Pro and Con 1487

Posted 5-16-08

Check out an iridescent cloud over Ohio, May 12, 09

Incoming e-mail, Re: A Ten Day Warning

What do you think of our ten day complete lack of GRB activity? Do you think that it's a warning?

My reply

Yes. The 10-day interval seems like a warning. We hadn't had a gap like that since the biggie on Sept. 16, 2008. Thanks for pointing that out.

GRB 090510A 2009/05/10 00:23:00 Swift 22:14:13 -26:36:20
GRB 090509A 2009/05/09 05:10:03 Swift 16:05:36 -28:24:13

(10 day interval)

GRB 090429C 2009/04/29 2009/04/29 Fermi 17:26:00 55:30:00
GRB 090429D 2009/04/29 18:03:57.51 Fermi 08:20:48 06:12:00
GRB 090428B 2009/04/29 13:15:11.06 Fermi 00:03:00 06:30:00
GRB 090429A 2009/04/29 05:30:03 Swift 14:02:48 32:09:48
GRB 090429B 2009/04/29 05:30:03 Swift 14:02:40.09 32:10:14.6
GRB 090428A 2009/04/28 10:34:38.46 Fermi 14:10:00 37:18:00
GRB 090427A 2009/04/27 23:26:27 INTEGRAL 15:43:43 -13:29:53
GRB 090427C 2009/04/27 16:30:23.81 Fermi 23:45:00 -34:35:00
GRB 090427B 2009/04/27 15:27:00.86 Fermi 14:00:00 -45:42:00
GRB 090426C 2009/04/26 16:33:49.27 Fermi 05:31:00 -09:40:00
GRB 090426A 2009/04/26 12:48:47 Swift 12:36:18.07 32:59:09.6
GRB 090426B 2009/04/26 01:35:35.23 Fermi 01:10:00 -19:12:00
GRB 090424A 2009/04/24 14:12:09 Swift 12:38:05.11 16:50:15.1
GRB 090423A 2009/04/23 07:55:19 Swift 09:55:33.08 18:08:58.9, the most distant ever discovered

King Abdullah of Jordan's ultimatum: peace now or it’s war next year

Richard Beeston and Michael Binyon in Amman

America is putting the final touches to a hugely ambitious peace plan for the Middle East, aimed at ending more than 60 years of conflict between Israel and the Arabs, according to Jordan’s King Abdullah, who is helping to bring the parties together.

The Obama Administration is pushing for a comprehensive peace agreement that would include settling Israel’s conflict with the Palestinians and its territorial disputes with Syria and Lebanon, King Abdullah II told The Times. Failure to reach agreement at this critical juncture would draw the world into a new Middle East war next year....

The initiative could form the centrepiece for Mr Obama’s much-anticipated address to the Muslim world in Cairo on June 4.

Re: SPRING 2009 – THE END? from the Five Doves site

BG Ellis (URL) THE RAPTURE - ON or BEFORE June 7, 2009?

I've been doing some hunting around to see if any other Messianic believers have taken note of the 4 upcoming eclipses that Pastor Mark has outlined for us. A gentleman, Greg Killian, who knows a lot about astronomy and the Bible with a vast web site with all kinds of very detailed Biblical studies has recently posted something very interesting on the eclipses and THE POSSIBLE JUBILEE YEAR, 2015....

Regarding the Jubilee (Yovel) year, Greg Killian says:

"One of the most interesting Yovel calculations comes from those who combine the opinion of the Rabbanan and Hakham Yehoshua. This novel idea[9] suggests that we count fifty years for the Yovel up until the destruction of the Temple. After the destruction of the Temple we revert to counting forty-nine years with the first year of the next cycle being the Yovel year. By combining Rabannan’s count and R. Yehuda’s count:

We find that the last Yovel (Jubilee) year was 5727 (1967), the year of the 6-Day War. This was the 48th Yovel year starting from the time of Ezra in 3416. The Yovel year which is 49 years later is 5776 (2015) "This novel calculation shows the following Jubilees and their significance:

Yovel Year 46 - 5678 (1917)

Shortly after the beginning of the 46th Yovel, the Balfour Declaration was ratified. Dated November 2, 1917 (17th Marcheshvan 5678), the Balfour Declaration is one of the biggest steps towards gaining international recognition for the Return to eretz Israel."

Yovel Year 47 - 5727(1967)

"The next Yovel year, according to this calculation, was in 5727. In Iyar 5727 (June of 1967), Yerushalayim, Yehuda, Shomron, the Golan, and Gaza came under Jewish control for the first time in centuries, and the move back to these areas, of eretz Israel, began."

