Pro and Con 1431

Posted 9-7-08

Moon under Virgo's feet, Oct. 1, 2008

Moon under Virgo's feet, Oct. 2, 2008

Michael Rood thinks Tishri 1, 5769 will be Oct. 2, 2008, because of when the crescent Moon was sighted at the beginning of Elul. Therefore, the Pre-Trib Rapture could be on Oct. 2. At YourSky, it looks like the Moon will be visible on Oct 1. The exact day may not be knowable until Jesus comes for us. However, remember that the Sun has not yet set in these pictures. After sunset, the Moon will move to the right. That makes October 2 look even better.

A SIGN

http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/aug2008/markc829-1.htm

Mark Copfer (29 Aug 2008)
"Ascension Island Quake? How Ironic!!"

What a coincidence, this is just a few minutes ago... A Large Earthquake, 6.2 mag just occurred NORTH OF ASCENSION ISLAND

Wycliffe New Testament (WYC) 2001 by Terrence P. Noble

2 Thessalonians 2:1-4: "But, brethren, we pray you by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and of our congregation into the same coming [into the same thing], that ye be not moved soon from your wit, neither be afeared [neither be aghast], neither by spirit, neither by word, neither by epistle as sent by us, as if THE DAY OF THE LORD be nigh. [That] No man deceive you in any manner. For but dissension come first [For no but DEPARTING AWAY, or dissension, shall come first], and the man of sin be showed, the son of perdition, that is adversary, and is enhanced over [upon] all thing that is said God, or that is worshipped, so that he sit in the temple of God, and show himself as if he were God".

Volcanic eruption and accompanying lightning

WILL THE DEAD IN CHRIST BE RAISED 10 DAYS BEFORE THE RAPTURE?

I was sent two books and asked to give my opinion about the dead in Christ being raised 10 days before the Rapture. I read both books, and will give my opinion about "The Restored Vision: Exploring the time scale of Jesus' life as seen in the Bible" by A.E. Ware, published in London. The small book, "Miracle of Time, by Frank L. Paine, also published in England, follows in Ware's footsteps. Both thought the Time of the Gentiles ended in 1933. This is the first time I have heard of this concept. (Capitalization for emphasis throughout is mine).

While waiting for the books to come, I thought to myself, I don't think the dead in Christ will be raised 10 days before the Rapture. Jesus was resurrected on Sunday, the Feast of Firstfruits. After that, some of the Old Testament saints came out of their graves and were seen in Jerusalem. Jesus took them to Heaven that same day and returned to Earth. There was no ten-day gap between their coming out of their graves and their trip to Heaven.

John 20:1 says, "The first day of the week (Sunday) cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre." After telling Peter and John, she returned, spoke to the two angels in the tomb, and then saw Jesus.

John 20:17-19 says, "Jesus saith unto her, TOUCH ME NOT; FOR I AM NOT YET ASCENDED TO MY FATHER: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ASCEND UNTO MY FATHER, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. Mary Magdalene came and told the disciples that she had seen the Lord, and that he had spoken these things unto her. Then the SAME DAY AT EVENING, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst".

When he went to Heaven that morning, I believe Jesus took all the Old Testament saints that were waiting in Abraham's Bosom in the Earth (Luke 16:20-31) to Paradise in Heaven.

Eph 4:8-10 says, "WHEN HE ASCENDED UP ON HIGH, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. (Now that he ascended, what is it but that HE ALSO DESCENDED FIRST INTO THE LOWER PARTS OF THE EARTH? He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens [ouranos, atmospheric heavens], that he might fill [pleroo, fulfil] all things.)

WARE'S "FIVE CALENDARS"

On page XXV, Ware said, "FIVE CALENDARS WERE IN OPERATION DURING THE LIFE OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST". I wondered what that meant. The only calendars that came to mind were the Jewish and the Julian Calendars.

Ware listed his calendars as "(I) the CALENDAR OF ISRAEL which lies on the surface of Holy Scripture; (II) the CALENDAR OF JEHOVAH which differed from the Calendar of Israel by being one day of the month and one day of the week ahead; (III) The MESSIANIC CALENDAR abased upon the Years of the Messiah, and (IV) the ROMAN OR GENTILE CALENDAR inaugurated by Julius Caesar in 45 B.C.

