Pro and Con 151, Uploaded 7-12-98

Incoming Email

Noah Troyer 30/40/50...I have found something interesting parallels between Noah and Noah Troyer. Troyer was born in 1831 that made him 48 (possibly 47) when he gave the 120 year warning in 1878. Noah was 480 years old when God told him to build the ark, and gave him the 120 year warning . There is 40 years from 1878 to 1917 when Israel came under control of the British and 30 years until Israel became a nation in 1948, then add the 50 years until now 40+30+50=120 you come to 1998.

Noah was 600 years old when the flood came, could this be conformation that we are on the edge of the 6000 years. SO AS IT WAS IN THE DAYS OF NOAH.

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Thanks for your web-site.  I've been checking it at least daily for the past week or two.  I don't know whether your prediction of May 31 is correct (how could anyone "know" in advance unless prophesying, which I know do you not claim), but after reading your book (about a year ago) and your web pages and other sites I've come across, I am enthusiastic that you've hit upon the truth.  Of course, I'll be disappointed if Pentecost comes and goes, but not shattered.  The church in the 1st Century probably thought it would be the last generation too, but they weren't, and the church nevertheless has grown and grown since then.

  The reason for my note, however, is that I cannot get the message of Matt. 26:40-45 out of my head.  Although I don't see how it relates to the rapture or end-times specifically, I think it does, in a sense, parallel the wise/foolish virgins.  Namely, Jesus told his disciples (3 times), in the Garden of Gethsamene, to STAY AWAKE, be on guard and "pray that you may not undergo the test."  Surely, whether May 31 is the appointed day or not, the least we can do, in the face of persuasive evidence suggesting that it may be the day, is to be on guard, awake and praying.

  I am a Roman Catholic  believer, and I intend to be emerging from the confessional just before midnight Jerusalem time, having already confessed my sins privately in my prayers to Jesus.  My love of Jesus, let alone my fear of being without Him, compel me to wait and watch.  COME LORD JESUS!

My reply

Sorry I did not get to answer in a timely manner. Have now worked my emails down quite a bit.

As you know, the Rapture did not take place on Pentecost, and I'm not shattered, either. Nothing could destroy my faith. I think you are right about the STAY AWAKE. This could be the most important time to stay strong. After you quoted "the test," I looked in all my versions. You quoted the NAB. The NEB has "Stay awake, and pray that you may be spared the test." The New Jerusalem Bible has, "Stay awake, and pray not to be put to the test." The Concordant Version has, "Watch and pray, lest you may be entering into trial." Sounds an awful lot like Lu. 21:36 (back to my main study Bible, the KJV): "Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man." Stay awake and pray fits both.

Jesus was tested, the apostles were tested, and we are tested one way or another.

It looks like Jesus was at the door in 1967. The things in Mt. 24:15-31 did not take place in the first century. They are still future. Therefore "this generation" in Mt. 24:34 cannot apply to that of 30 AD. It is the generation that saw Israel put forth leaves in 1967's Six-Day War. Webster's says a generation is 33 years, but the Bible makes it clear that the Israelites wandered in the wilderness 40 years while one generation died off. 1967 + 40 = 2007. It was June 7, when they took the temple area, Iyar, 28, 5727 on the Jewish Calendar. 5727 + 40 = 5767. The last day of that year is Elul 29, our Sept. 12, 2007. I think the Millennium starts the next day, Tishri 1, 5768, the Feast of Trumpets.

If the shortened Tribulation lasts 2300 days, as in Dan. 8:14, the time when the Jews can sacrifice at the temple plus the time that they cannot because the False Prophet desecrates it, the Tribulation/Seventieth Week of Daniel will appropriately start on the Feast of Weeks/Pentecost in 5761, our May 28, 2001.

Revelation is written as if the Rapture is at hand. It is "at hand" in 1:3 and 22:10. Jesus signs off with, "Surely I come quickly." He comes quickly at the Rapture, 2:5. The door is open in 3:8. We seem to be between his being at the door and it's opening.

James 5:7-9 warns, "Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early (former rain starts Tishri 1) and latter rain (starts Nisan 1). Be ye also patient; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh. Grudge not one against another, brethren, lest ye be condemned: behold, the judge standeth before the door."