Yovel Year 48 - 5776 ( 2015)

My reply

> > Greg Killian: This novel idea[9] suggests that we count fifty years for the Yovel up until the destruction of the Temple. After the destruction of the Temple we revert to counting forty-nine years with the first year of the next cycle being the Yovel year.

Nothing in my 49+ years of studying the Bible as hard as I can go gives me the slightest indication that it would be ok to count the Jubilee as a 50-year cycle up to the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD, then count the Jubilee as a 49-year cycle since 70 AD.

What I have learned in my studies is that any Jubilee cycle is a 49-year cycle. The Jubilee is the 50th year and also the first year of the new 7-year Sabbatic cycle and the first year of the new 49-year Jubilee cycle. Thus, the Jubilee cycle stays aligned with the even-paced march of the Sabbatic Years that started the day God rested after creating Adam.


Lev 25:8-13 says, "And thou shalt number seven sabbaths of years unto thee, seven times seven years; and the space of the seven sabbaths of years shall be unto thee forty and nine years (i.e., the 7th, 14th, 21st, 28th, 35th 42nd, and 49th years are Sabbatic Years). Then (i.e., in the 49th year, a Sabbatic Year) shalt thou cause the trumpet of the jubile (the upcoming 50th year, which is the 1st year of another Sabbatic cycle) to sound on the tenth day of the seventh month, in the day of atonement shall ye make the trumpet sound throughout all your land. And ye shall hallow the fiftieth year (i.e., the year that starts on the following Nisan 1), and proclaim liberty throughout all the land unto all the inhabitants thereof: it SHALL (i.e., in the future) be a jubile unto you; and ye SHALL return every man unto his possession, and ye SHALL return every man unto his family. A JUBILEE shall that fiftieth year be unto you: YE SHALL NOT SOW, NEITHER REAP that which groweth of itself in it, nor gather the grapes in it of thy vine undressed. For it is the jubile; it shall be holy unto you: ye shall eat the increase thereof out of the field. IN THE YEAR OF THIS JUBILE YE SHALL RETURN EVERY MAN UNTO HIS POSSESSION."

That returning to their possession seems prophetic of the year of the Second Advent. Dan 12:12,13 says, "Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. But go thou thy way till THE END be: for thou shalt REST (i.e., rest in heaven), and stand in thy lot (plot of ground in Israel) at the end of the days."


Psa 149:5-9 says, "Let the saints be joyful in glory (i.e., in Heaven): let them sing aloud upon their beds. Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a twoedged sword in their hand; To execute VENGEANCE (God's wrath) upon the heathen (unbelievers left on Earth on Tishri 1), AND PUNISHMENTS upon the people; To bind their kings with chains (probably 7 months later [Eze. 39:12,13] at Armageddon on the following Nisan 1, the first day of the Jubilee Year), and their nobles with fetters of iron; TO EXECUTE UPON THEM THE JUDGMENT WRITTEN: THIS HONOUR HAVE ALL HIS SAINTS. Praise ye the LORD."

> > Yovel Year 48 - 5776 ( 2015)

The year 5776 seems right. However, since the Jubilee Year starts on Nisan 1, I think our year will be 2016. Jesus should return on the first day of the Jubilee Year that starts on Nisan 1, 5776 (April 9, 2016).

Sabbatic Years are easy to determine. They divide by 7 evenly. The Jewish 5775 (2014/2015) will be a Sabbatic Year, as was last year, 5768. Therefore, 5775 cannot be the Jubilee Year, but 5776 (2015/2016) can be.

Some people think that the Jubilee Year starts on the Day of Atonement, Tishri 10. To me, Tishri 10 is not the beginning of a Jewish Civil, Sacred, Regnal or Jubilee Year. I think the Jubilee year was ANNOUNCED then, but began the following Nisan 1.

After extensive study of the Jewish Calendar, it is my understanding that Jewish Civil years start on Tishri 1, the Feast of Trumpets, in the fall. Sacred, Regnal and Jubilee years start on Nisan 1, the following spring.

Tishri 1, 3787 (27 AD) was Jesus' 30th birthday in a Sabbatic Year. He was beginning his ministry. Tishri 10, 3787 (27 AD) was the Day of Atonement when he stood up in the synagogue in Nazarus and read Isa. 61:1,2.

Isa. 61:1,2 says, "The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD".

Jesus stopped there. Luke 4:16-21 says, "he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and stood up for to read. And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord. And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him. And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears."

That year was 27 AD, a Sabbatic Year; 28 AD was a Jubilee Year.