Continuing, he said, "To these four calendars we must add the CALENDAR BASED UPON THE YEARS OF HIS OWN LIFE as measured from His birth to His Ascension. Like ourselves, our Lord had a personal chronology and this, LIKE ALL BIBLE YEARS, WAS COMPOSED OF YEARS OF 354 DAYS. The annual Feasts of Leviticus XXIII were viewed by God as also applying to this series of years, in which, for instance the Anointing by Mary of Bethany took place on THE DAY OF ATONEMENT which was the 10th day of the 7th month in His 33rd year."

That doesn't make sense to me. Mary anointed Jesus for his burying on Nisan 12. The Day of Atonement is Tishri 10. Ever since the Israelites were at Mt. Sinai, the Jewish Sacred Calendar has started with the month of Nisan. At one time, I studied the Jewish Calendar thoroughly. All Bible years do not have 354 days. There are years of 353, 354, 355, 383, 384, and 385 days. Even the "thousand two hundred and threescore days" of Rev. 12:6 is an estimated 3.5 years, similar to the 30-day month. Actually, some months have 29 days; others have 30.

In Gen 1:14, "God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years". Both the Sun and the Moon regulated the length of the year. The Jewish Calendar is a Luni-Solar Calendar.

I noticed that Mr. Ware put the anointing for Jesus' death on the Day of Atonement, which should be Tishri 10, instead of on Wednesday, Nisan 12, two days before the Passover of Nisan 14. I thought surely he didn't believe that, it must be a mistake. Oh, but he did believe that.

Mark 14:1-8 says, "After two days (Wednesday and Thursday) was the feast of the passover (Friday, Nisan 14), and of unleavened bread (Saturday, Nisan 15): and the chief priests and the scribes sought how they might take him by craft, and put him to death. But they said, NOT ON THE FEAST DAY (i.e., on Thursday, the preparation of the Passover, NOT ON FRIDAY, THE PASSOVER), lest there be an uproar of the people. And being in Bethany in the house of Simon the leper, as he sat at meat, there came a woman having an alabaster box of ointment of spikenard very precious; and she brake the box, and poured it on his head....Jesus said...she is come aforehand (i.e., on Wednesday) to anoint my body to the burying."

Luke 24:7 says, "The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again." Those three days were Friday, Saturday and Sunday, Nisan 14, 15 and 16.

Mt 12:40 says, "as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth." Those were Thursday (day), Friday (night then day), Saturday (night then day) and Sunday (night).

I disagree with A.E Ware on the dates of Jesus' birth and his Crucifixion. On page 2, he said, "This date in our solar calendar was Friday, 29th October 1 B.C.....God ordained that the birth of his son should occur on A DAY WHICH WAS BOTH THE 1ST DAY OF THE FEAST OF TABERNACLES AND THE 1ST DAY OF THE FEAST OF UNLEAVENED BREAD, each according to its respective series of years." Already, I can see that this man had an active imagination.

On page 7, he said, "The day of our Lord's birth, namely, October 29th 1 B.C., as we have stated, was IN REDEMPTION YEARS THE 1ST DAY OF THE FEAST OF TABERNACLES, and IN MESSIANIC YEARS THE 1ST DAY OF THE FEAST OF UNLEAVENED BREAD". Like stirring marbelized cake batter, that is mixed up. In the Bible, the Feast of Tabernacles is Tishri 15, and the Feast of Unleavened Bread is Nisan 15. They are not interchangeable.

On page 219, Ware said, "Let it be understood that if one date were in error the whole plan would be vitiated because it would disjoint every other date. All rests upon the one great fact that our Blessed Lord and Master was born of the Virgin Mary into this world on Friday, 29th October 1 B.C., the starting date of the "thirty years" of Luke III, 23"

Then I think his whole house of cards will fall, because his dates for Jesus' birth (1 BC) and crucifixion (33 AD) are both wrong.

Wade meant what he said. It wasn't just a slip of the tongue. It looks like his "Divine Calendar" was the same as his "Redemption Years." On page 205, he said, "Let us recall again that 29th October 1 B.C., when our Lord was born, was, IN THE DIVINE CALENDAR, the 15th of the 7th month which is the first day of the Feast of Tabernacles, while IN THE YEARS OF THE MESSIAH, it was the 15th day of the 1st month which is the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread." So you believe that?

I think Jesus was born on Tishri 1, 3757 (Sept. 4, BC 5). The Moon was under Virgo's feet that night. Rev 12:1,2,5 says, "there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman (the constellation Virgo) clothed with the sun, and THE MOON UNDER HER FEET (literally), and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered....And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne."