Because the 10 kings have no kingdom as yet in 17:12, and are crowned when the Tribulation begins in 13:1, we can see that there must be a gap between the Rapture and the Tribulation. The time is short no matter how we cut it. I agree, now is the time to stay awake.

If the parable of the barren fig tree in Lu. 13:6-9 applies to this gap, and if the 4 years are 5758, 5759, 5760, and 5761, our time is very short. The Jewish 5759 begins on the Feast of Trumpets, Sept. 21.

I was so glad you confess your sins to Jesus. No man can forgive sin.

You've the right idea. Stay awake and stand fast. Gethsamene means the valley of oil, the very thing we need to be wise virgins. There is a lesson in this for all of us.

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I was just reading P&C 147. The TEN DAYS struck me like never before. I often watch TLC on cable Tv. It has prophecy tapes it runs quite frequently. This is in regards to the one young girl who witnessed the miracle at Fatima. She is still alive in a mission, in her 80's, and has been instructed to announce another miracle to occur, but only to announce it, is it TEN DAYS ?, before it is to happen. Mind you, the simularity is so shocking, that my physical mentality has a hard time accepting what I believe to have heard. There are also 4 or 5 other children, who, in the 50's, experienced a vision of what they believe to be the Mother Of Jesus. They also were to be instructed to announce a miracle to come, but only TEN DAYS ?, before it happens. Marilyn, I'm not making this up, and I'm sure there are others who have seen the same reports. I'm not one to go off and believe everything I see or hear. If that were the case, I'd believe the rapture to happen, and all clothing, etc. would be left in the very place we ascend to meet Our Lord. (I DON'T THINK SO !!) The children who have witnessed these events were of Catholic belief. I can't disregard it because of their religious affiliation, just because it is not my own. I tend to be very choosy about considerations, you could say, here a little, and there a little. When I told my daughter about the ten day advance warning, she made mention that it seemed odd to be TEN DAYS. I'd like to know if others have heard about the TEN DAYS as well. I don't expect you to list this in the P&C's, but it's something that I really find of interest. God Bless you and your family.

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2nd incoming email from the above:
I was aware that you don't have cable Tv. Yes, you are welcome to post part or all of the e-mail I had sent. I would very much like to know if others have stumbled across this information that might lead to further increased knowledge. In my wildest imagination, I should only wish that it would be a ten day call before the rapture. However, I won't outrule the possibility of it providing further insight, whatever the miracle is to be.

...I know your days are plenty busy caring for other family members, and you hardly have time for yourself. The Lord will reward you greatly, and I, too, remember you (and your health) in my prayers. God Bless

Incoming Email

>I am not a prophet, have never said I was one time.

You are the prophetess. You are defined by your work.

Also your are suggesting that:

"Suddenly, I was staring down at my open Bible. In that darkened room, with draperies closed and no chance of a stray light reflection from anywhere, there was a rectangle of light on one verse, Jeremiah 50:2. In awe, I read,"Declare ye among the nations, and publish, and set up a standard; publish, and conceal not."
So you are "Declaring" the truth God revealed to you. In another words, you are God's prophetess in my and other eyes and God's eyes as well.

Also you said:

"Honoring my prayer beyond anything I could have hoped for, God opened the eyes of my understanding. One night, I awoke with a start. Terrified, my heart beating like a bird trying to get out, I heard a masculine voice say, "Be still and know that I am God." My heart quieted instantly. I was still until daylight, but it was about 20 years before I realized that God opened the eyes of my understanding that night."

So, God gave you wrong understanding?

I'm not trying to be your judge or to be picky. I'm searching for the truth and I realized that more I do research, things looks worse for the Bible and her authors.

I do have huge problem.

