.

I have a question. It's been awhile since I read the book, and I haven't had a chance to catch up on your new Pros and cons pages, but here it is. I hope I'm not repeating someone else. The Bible tells us it is given to man once to die and then the judgement. In regards to the two witnesses, why do you believe it will be Elijah and Moses and not Elijah and Enoch? We know Elijah was raptured but the Bible clearly states that Moses died and was buried by God. The two witnesses will be killed and left to rot for three days then be ressurected. It seems more logical that Enoch would be the other witness, since he walked with God and never died. The Bible does say man is given to die once. How then, can Moses die twice? I'm curious as to what scriptures lead you towards Moses and not Enoch. Thank you for your time in this matter. You must be so awfully busy....

My reply

...Thank you so much for telling me how you felt after reading my book. As for setting dates, I am not infallible. I can be wrong, but I keep finding more that fits the same pattern and am getting more confident that I have figured it right. However, this is just the way it looks to me. Each should study the scriptures to see if these things are so. I just want each Christian I can reach to realize that if there is a possibility of the Rapture being next Pentecost, they should make sure that they are ready. What does it hurt to be prepared? The Bride wears white.

As for Moses being one of the two witnesses instead of Enoch, there are several reasons. Rev. 11:4 says, "These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth" Zech. 4:14 says, "These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth." Both Moses and Elijah stood with Christ at his Transfiguration (Mt. 17:1-8; Mk. 9:2-8; Luke 9:27-33). Both have the power "to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy (as Elijah did before); and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues" (Rev. 11:6), as Moses did in Egypt. They are killed in Jerusalem, and God is dealing with the Jews during the Seventieth Week of Daniel, so they are likely Jewish. Enoch was a Gentile. Also, Hebrews 11:5 says, "By faith Enoch was translated that HE SHOULD NOT SEE DEATH."

Jude 9 gives us a glimpse of something concerning Moses that went on in the background. "Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses."

Remember the account of the rich man and Lazarus in Luke 16:19-31? The rich man wanted Abraham to be sent to his five brethren, "that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but IF ONE WENT UNTO THEM FROM THE DEAD, THEY WILL REPENT. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

It looks to me like God is giving them every possible chance. Since the rich man thinks this will cause them to repent, God will send one from the dead to see if they will. The one chosen is Moses. He will be living proof that there is life after death.

I just uploaded a file with new information. To me, it is a must see. It is "Important Ties that Bind" at:

Incoming e-mail

Does Elijah come before the rapture or after? In other words, does he come before the day of the Lord, or after the day of the Lord? And when he comes, what does he do?

My reply

The millennial Day of the Lord does not start until the 2,300th day (Dan. 8:14) of the Shortened Tribulation. Elijah must come before that happens. Malachi 4:5 says, "Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet BEFORE the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD." Joel 2:1,2 says, "the day of the LORD cometh...A day of...thick darkness." This is the day the Wrath of God, "the curse," is poured out on unbelievers on Earth.

It is not yet the day of the Second Advent. Zech. 14:5-7 says, "the LORD my God shall come and all the saints with thee. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, NOR DARK: But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light."

In the sequence of end-time events, the Pre-Trib Rapture of the Bride of Christ comes first. Then there is a gap, a few more years of grace, between the Rapture and the beginning of the Tribulation, for Israel in case the Rapture would wake them up. These years are described in Luke 13:6-9. This seems to be their last chance to avoid the Tribulation.

Elijah comes as the Tribulation begins. He, along with Moses, prophesies the first 1260 days. "And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse" (Mal. 4:6). Elijah and Moses will have the same powers they had before. Read Rev. 11:3-6. Elijah will "have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy" as he had before, etc.

Mid-Trib, Satan is cast down to Earth, enters into the False Prophet, and kills Moses and Elijah, probably because they will refuse to bow down to the abomination of desolation he places in the temple when he sits there "shewing himself that he is God" (II Thess. 2:4). After 3 1/2 days, they are resurrected and caught up to Heaven. The same hour a great earthquake kills 7000 in Jerusalem (Rev. 11:13). A tenth of the city falls. Then the False Prophet goes "to make war with the remnant of her (Israel's) seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ" (Rev. 12:17).

As the 2300th day begins, the millennial Day of the Lord begins. This is a day like no other--ever. In Heaven, we have the Coronation of Christ the King of kings and Lord of lords on his birthday, Tishri 1, the Marriage of the Lamb, sending the angels to bring the Tribulation saints to Heaven, the Judgment Seat of Christ and the Marriage Supper of the Lamb.