On page 217, Ware wrote, "...the fact that the Lord viewed Mary's act as the embalming of a dead body. That is, He viewed Himself as having died "in a figure" as the Antitype both of the Sin Offering and the Burnt Offering of the Day of Atonement." He died as the Passover lamb, and the Passover is Nisan 14 (Lev. 23:5).

That sure seems twisted. To me, the Day of Atonement has had no fulfillment yet. It is on Tishri 10 in the fall, not in the spring, when the Crucifixion took place.

On page 13, Ware said, "...the Bible reveals the existence of a lunar phenomenon during the death of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which THE MOON'S REVOLUTION WAS SUSPENDED FOR TWO WHOLE DAYS. The date of this phenomenon, as we shall prove in due course, was May 2nd and 3rd, A.D. 33. Therefore the date of any New Moon given in Lunar Tables must be placed two days earlier than what is stated."

I don't think the Moon's revolution was suspended for two whole days, and I trust Fred Espenak's eclipse tables prepared for NASA: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/LEcat/LE0001-0100.html

Lunar eclipses
30 May 06 03:18 Ne
30 Jun 04 10:03 P
30 Nov 28 20:20 N

33 Apr 03 14:47 P
33 Sep 27 03:49 P

There wasn't a Lunar Eclipse on May 2 or 3, 33 AD, or on April 6, 30 AD (my date for the Crucifixion), not even give or take 2 days.

To me, there is no way the Crucifixion could have been in 33 AD. Herod started to build the Temple in 20/19 BC. It had been under construction 46 years at the first Passover of Jesus' ministry, in 27 AD.

Jesus was baptized near Tishri 1 in 26 AD, which was the 15th year of Tiberius. He became Co-Rex with Augustus in 12 AD. I found the coin below that was minted in 13 AD. It had the head of Augustus on one side and the head of Tiberius on the other side. To me, that is solid evidence that Tiberius was Co-Rex.

coin

On page 199, Ware said, "Our Lord, Who was the Lamb of God, was killed by the Jews AT THE END OF THE SEVENTY WEEKS OR 490 YEARS named in the Prophecy of Daniel IX. That was in A.D. 33. The official period of their rejection was from A.D. 33 to 1933 which is 4 times 590 BIBLE YEARS OF 354 DAYS."

I disagree. Only 483 years have been fulfilled. They ended in 27 AD, the Sabbatic Year that preceded the Jubilee of 28 AD. The 70th week of Daniel will be fulfilled during the future Tribulation.

On pages 214 and 215, Ware said, "It is a solemn yet wondrous fact that in the Chronology of Redemption, 4,000 years had elapsed from the Fall of Adam to the day and the hour when the Supper at Bethany took place and when Mary anointed our Lord and set Him apart for death as the Antitypical Paschal Lamb four literal days thereafter.

"These 4,000 years in REDEMPTION CHRONOLOGY must end on the 10th day of the 1st month, AS THE FOLLOWING 4 DAYS IN ALL SUCH YEARS WERE UNRECKONED AND FORMED NO PART OF THE YEAR. In effect, this meant that THE END OF THE 10TH DAY WHEN THE LAMBS WERE SET APART AND THE END OF THE 14TH DAY WHEN THEY WERE SACRIFICED WERE VIEWED AS THE SAME POINT IN TIME."

After working on Bible Chronology many years, I don't believe that.

On page 270, Wade said, "On the 10th of the 1st month they (the Passover lambs) were to be set apart and on the 14th day at even they were to be offered. To mark the immense importance in His sight of these FOUR DAYS between the 10th and the 14th of the 1st month, God ordained that they should NEVER BE RECKONED IN SACRED OR REDEMPTION CHRONOLOGY. He ordained that the Sacred Year should begin on the 15th of the 1st month with the killing of the Passover lambs, and end with the 10th of the 1st month in the next year, so that UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHOULD THE 11TH, 12TH, 13TH AND 14TH OF THE 1ST MONTH FIND ANY PLACE IN THE CHRONOLOGY OF REDEMPTION which was, therefore, COMPOSED OF YEARS OF 350 DAYS EACH - THE CIVIL LUNAR YEAR BEING 354 DAYS IN LENGTH."

How "four literal days" can be "unreckoned" is beyond me. I don't think God works that way. After much study, I think Jesus was crucified on Thursday, Nisan 13, 30 AD. That day was the preparation of the Passover, which was Nisan 14. Below is my understanding of events and their dates in Passion Week.