3787 (27 AD) was a Sabbatic Year.
3788 (28 AD) was a Jubilee Year.
3790 (30 AD) was the Crucifixion year.

Tishri 1, 5775 will begin a Sabbatic Year.
Tishri 1, 5776 (Sept. 14, 2015) will begin a Civil Year that is also a Leap Year. It starts with the Pre-Wrath Rapture followed by God's Wrath.
Nisan 1, 5776 (April 9, 2016) will begin a Regnal, Sacred and Jubilee Year. I expect all the saints to return to Earth with Christ that day.

I'm hoping for the Pre-Trib Rapture May 29, 2009, Pentecost, the first day of the 2300-day shortened Tribulation. Counting the 2300 days by Jewish Inclusive Reckoning because it is a block of time, the Pre-Wrath Rapture would take place on Sept. 14, 2015, the Feast of Trumpets.

Incoming email, Re: "Pope tells of 'respect' for Islam"

He described religious freedom as a fundamental human right, and said he hoped the Catholic Church could play a role in the Middle East peace process.

The Pope says he is going on his eight-day tour - his first to the region as pontiff - as a "pilgrim of peace"....

King Abdullah welcomed the Pope to "the heartland of faiths for Christians and Muslims alike". The 82-year-old Pope praised Jordan's "respect for religion". The visit, he said, "gives me a welcome opportunity to speak of my deep respect for the Muslim community".

My thoughts

Isa 9:15 says, "The ancient and honourable, he is the head (i.e., the 6th head of the great red dragon of Rev. 12:4); and the prophet that teacheth lies (i.e., the 7th head), he is the tail" (because he is Satan possessed; Satan is the tail).

Incoming e-mail, Re: your comments to Mickey McNew 5/6 Five Doves

Hi, don't know if you appreciate comments back to your email, but I was wondering if you could claify something you wrote in the above mentioned letter on Five Doves.

You stated you believe Pre-Trib Rapture to be Pentecost 5/29/09......

Then you stated Pre-Wrath Rapture to be on Trumpet or 9/14/ this also the second coming of our Lord with his saints, or is this a "second" rapture of believers left behind from the 1st rapture???

I truly admire your insight and love to read your web page as well as the letters you send into the Five Doves.

thank you for being there for us who are trying to absorb as much as we can before the coming of of Lord. Bless you.

live by faith, not by fear
God is in Control....... \o/ maranatha

My reply

Thanks for your kind words. I love comments. Two heads are better than one.

> > Then you stated Pre-Wrath Rapture to be on Trumpet or 9/14/ this also the second coming of our Lord with his saints, or is this a "second" rapture of believers left behind from the 1st rapture???

It is a second Rapture, not the Second Coming. Those left behind at the first Rapture will be caught up with the rest of the Tribulation saints. All children, even those calling upon the name of the Lord will be caught up that time. The wrath of God is for unbelievers only.

I think the 2300 days of Dan. 8:13,14 run from the Pre-Trib Rapture, probably on Pentecost, May 29, 2009, to the Pre-Wrath Rapture of the Tribulation saints on the Feast of Trumpets, Sept. 14, 2015.

In between the Pre-Wrath Rapture, which is on the Day of God's Wrath, and the Second Advent are the 7 months of Eze. 39:12,13. I expect the return of Christ on Nisan 1, 5776 (April 9, 2016). That will be the first day of the Regnal, Sacred, and Jubilee Years. Agape

Pope, in Jordan, offers Church help for PEACE process

Fri May 8, 2009 - "Certainly I will try to make a contribution to PEACE, not as an individual but in the name of the Catholic Church, OF THE HOLY SEE," he told reporters on the plane taking him to Jordan.

"We are not a political power but a spiritual force and this spiritual force is a reality which can contribute to progress in the PEACE process," he said.

THE HOLY SEE has full diplomatic relations with most of the countries in the Middle East and a diplomatic agreement with the Palestinian Authority.


From the Latin Sancta Sedes, Holy Chair (not Peter's chair)
by Marilyn Agee (emphasis is mine)


They are not the same, but "The Pope is the ruler of both the Vatican City State and the Holy See" (
Wikipedia says, "The HOLY SEE is the episcopal jurisdiction of the Bishop of Rome, commonly known as the Pope, and is the preeminent EPISCOPAL SEE of the Roman Catholic Church, forming the central government of the Church. As such, diplomatically, and in other spheres THE HOLY SEE ACTS AND SPEAKS FOR THE WHOLE CATHOLIC CHURCH. It is also recognized by other subjects of international law as a sovereign entity, headed by the Pope, with which diplomatic relations can be maintained.[1]

"THE HOLY SEE SHOULD NOT BE CONFUSED WITH THE VATICAN CITY STATE, WHICH CAME INTO EXISTENCE ONLY IN 1929, WHILE THE HOLY SEE DATES BACK TO EARLY CHRISTIAN TIMES. Ambassadors are officially accredited not to the Vatican City State but to "the Holy See", and papal representatives to states and international organizations are recognized as representing the Holy See, not the Vatican City State.