On Earth, there is the terror of terrors, the curse, an asteroid impact that destroys civilization as we know it. It is probably a binary asteroid. One piece hits the Mediterranean Sea. The other wipes out Babylon on the Euphrates and forms the Lake of Fire (Rev. 8:8,10; 18:21).

Rev. 11:15-18 describes this day: "The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever...We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come (the Second Advent is still future at this time); because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."

At this point, there are still seven Jewish months before the Second Advent. See Ezek. 39:12,13.

Incoming e-mail, Subject: Rapture vantage point

The next time I read Revelation, it will be from a different perspective. I like your insight that it is written with a focus on the rapture.

Incoming e-mail, Re: Forwarded and reforwarded: RAPTURE '98

> >... wrote:

> >... wrote:

> > wrote:

> > Dear...thought you might like this one on the Rapture:


> > IF YOU MISSED IT IN '95, '94, '89, '88,

> > Somehow, I missed all of the above Raptures -- the one
> > in 1995 sponsored by Peter's Ruckman's student, Mel
> > Turner (alias "Tale Turner"); the Harold Camping RapTure
> > of 1994; the "good guess" Rapture by Ruckman in 1989;
> > the Edgar Wisenut Rapture of '88; and perhaps some
> > other Raptures I am overlooking or didn't even hear about.
> > And if you are reading this, I suppose you missed them
> > all, too. At least they all have one "redeeming element"
> > to them -- they keep us posted that a Rapture is coming.

> > But you needn't worry too much about missing all those
> > Raptures, for their sponsors missed them, too. The only
> > difference is, they may have made a little money off of
> > selling their Rapture products, or gotten a little "attention"
> > for awhile. That seems to be about all these Rapture
> > predictions are good for -- get a little attention and make
> > a little money. Or, they give fellows like me something to
> > do by way of helping others to "be ready."

> > Your next opportunity to make the Rapture will be May 31 of
> > 1998 -- unless someone else has already announced (or will
> > yet announce) an earliter departure. I just wish it could come
> > a little earlier, and knock-out having to file Tax Returns for '97;
> > It would be worth it to catch an earlier Rapture, just to get out
> > of filing those.

> > Anyway -- the next one scheduled at this writing (so far I know)
> > is the Rapture announced by "M. J. Agee," who we learned
> > from her website is a woman <>

> > Her name is "Marilyn J. Agee," so I will call here "MA" for
> > short. Like all Rapture heralds worth their salt, MA has books
> > for sale, which she says are the result of "a rectangle of light
> > appearing on one verse in the Bible" [Jer. 50:2]. She says it
> > took her 20 years "before I realized that God opened my eyes
> > that night," but the wait seems to have been worth it. Now
> > MA has three books to her namesake; she not only knows
> > when the Rapture will take place, she also has "discovered
> > Heaven," and you can learn its "exact location" and see it
> > with "the naked eye." I don't know if you will actually see
> > Heaven anymore than the "Pretseers" see Jesus' Return in
> > A. D. 70, for I haven't read the book to learn how to "see"
> > Heaven. But if you have money you want to squander, you
> > can send it to MA for her book "Heaven Found."

> > MA's story about the "rectangle of light" also includes her
> > "hearing a masculine voice," and at that time she was reading
> > Job 33:15 "in the Septuagint." Also, that "rectangle of light"
> > appeared on her open Bible "in a darkened room." Maybe
> > that's why I never get any "lights" like this, for I can't read in
> > the dark and can't read the Septuagint.

> > Like all other Prophecy Experts, MA is greatly influenced by
> > Matthew 24, especially 24:34. That's the verse that all the
> > Prophecy Experts are inspired by, even if they don't all see
> > it alike. Everything from "A. D. 70ism" to MA's Rapture '98
> > is based on Matthew 24:34. According to MA, the reason
> > "1988" was not the Rapture time was because it was ten
> > years too early. Instead of "40 years" after 1948, it should
> > have been known that it would be "50 years." She explains
> > all of this, and it all relates to "Pentecost" and the number
> > "50." She has all the dates, and figures, and has it all worked
> > out; I'll not bore you with all the details; just take her word for
> > it. She says it's all "LOCKED IN."