Saturday, Nisan 8, Jesus arrived at Bethany.
Sunday, Nisan 9, Palm Sunday, He rode into Jerusalem on a donkey and presented himself as king.
Monday, Nisan 10, he cursed the fruitless fig tree and cleansed the Temple.
Tuesday, Nisan 11, two days before Passover (Mk14:1). the fig tree had dried up, and he gave the Olivet Discourse.
Wednesday, Nisan 12, he was annointed for his burial.
Thursday, Nisan 13, Jesus was crucified and buried in a stone tomb.
Friday, Nisan 14, was the Passover.
Saturday, Nisan 15, was the Feast of Unleavened Bread.
Sunday, Nisan 16, Jesus was resurrected on the Feast of Firstfruits.

\He was "three days and three nights in the heart of the earth (Mt. 12:40). They were Thursday (day), Friday (night then day), Saturday (night then day), and Sunday (night) on the Feast of Firstfruits. He arose on the 3rd day (Luke 24:7), 1st day: Friday, 2nd day: Saturday, 3rd day: Sunday.

On page 250, Ware said, "The typical Passover was killed at about 6 P.M. on the first day of the typical Feast of Unleavened Bread."

That won't work. According to Lev. 23:5, 6, Passover is on Nisan 14, and the Feast of Unleavened Bread is on Nisan 15. It says, "In the fourteenth day of the first month at even is the LORD'S passover. And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto the LORD".

The 14th began at 6 PM on Nisan 13 and ended at 6 PM on Nisan 14. Lev 23:32 shows how to keep a feast. "It shall be unto you a sabbath of rest, and ye shall afflict your souls: in the ninth day of the month at even, from even unto even, shall ye celebrate your sabbath", i.e., Tishri 10 is kept from 6 PM on Tishri 9 to 6 PM on Tishri 10. Thus, Passover was kept from 6 PM on Nisan 13 to 6 PM on Nisan 14.

If we think in terms of our days, we can easily fall into the error of skipping one whole day in our thinking. We need to orient ourselves to the Jewish day. It started at 6 PM on the previous evening. There were 12 hours of night, then 12 hours of day. The 12 hours of night were split in half by midnight. The 12 hours of day were split in half by noon.

If the Passover lambs had been killed on Nisan 15, the firstborn of the Israelites would have died at midnight on Nisan 14. The lambs had to be killed, and their blood applied to the door frames, before the 6th hour of Passover, which is midnight, Nisan 14.

On page 394 and 395, Ware published his chart and told how he learned that there were TWO UNRECKONED DAYS while Jesus was in the grave. To me, it is scary. I wonder who the "One" talking actually was? And who is "we"? See what you think.

WARE'S CHART:

IN DIVINE TIME--------------------------------------------------------IN ISRAEL'S TIME

OUR LORD DIES ON GOD'S SABBATH-------------------FRIDAY (6TH DAY)
(TIME UNRECKONED)---------------------------------------------SATURDAY (SABBATH)
(TIME UNRECKONED)---------------------------------------------SUNDAY (1ST DAY)
OUR LORD RISES "THE MORROW-------------------------MONDAY (2ND DAY)
AFTER THE SABBATH" OR "THE
FIRST (DAY) OF THE SABBATHS

HIS EXPLANATION:

"The way in which this revelation came was simple in the extreme. It took the form of A BRIEF DIALOGUE WITH ONE WHO DREW NEAR TO THE ONE WALKING. Said that One to him, "Do you count time to one who is dead?" The reply was, "No, Lord". Said He, "NEITHER DO WE". Nothing remained but to worship and give thanks to the One Who had drawn near, and Who "setteth an end to darkness . . . and the thing that is his bringeth He forth to light" (Job XXVIII, 3 and 11). We well knew from that hour that the unknown factor in this great and solemn problem had been brought forth from its place of concealment in the Scriptures.

"SO IT WAS BY THIS SIMPLE MEANS THAT GOD CONVEYED THE KNOWLEDGE THAT FOR THE TWO UNBROKEN DAYS -- OUR SATURDAY AND SUNDAY -- THAT OUR LORD WAS "IN THE HEART OF THE EARTH" HE REFUSED TO RECKON TIME....

"It was not for several months after this that WE OBTAINED THE PROOF THAT GOD HAD ACTUALLY INTERVENED TO STAY THE MOON IN ITS COURSE AROUND THE EARTH FOR THESE TWO DAYS."

I don't believe that there were two unreckoned days while Jesus was in the grave or that the Moon stayed its course around Earth for two days.