As the verse is saying: God loved world so much, He gave His Son... etc"

I'm finding hard to believe that God is loving us that much and He is silent to his children for maybe 2000 years. One His word written on the sky would change of history of humankind. One small sentence, like: " I'm here" would change the all Earth and would change a lot of people. Before C. E. He was talking to Jews, now He is silent for almost 2000 years. Why? We need His guidance even more than Jews needed 2000 ago because we are now able to destroy ourselves.
We are bad because the most of us stopped to believe in Him because... nowhere we can find hard evidence of His love for us. A lot of people think that some smart ET's planted life on Earth. that would explained why they are not interested what we are doing here. Maybe they ARE interested because we do have so many reports about UFO sightings. Actually there is more evidences that we are planted and visited by ET's than about the Bible is the word of God.

We can call ET's demons. OK. How humankind can find the truth? How God can judge them is they are mislead. If they are mislead, than they are innocent. If you will mislead the child and he will hurt himself. Who is the bad guy? Child or deceiver?

Yes! You can say that His ways are different than ours etc. But we are made on His image and... look at the people! His image! Humankind... looks very bad. God's image.

Another thing. In Revelation we have The Beast and her image 666. I think that JW's rightly explained some of these prophecies. We will have to wait for the UN to be one world government. Than have to be Antichrist exposed.

I hope I didn't offend you Marilyn. Cheers

My reply

I am human, and not being a prophetess, I can make mistakes the same as you can. Even Elijah did not know everything at all times, but when "the word of the LORD came to Elijah" (I Kings 18:1), Elijah spoke pure truth. For instance, after slaying the false prophets of Baal, Elijah thought he was the only one left who worshipped the true God. He said, "I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away" (I Kings 19:14). However, God told him, "Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel" (I Kings 19:18).

As I have explained on my Web site, for the first few years, I thought the Translation of the Tribulation Saints was in the middle of the Tribulation. Then reading Daniel 11 WITH Daniel 12, I realized my mistake. The chapter division had kept me from seeing it at first. Because of the mention of Michael the Archangel, I associated it with the middle of the Tribulation, as in Rev. 12:7. But, it is on the day when there will be "a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time" (Dan. 12:1). Rapture II is on the Day of God's Wrath (Rev. 6:17), between the breaking of the sixth seal in Rev. 6:12 and the breaking of the seventh seal in Rev. 8. Now, time has shown that I did not have the time of the first Rapture right, either. I am still searching to know the truth of the matter. All along the way, all I can say is how it looks to me. You have the responsibility to search the scriptures daily and see if these things are so (Acts 17:11).

Understanding the Bible is a gradual learning process. As you proceed to study it, more and more comes clear. Everything is not dumped on you at once. The more you know about the whole Bible, the more you can see in one small passage, the more you can tie two passages together, the more you can recognize types and antitypes. It is like working a puzzle, and the picture gets clearer as you fit in the pieces. All the pieces are there, for Jesus said, "But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things" (Mk. 13:23). However, the word of the Lord is "precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken" (Isa. 28:13).

How to be saved is clear, but understanding prophecy requires the help of the indwelling Holy Spirit all along the way. He leads us up the steps to understanding. Sometimes, we misunderstand a passage and have to step back a bit and search for more clues. Yet, his prodding steers our course.

> I do have huge problem. As the verse is saying: God loved world so much, He gave
> His Son... etc"
> I'm finding hard to believe that God is loving us that much and He is silent
> to his children for maybe 2000 years. One His word written on the sky would
> change of history of humankind. One small sentence, like: " I'm here" would
> change the all Earth and would change a lot of people. Before C. E. He was
> talking to Jews, now He is silent for almost 2000 years. Why?

If God did not love us, he would leave us alone and let us destroy ourselves. By your own admission, God talked to Jews in the past, so you should know that he is real. Prophecies he gave the Jews have come true 100% so far, therefore, you should know that the rest of his prophecies will come true 100%. Since all things are already foretold in the Bible, why do you need his "I'm here" written in the sky now? You have the record of his presence already, not only in the Bible, but in the Earth and sky.

Romans 1:18-20 says, For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are WITHOUT EXCUSE."

Why his silence since the Scriptures were completed? simply because they are complete and because man's test is to walk by faith, not sight. It seems that angels were tested before Adam. Satan and 1/3 of the angels failed their test to obey God--and they could see God. Those who failed their test were sentenced to prison. Evidently, Satan appealed the sentence, saying something like, "How could a loving God consign his creatures to prison?"