> > Of course, "1948" is "significant" because as we have been
> > told 10 million times, that's when "Israel became a nation."
> > I always thought it was in the Old Testament that Israel first
> > was a "nation" and Israel was peculiarly a nation unto the
> > Lord (Gen. 12:2), and was not "reckoned among the nations"
> > (Numbers 23:9) but was reckoned unto the Lord. Ever since
> > the Babylonian captivity, Israel has not been able to function
> > as in the past, but a "restoration" is promised (Jer. 30-33).
> > I never thought it happened in 1948 or 1967, but then, who
> > am I? I never had a "rectangle of light" flash on my Bible
> > in the dark, and I never heard a "masculine voice."

> > At any rate, MA has it all figured out, based on Matt. 24:34
> > and the 1948 matter, and she figures that 50 years will bring
> > us to Pentecost Sunday in May 1998. In fact, she has it right
> > down to the "hour," and advises you to "check your time zone."
> > That thing in the Bible about "not knowing the day and hour"
> > no longer applies; that only applied to "that day" before the
> > last days. Sorta like it is with the "A. D. 70" hermeneutic --
> > Jesus didn't know the day, but He knew the "generation."
> > All of these Prophecy Experts know how to explain all of
> > those things so that it shouldn't give us any trouble. If we
> > would "just listen."

> > Now, when something is really important in MA's writings,
> > she noticed that her keyboard will just automatically use
> > "CAPS." She can't explain it, for she doesn't do a thing to
> > "lock" the caps. Well, I have had some times like that, too,
> > but it's certainly not as MA's; mine seems to be my "flicking"
> > my little finger on the wrong key. But with MA, it's not that,
> > and she says it "has happened over a dozen times." She
> > says the caps you see "are not of my doing." Well, we all
> > know that "U-NO-WHO" did that, don't we?

> > MA also informs us that "baby church" didn't understand the
> > prophecies (much like the "Pretskis" tell us about the church
> > in A. D. 70; it took them awhile to "catch on" to reading the
> > Writings of Josephus, Eusebius, and Jerome). But now, MA
> > says, the church today can understand, and she refers to
> > Daniel 12:9, 10. I personally have felt that the early church
> > did understand, and if it had not gotten side-tracked through
> > the writings of Josephus, it might have never misunderstood.
> > But then -- who am I?

> > Oh, by the way, MA says there will be "two Raptures." One
> > will take place on Pentecost and the other one will take place
> > before the Wrath of the Tribulation. The Church on Pentecost
> > and the Tribulation Saints later on. Now, that ought to solve
> > any debate about when the Rapture will occur. I don't know
> > about you, but I am making my reservation for Rapture #1. If
> > Ruckman is right about the Antichrist coming in on a UFO
> > to kiss people with two big black lips, I don't want any such
> > a thing happening to me!

> > Now, don't think that MA got all of this information simply by
> > her little self; she has had some help -- from a fellow named
> > "Bruce Baber." He helped on the "Two Raptures" thing. He
> > also told her that "Enoch's and Elijah's translations foreshadow
> > the two Raptures," and she said, "I just love to learn something
> > new." Well, so do I! and that is certainly "a new one on me"!
> > I'm tickled to death to learn about it!

> > MA says "the Rapture will probably take place during the
> > night, which for the Jews precedes the daytime." Also, you
> > must "remember that it will be Jerusalem time. Their days
> > start at 6:00 P. M. the preceding day, our time. You may also
> > need to find out how many hours they are behind or ahead of
> > you in your time zone to calculate the correct day where you
> > where you are located."

> > Now, this is getting a little "too worrisome" for a "slow-mo"
> > like me; I wonder if anyone reading this knows about a Tour**
> > to Israel the last week of May 1998? I just might try to go
> > on that Tour, to save me the trouble of having to figure all
> > this "time" stuff out.

> > Well, that's about it, except you can read all of this vitial stuff
> > on MA's website <> and you are
> > invited to copy her article and distribute it to others "at no
> > charge." In fact, that might help MA sell a few more books,
> > and you could "reward her" a little for helping you get ready
> > for the next Rapture.

> > Too bad all you A. D. 70 Pret-rappers have already had your
> > "Rapture" in your "Matthew 24 time frame." Hope you enjoy
> > the Great Tribulation! -- Bob L. Ross.

> > **Please send me the phone number, fax number, email, or
> > snailmail address of any Tour to Israel that you know about
> > for May 1998. -- Bob
> > "WONDERS"--
> > Will "wonders" ever cease? Not as long as there's a sucker
> > to buy the "wonder"! -- Bob L. Ross

> >"Some think that this descent of the Lord will be postmillennial
> > --that is after the thousand years of his reign. I cannot think so.
> > I conceive that the advent will be premillennial--that he will come
> > first, and then will come the millennium as the result of his
> > personal reign upon the earth."