However, I do believe in Joshua's Long Day. It is a type of Jesus' Long Day, when the Lord will cast down the asteroids of Rev. 8:8-11 to stop Gog's army that will be attacking Israel. The asteroid impacts will turn the Earth upside down, causing Jesus' Long Day on the Day of God's Wrath, the great and terrible Day of the Lord.

Joshua 10:11-13 says, "it came to pass, as they fled from before Israel, and were in the going down to Bethhoron (meaning house of hollowness), that THE LORD CAST DOWN GREAT STONES (i.e., asteroids) FROM HEAVEN UPON THEM UNTO AZEKAH (meaning dug over), AND THEY DIED: THEY WERE MORE WHICH DIED WITH HAILSTONES THAN THEY WHOM THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL SLEW WITH THE SWORD. Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites (meaning a sayer) before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, SUN, STAND THOU STILL UPON GIBEON; AND THOU, MOON, in the valley of Ajalon (meaning field of deer). AND THE SUN STOOD STILL, AND THE MOON STAYED, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher (meaning correct)? SO THE SUN STOOD STILL IN THE MIDST OF HEAVEN, AND HASTED NOT TO GO DOWN ABOUT A WHOLE DAY."

Of the future Day of the Lord, the Day of God's wrath, Isa 24:1 says, "Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and TURNETH IT UPSIDE DOWN, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof."

It is the Earth that changed its rate of rotation, not the staying of the course of the Sun and Moon, that caused a lapse in time on Joshua's Long Day and in Hezekiah's time, and will cause a lapse in future time on Jesus' Long Day. Jesus' name is Joshua from the Hebrew. The type is perfect. Since asteroid impacts cause Joshua's Long Day and Jesus' Long Day, an asteroid impact may have caused the shadow of the Sun to retreat in Hezekiah's day. The total loss of time has been figured as one day so far.

On page 420, Ware said that ONLY the "faithful ones, who died between our Lord's birth and His death...were raised with Him, that is, at the end of the hour at the opening of which He Himself had been raised in a body of glory."

On page 422, he wrote, "It would seem probable that they remained with the risen Saviour during the Forty Days and that it was then that they "went into the holy city, and appeared unto many". If so, they would have ascended at the time our Lord did from Olivet."

I think all the Old Testament saints were raised "in incorruption" (I Cor. 15:42) and were taken to Heaven on Resurrection Sunday in 30 AD.

THE TEN DAYS TO PENTECOST

Finally, this is what I have been looking for.

On page 505, Ware wrote, "WHY OUR LORD ASCENDED AFTER FORTY DAYS "THE TEN DAYS TO PENTECOST YET TO BE LIVED BY CHRIST AND HIS CHURCH AT THE SECOND ADVENT IN FULFILMENT OF THE LEVITICAL TYPE"

Ware called the the Pre-Trib Rapture the Second Advent and Christ's return later the Third Advent. Here, he is talking about the Pre-Trib Rapture.

To make a long story short, Ware thought that the Lord would return to Earth on an Ascension Day sometime after 1933, when he thought the time of the Gentiles ended, raise the rest of the dead in Christ, and stay on Earth with them 10 days until Pentecost. At that time, he would take the whole group to be raptured to Heaven. I wonder where he thought all those people would congregate for ten days.

THE "NINE DAYS" BETWEEN ASCENSION DAY AND PENTECOST

On page 508, I finally read Ware's startling news that "ONE THING IS QUITE CERTAIN AND THAT IS THAT OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST WILL RETURN TO THE EARTH AT HIS SECOND ADVENT (HE MEANS AT THE RAPTURE) AND REMAIN WITH HIS CHURCH FOR NINE DAYS BEFORE SUMMONING HER TO MEET HIM IN THE AIR."

I don't think Christ will set his feet on the Earth until he returns 7 months after the Day of God's Wrath. At the Pre-Trib Rapture, we will rise up to meet him in the air. All the saints will be caught up to Heaven before he returns, because they return with him 7 months after the Day of God's Wrath on unbelievers.

Of the day of Jesus' literal return to Earth, Zech 14:4-7 says, "And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal (meaning reserved): yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah (meaning my strength is Yahweh) king of Judah: and THE LORD MY GOD SHALL COME, AND ALL THE SAINTS WITH THEE. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the light shall not be clear, nor dark: But it shall be one day which shall be known to the LORD, not day, nor night: but it shall come to pass, that at evening time it shall be light."