One of the attributes of God is love, but another is perfect justice. It seems that to demonstrate to Satan that his sentence was just, God created man a little lower than the angels and not able to see God. He decreed that man's test would be that he must walk by faith, not by sight. If man, not being able to see God, could still obey him, God would be proved just in putting the fallen angels in prison. They disobeyed when they could see God.

Ours is the harder test. God has given man just enough information to be able to pass the test. When we were all as dead men, having sinned, God first promised to send a Saviour, then sent us a Saviour, His Son Jesus Christ, to take the punishment due us for our sins. Now, sin having been taken out of the way as an issue in salvation, our test is "What think ye of Christ? whose son is he?" (Mt. 22:42). Can you accept Him by faith? or do you have to see Him to believe?

For those doubting Thomases, who have to see him to believe, he will appear. On the Day of God's Wrath, the heavens will be rolled aside like a scroll and the Sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky. He will be seen on his throne, but I humbly advise you not to wait for that day.

Rev. 6:14 says, "And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"

Instead of waiting for that day, you would be better off to accept Christ now and watch for his coming in the air to take us to Heaven in the Rapture before the Tribulation starts. Luke 21:36 says, "Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man."

We are living in the end times. I am glad you are searching for the truth. Jesus said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me" (Jn. 14:6). You have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Please pray and tell Christ you accept him as your Saviour before it is too late. The alternative is too horrible to contemplate.

> How humankind can find the truth?

Look in the book of truth, the Bible. Check out what people say. None of us are infallible. We are just doing the best we can to figure things out.

> How God can judge them is they are mislead. If they are mislead, than they are
> innocent.

No one is innocent in God's eyes without Christ. Each of us is responsible to God. All have sinned. Romans 3:10 says, "There is none righteous, no, not one. That is why we need a Saviour. We have been provided one, if we will just accept him.

> look at the people! His image! Humankind... looks very bad. God's image.

Sure. "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" (Rom. 3:23). But to those that believe in Christ, "his faith is counted for righteousness" (Rom. 4:5).

You need Christ. He went through a terrible ordeal to save you. Don't let it be wasted. Heb. 2:9 says, "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man. For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings."

Jesus had to love you an awful lot to go through what he did for you. He had to live his life without sin and die a cruel death in your place. It wasn't easy. The night before he was to be crucified, Jesus prayed, "Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt" Mark 14:36. "And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him. And being in an agony he prayed more earnestly: and his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down to the ground" (Lu. 22:43,44).

As for the JWs, they are wrong about Christ, so whatever else they believe will not count. They say that Christ is Michael the archangel. That is not true. He is God. II Cor. 5:19 says, "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself." "Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

God created us. He decided what our test was to be. He said that man shall walk by faith, and he said that there is no other way to be saved but to accept his Son, Jesus Christ. We do not have any choice in how to be saved. What the Sovereign of the Universe says, goes. That's the way it is. We have to decide; will we or won't we accept Christ as our Saviour. We were put on this Earth to make this choice. If we accept Christ, we gain eternal life. Won't you make that choice today? All God's angels will rejoice over one soul that is saved. All Satan's fallen angels will rejoice over one soul that is lost. There is spiritual warfare going on for your soul. Choose which you will serve. As for me and my house, we choose God.

I am not offended. My heart cries out for you. My prayer is that you will be saved.

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> Since you missed the fact that the reference in Luke 21:29 (". . . and all the
> trees") blew the fig tree scenario out of the water; concerning a so called
> gathering of the Jews in Matthew 24:32 in the "Last Days," I beg to ask two
> questions of you:
> 1. Show me any place in the bible where the "last days" is still in our future
> (Please read Heb 9:26 for starters).

***From Marilyn: A good place to start. In Heb. 9:26, it says, "now once in the end of the world ("sunteleia ton aionon," full end of the ages) hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." We are living in the last of the three 2000-year ages of time, the Age of the Gentiles, the Age of the Jews, and the Age of the Church. Each age is made up of two great 1000-year days.