> >[Charles Haddon Spurgeon, MTP 11:249]
> >For Spurgeon's prophetic views, see the following website:
> ><>
> >Permission is granted to quote or reprint the above.
> >Website:
> >Email: [Bob L. Ross]
> >Back-up:

> >Publishers of C. H. Spurgeon's Sermons & Other Works
> >Pilgrim Publications, Box 66, Pasadena, TX 77501
> >Phone: (713) 477-4261. Fax: (713) 477-7561

> >Free Catalog: C. H. Spurgeon's Works/Pilgrim Publications
> >Alphabetical Lists of Books/Articles via Email
> >Exposures of Campbellism, Hardshellism, Landmarkism,
> >Preterism, King James Onlyism, Oneness Pentecostalism,
> >Peter Ruckman, Gail Riplinger, Texe Marrs, Adam Clarke
> >and other anti-Eternal Sonship Errorists

_______end of forwarded and reforwarded material_______


> Dear Marilyn,
> You probably already have been "honored" with this man's heavy dose of
> sarcasm. He seems to specialize in goring those who disagree with his
> personal views. I wonder how this all fits in with the Lord's command
> to love one another? I firmly believe that Christians have the right to
> disagree with doctrines if they are convinced that another view is in
> error. However, we are supposed to do this with love, not in a
> belittling fashion. If God really did speak to you, and I have every
> reason to believe that He did, this man will have to answer to God for
> His attitude and the intents of his heart, as we all shall, on the day
> of judgment. Keep heart! Love.....

My reply

Thanks...As far as I am concerned, it would do no good for me to write Bob Ross. He doesn't even bother to get his facts straight. He said,

> > MA's story about the "rectangle of light" also includes her
> > "hearing a masculine voice," and at that time she was reading
> > Job 33:15 "in the Septuagint." Also, that "rectangle of light"
> > appeared on her open Bible "in a darkened room." Maybe
> > that's why I never get any "lights" like this, for I can't read in
> > the dark and can't read the Septuagint.

The rectangle of light on Jer. 50:2 in the King James Version was not at the same time, or even week, as being awakened in the night and hearing "Be still and know that I am God." Then there were about 20 years between hearing those words and reading Job 33:15 in the Septuagint. As for reading in the dark, it was twilight. The pages looked grey, not black. If I had decided to start reading after resting a bit, I would have turned on the light at that time.

I wonder what he would have done if he saw light on a verse that said, "publish, and conceal not"? That is not something that I feel that I can safely ignore.

The funny thing is that I taught those college age kids, that came to my house for Bible study, about the 2 Raptures back in 1969 and figured out the date of the second one at least by the early 70's. I copyrighted Exit: 2007 (which Avon Books later published as The End of the Age) in 1987, and the first letter I ever got from Bruce Baber was 10-26-95. Here is what he wrote:

"I have been reading your book, The End of the Age, for about the sixth time. It is very hard to take it all in at one reading. I find your insight into such deep subjects to be rewarding and extremely interesting, even if I don't understand or accept everything you have written.

"It was while reading your book that a few ideas occurred to me. I wanted to share them with you and that is why I'm writing...."

"In I Corinthians, chapter 12, it states that we (the church) are the body of Christ. The Bible seems to have a lot to say about bodies. In Daniel there is a statue, or false body. It represents different empires that enter the world sequentially. This is just like the way a person is born into the world. First comes the head. Then comes the shoulders and arms. And so on. The last part to be born (whether it's an empire or a baby or the body of Christ) is the foot. Does this mean that symbolically the last age church is represented as the feet? The feet of Christ? I've given this some thought. I've looked at what the scriptures say about feet in search of clues about the church of the end of the age. Note that Christ' feet were specially anointed with a costly perfume. IS THIS SIGNIFICANT? Note that Satan said something about Jesus' feet. He said that Jesus' feet would not be dashed against a stone. That angels would lift Him up. IS THIS SIGNIFICANT? There is a lot more. What do you think?

"I would be grateful for your insight, if you have the time. My address in on the letter, if you care to write.

"Thank you for your wonderful book and for your consideration."

---end of quote---

This caused me to realize that the two feet of the Body of Christ probably represented the two Raptures. I had not thought of that tie-in before. I told Bruce that. In his second letter, Bruce said,

"I am very grateful to you for the kind and uplifting reply you made to my earlier letter. It was a precious morale booster.