On page 506, Ware said, "When forty of these fifty days between our Lord's resurrection and Pentecost had passed He left the earth and ascended up to Heaven. His doing so was a vital part of a perfect plan -- THE EFFECT OF HIS ASCENSION BEING TO SUSPEND THE COURSE OF THE FIFTY DAYS WHEN TEN HAD YET TO RUN."...

"God devised the plan that our Lord should ascend to Heaven after forty days. During His session at God's right hand and until the day of His return, the course of the typical fifty days WOULD BE SUSPENDED. In other words, BETWEEN THE ACTUAL DAY AND HOUR OF OUR LORD'S ASCENSION AND THE ACTUAL DAY AND HOUR OF HIS SECOND ADVENT (HE MEANS THE RAPTURE) THERE WOULD BE A VAST CHRONOLOGICAL HIATUS".

On page 507, Ware said that "this means that OUR LORD'S SECOND APPEARING (i.e., at the Rapture) WILL TAKE PLACE ON THE SAME DAY IN THE SOLAR YEAR AS HIS ASCENSION"

That is possible, but not absolutely necessary. In the past, I thought the Rapture would take place on Pentecost, but right now, I think it just might be on the upcoming Feast of Trumpets, Sept. 30 or Oct. 1, when the Moon is under Virgo's feet (Rev. 12:1, 2, 5). The reason is that the word "man" is neuter, and the word "child" is masculine. It must mean that the whole Body of Christ (Jesus, the saints caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture, and the Tribulation saints caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture) will be caught up to God on a Feast of Trumpets. That is when the Moon is under Virgo's feet. I went to YourSky. The new crescent Moon will be under Virgo's feet on October 1, 2008.

THE SECOND BOOK, MIRACLE OF TIME, BY FRANK L. PAINE

Paine seems to have followed the leading of A.E. Ware.

Re: the nine days, on page 73, Paine said, "At the opening of this Chapter we quoted 1 Thessalonians 3:13 and Paul's words: 'the parousia of our Lord Jesus Christ with all His saints'. This word 'parousia' simply means 'being present' or 'being alongside'. Is it really true that Jesus, and 'all His saints' who have been in the graves for the past nineteen hundred years are TO BE ALONGSIDE US IN THEIR IMMORTAL BODIES, WHILE WE ARE STILL IN OUR MORTAL FLESH, prior to our translation to His 'Father's House'?

"Well, the implication is clear: if ever the 'type' of the resurrection harvest is to be fulfilled, NINE MORE DAYS MUST ELAPSE, when the conditions of those first forty days at the beginning are restored. That is, no death in the Church, the graves emptied, and 'we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord' rejoicing worldwide in the knowledge that HE IS IN OUR MIDST, ONCE AGAIN IN PERSON, and has come alongside to comfort every heart and prepare, according to His promise, to receive us unto Himself."

I don't find any scripture that says that Jesus will put his feet on Earth until he returns 7 months (Eze. 39:12,13) after the Day of God's Wrath.

These books have not changed my mind. For the first time ever, I am looking for the Rapture on the Feast of Trumpets. The word "man" being neuter in Rev. 12:5 convinced me. The man child must refer to the whole Body of Christ.

Rev 12:1-5 says, "And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and THE MOON UNDER HER FEET, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered. And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. And she brought forth a MAN CHILD, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up (harpazo, to be taken up by force) unto God, and to his throne."

Rev 2:26,27 shows that the saints will reign with Christ "with a rod of iron." It says, "And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations: And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers: even as I received of my Father."

Incoming e-mail, Re: Sabbath?

I love your First Trump Rapture concept. It is enough for me to grab a hold and sink my teeth into for my blessed Hope. Serious, it all makes good sense and may our Faith in the Spirit of God's Word prevail and overtake and seize our Hope into becoming a reality this Feast of Trumpets on 1st Tishri!

Until then, may your own shield of Faith also protect you from your adversaries who have no hope and want to drag you into their own disbelief's. Agape

My reply

Thanks. As usual, I don't say it has to happen then, but it just might. Previously, I thought the Raptures would be on Pentecost and Trumpets, but now the Feast of Trumpets makes sense for both. For all the parts of the Body of Christ to be born into a new world on the Feast of Trumpets seems like something the Lord would do.

Thanks to YourSky, I was able to see when the Moon was under Virgo's feet. Saturn is still in Leo too. Leo represents Christ as the Lion of the tribe of Judah. Virgo, the 1st sign, represents Jesus as a baby. Leo, the last sign, represents him as King. Agape

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