"While all episcopal sees can be referred to as holy, the expression "THE HOLY SEE" (without further specification) is normally used in international relations (as well as in the canon law of the Catholic Church)[2] to refer to the central government of the Catholic Church....

"Three tribunals are responsible for judicial power. The Sacra Rota is responsible for normal appeals, including decrees of nullity for marriages, with the Apostolic Signatura being the administrative court of appeal and highest ecclesiastical court. The Apostolic Penitentiary is different from those two and, instead of dealing with contentious cases, issues absolutions, dispensations, and INDULGENCES." (
"The Holy See is especially active in international organizations. The Holy See has diplomatic relations with the European Union (EU) in Brussels, it is a permanent observer of the United Nations Organization (UN), Organization of American States (OAS) in Washington, African Union (AU), World Tourist Organization (WToO), World Trade Organization (WTO), World Health Organization (WHO), World Food Program (WFP), United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organization (UNESCO), United Nations Environment Program (UNEP), United Nations International Drug Control Program (UNDCP), United Nations Center for Human Settlements (UNCHS), Latin Union (LU), International Organization for Migration (IOM), International Labor Organization (ILO), International Fund for Agricultural Development (IFAD), and the United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO).

"The Holy See is also an observer on an informal basis of the World Meteorological Organization in Geneva (WMO), United Nations Committee of Peaceful Use of Outer Space (UNCOPUOS), International Strategy for Disaster Reduction (ISDR), International Maritime Organization (IMO), African Asian Legal Consultative Committee (AALCC) and the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO).

"The Holy See is a member of the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW), Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE), International Telecommunication Union (ITU), International Telecommunication Satellite Organization (ITSO), World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), Universal Postal Union (UPU), International Institute for the Unification of Private Law (UNIDROIT), United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), United Nations Conference on Trade and Development (UNCTAD), International Grains Council (IGC), International Committee for Military Medicine (ICMM), International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), and the Preparatory Commission for the Comprehensive Nuclear Test Ban Treaty Organization (CTBTO).

"In 1971, the Holy See announced the decision to adhere to the nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT) in order to "give its moral support to the principles that form the base of the treaty itself." The Holy See is also a participating state in the OSCE and a guest of honor to the Parliamentary Assembly of the OSCE.

Furthermore, the Holy See has a delegate to the Arab League (AL) in Cairo." (


Rev 1:19 says, "Write the things which thou hast seen (before the Rapture), and the things which ARE (at the time of the Rapture), and the things which shall be hereafter (after the Rapture).

Rev. 12:3 mentions a beast that influences certain earthly leaders from the Tower of Babel to Babylon III. It says, "a great red dragon (Satan), having seven heads (leaders of 7 world empires) and ten horns (10 kings not yet crowned at the time of the Pre-Trib Rapture), and seven crowns upon his heads". The 6th is the first beast of Rev. 13. He is not caught up in either Rapture. The 7th is the False Prophet, to be crowned Mid-Trib. He is the final Antichrist, the 2nd beast of Rev. 13. He is not caught up in either Rapture. Rev 19:20 says, "And the BEAST was taken, and with him the FALSE PROPHET that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone."

Speaking of the time of the Pre-Trib Rapture, Rev 13:1 says "And I stood upon the sand of THE SEA, and saw a beast (the great red dragon) rise up out of THE SEA (i.e., THE HOLY SEE), having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, AND UPON HIS HEADS THE NAME OF BLASPHEMY" (PONTIFEX MAXIMUS).


Rev 17:1-15 says, 1 "And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:
2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.
3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.
7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.
8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.
9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.
12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.
14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.
15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues."


1. Nimrod at Tower of Babel - Pontifex Maximus
2. Nebuchadnezzar at Babylon II - Pontifex Maximus
3. Head of Media-Persia - Pontifex Maximus
4. Head of Greece - Pontifex Maximus
5. Caesars of Holy Roman Empire - all Pontifex Maximuses


6. Pope of Ecclesiastical Roman Empire - Pontifex Maximus


7. False Prophet of Babylon III - Pontifex Maximus

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