"In my first letter, I mentioned that there were a few things I did not agree with in your book, The End of the Age. This was just a passing comment on some areas of your work where my own study is limited. I mean by this that I cannot accept everything until I've researched it to a satisfying degree for myself.

"I liked very much the point you shared with me concerning the comparison between the days of Noah and the days of Lot. You stated that in the first account marriage is mentioned and not in the latter. You went on to summarize by saying that these two references show the contrast between the first rapture and the second. The first is for the bride of Christ. The second rapture is for the remaining who are saved, but not the bride. I think this is true. You know, I never could reconcile the different symbolic references to the rapture until I understood that there were two rapture events. One for the bride. One for the remainder of the church.

"In speaking of the church, I am reminded of my own continuing studies of how the church is represented by the feet of Christ. I am amazed at the number of references. It must mean something important if the church of the last days is referred to so often."

---end of quote---

I don't say that the Rapture will definitely happen on Pentecost 1998, just that it looks that way to me. I say to search the scriptures and see if these things are so. I want people to be ready, just in case. According to logic, 1000 people can be wrong, and that doesn't make the next one wrong. Time will tell. We are all members of the Body of Christ. After all, if we are right about Christ, we can be wrong about some other things and still make it to heaven. In the meantime, we should deal with other Christians in agape love.

I Cor. 13:1-7 (NIV) says, "If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing. Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trust, always hopes, always perseveres."

-- In His love,

Bible Prophecy Corner:

Incoming e-mail, Re: Your fantastic web site, however, one bone to pick with you

God bless you Marilyn,
I really enjoy your website. I have skimmed through your entire site. The evidence is unrefutable that we are in the end times. No question about it. You mention Jesus saying "that no man knoweth (present tense) the day or the hour". Jesus also said that He did not know the time except His Father. I hope you are right that the rapture will occur on Pentecost 1998. However, I believe your interpretation of the scripture mentioned above is stretching the meaning of this verse. I hope I am wrong. The rapture is definitely VERY close. I know that you are not saying the rapture will DEFINITELY 100% happen on May 31, 1998, but it will happen soon. There are too many signs (heaven and earth) that I think something WILL happen before 2000. Marilyn, you and I share alot of the same beliefs about the end times. Its great to hit the same note(s) with another believer. I am 23, and I pay special attention to believers much older (no offense) than I. Seasoned Christians are a priceless asset to the body of Christ. I also am glad to see that you have 20 or more years into your theory. That makes you more credible to me. Keep up the great work, and I will be looking for your book in mid-December.

God bless you my fellow Baptist sister and see you in heaven,

P.S. I am Baptist

My reply

That is ok if we don't see eye to eye on every single point. The main thing is to be ready, just in case, because the Bride wears white.

I'm convinced that the Rapture has to happen before the Tribulation begins, and that can't be too far into the future....

Incoming e-mail, Re: your web page

just a word to let you know how much i enjoy your timely information. it would be just like the Lord to use a housewife to inform the world of coming events. keep up the good work. GOD BLESS YOU.

My reply

Thanks. That is music to my ears after Bob Ross's email I received and posted on Pro and Con 14 last night.

When I was copying those letters I had received from Bruce Baber, I just realized something else. Psalm 91:18-12 says,

"Only with thine eyes shalt thou behold and see the reward of the wicked. Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation; There shall no evil befall thee, neither shall any plague come nigh thy dwelling. For he shall give his angels charge over thee, to keep thee in all thy ways. They shall bear thee up in their hands, lest thou dash thy foot against a stone."

If the two feet of the Body of Christ represent the two Raptures, this will be true of them. They will be taken out of here before the stone, the asteroid, strikes. But this says, "foot," so applies particularly to those caught up in Rapture II. And, the second group will be collected by the angels, as Lot was, because Christ is occupied at that time in Heaven. This day he has received his golden crown, the Marriage of the Lamb has just taken place and the Tribulation saints are to attend the next ceremony, the Judgment Seat of Christ, along with all the Old Testament and Church saints. Believers will receive their rewards in Heaven, and the "stone" will fall as judgment on unbelievers left on Earth is meted out.

Mark 13:27 says, "And then (after the Sign of the Son of Man is seen) shall he send his ANGELS, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the EARTH to the uttermost part of heaven."

My heartfelt thanks to all who like my Web Site. God's wonderful blessings on you all. May we meet at the assembly in Heaven right after the Rapture.

In Christ,
(Mrs.) Marilyn J. Agee

  Pro and Con 15

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