***We are also living in The Age of the ages. Eph. 3:21 says, To "Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end." But, the Greek of the last part is "eis pasas tas geneas tou aionos ton aionon," literally, to all the generations of THE AGE OF THE AGES.

***In this age of the ages are the Crucifixion, Resurrection, Ascension, completion of the scriptures, Pre-Trib Rapture, and 2,299 days of the Tribulation, Dan. 8:14's 2300 days less one.

***It is a bit of an oversimplification, but the time of man's testing basically runs for 7000 years. The last great 1000-year day is the Millennium, the Day of the Lord. "A wise man's heart discerneth both TIME and JUDGMENT" (Eccl. 8:5). The years of judgment are added because of transgressions. This period is the Tribulation.

***Re: the "last days" being still future. Isa. 2:2 says, "And it shall come to pass in the LAST DAYS, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it" Also in Mic. 4:1: "BUT in the last days...the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem." That is when Christ is King of kings and Lord of lords. Micah 4 continues, "And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares...neither shall they learn war any more."

> On another point, Daniel tells me that the "end" would come when Israel was
> SCATTERED! (Not gathered!) Your bible may say SHATTERED, but this is the exact same
> word in Hebrew! (Please read Daniel 12:7 then try to figure out Jeremiah 3:16 and wonder
> what "NEVER AGAIN" means! Jesus said the fig tree would NEVER AGAIN BEAR FRUIT -
> you missed that!

*** Dan. 12:7 says, "it shall be for a time (one year), times (two years), and an half (half a year); and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished." This is after the abomination of desolation is placed in the temple in the middle of the Tribulation, "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God (Petra), that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days....And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time (1260 days, 42 months or 3 1/2 years), from the face of the serpent" (Rev. 12:6,14).

***Jer. 3:16,17 says, "And it shall come to pass, when ye be multiplied and increased in the land, in those days, saith the LORD, they shall say no more, The ark of the covenant of the LORD: neither shall it come to mind: neither shall they remember it; neither shall they visit it; neither shall that be done any more. At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it." In the Millennium, they will not visit the ark of the covenant.

***In Mt. 21:18-20, Jesus cursed the barren fig tree, "and said unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever (eis ton aiona, for the age). And presently the fig tree withered away." This was to demonstrate that the barren fig tree would wither away in 70 AD. As this age ends and the Millennium begins, all Israel will be born in a day. Israel will finally have fruit. Isa. 66:8 says, "Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children." Her travail is the Day of God's Wrath.

> 2. Tell me how you missed the simple fact that "shooting forth" in your Fig tree
> scenario, as if this is about physical weaponry, is using that word as only an American
> would: "shooting a rifle for instance! This stretch is the most amazing I had EVER seen!

***Luke 21:29 says, "And he spake to them a parable: Behold the fig tree (Israel), and all the trees (other nations); When they now shoot forth ("thrust forward"), ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand (the Six-Day War started June 5, summer June 21). So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand."

***Shooting forth is "proballo," #4261 in Strong's, "to throw forward, i.e. push to the front, germinate:--put forward, shoot forth." Thayer's has "to throw push forward, thrust forward, put forward." Would "push to the front" or "thrust forward" make more sense to you?

> Marilyn, please . . . learn to bake, cook up something in the kitchen; for pete's sake
> stay away from eschatology!

***Should I pay attention to you or to the Lord? I saw light on Jer. 50:2. It said to publish and conceal not.

> You don't seem to know you are embarrassing yourself!

***I am being tested, and you are too. I will stand firm in my faith no matter what happens. I will deal with others in God's love, no matter what they say.

***II Tim. 4:5 says, "But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry." I Peter 4:8 says, "And above all things have fervent charity (agape love) among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins."

> When May of 1998 went by I don't think I would say another thing if I were you!

***So, you never make mistakes? Do you "say another thing" afterward? Humans are prone to make mistakes. We learn by our mistakes. If we all shut up forever when we made a mistake, there would be no one talking in this entire world. Language would be lost. There would be no one to teach a child how to speak or read.

> Hey I have an idea . . . learn to make fudge!

Would that do the work of the Lord?

> I await your reply!

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© 1998 Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 7-12-98