Pro and Con 1730

Posted 7-2-13


The statue of a male angel, found in Balikli Gol, Turkey, is dated 9987 BC. The standing stones at Gobeckli Tepe are dated 9587 BC. Adam was not created until 4043 BC, so this concerns the angels, not mankind. Gobekli Tepe is classified as pre-pottery Neolithic A-B.

Klaus Schmidt, head archaeologist at Gobekli Tepe, believes that what he calls this "cathedral on a hill" was a pilgrimage destination attracting worshipers from a range of 100 miles. Lots of butchered bones have been found from local wild animals such as deer, gazelle, pigs, and geese. These are thought to be from food hunted and cooked for congregants.

I don't think these megalithic circles were temples. I think they were calendar circles like Stonehenge. There is a stone with a hole in it that could have been the heel stone. The angels were probably just beginning to farm. They needed to know when to plant seeds. So far no traces of domesticated plants or animals have been found, but only four circles have been exposed. There are at least 16 more. There may be 200 standing stones. We don't know everything about this site yet. The Neolithic Revolution, the beginning of agriculture and animal husbandry is thought to have started around 9000 BC.

Maybe this site dates from 9000 BC instead of 9587 BC.

Regarding Gobekli Tepe, "The PPN A settlement has been dated to ca. 9000 BC....The reliefs on the pillars include foxes, lions, cattle, wild boars, herons, ducks, scorpions, ants and snakes."

This could be on the cusp of change. At nearby Nevali Cori, we find that "Apart from hunting, grains and legumes were also cultivated."

Lots of snakes carved into these pillars suggest that Satan had a hand in this.

In 2387 BC, before Noah's Flood, Gen 6:4 says, "There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown."

Those sons of God were angels. Job 1:6,7 gives us a glimpse of them.

It says, "Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them. 7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it."

Of the time after Noah's Flood (2387 BC), 2Sa_21:20 says, "And there was yet a battle in Gath, where was a man of great stature, that had on every hand six fingers, and on every foot six toes, four and twenty in number; and he also was born to the giant."

The six fingers are usually a sign that an angel is being portrayed.

In the picture, on the left pillar, a six-fingered angel is suggested as if he hauled the stone pillar at Gobekli Tepe on his back. No face is on the stone. His arms are long and his hands are on the back of the pillar, which is portrayed as if the angel hoisted it on his back. The "H" on the belt is the Kanaga symbol which stands for man (or an angel) and Orion. This angel, or his forebearers, came from the sky, from the planet Rahab, which is now our Asteroid Belt. The belt is portrayed on the pillar to tie in the Asteroid Belt.

On the other pillar is the bull with the Sun between its horns. It suggests Sun worship as it did later with Apis in Egypt. Mother/goddess figures have also been found in the general area near the Euphrates River in Turkey.

I don't think these circles are temples. I think the T-shaped pillars were cut, decorated, and placed in megalithic calendar circles similar to Stonehenge by the angels who left their own estate and came to Earth.


By Marilyn Agee

When he put an end to the angel's ancient illegal settlements on Earth, it looks like the Lord dried the sea and made the Moon out of pre-existing materials blasted off of the Earth by an asteroid impact after Satan's planet Rahab was split and became our Asteroid Belt.

The settlements and calendar circles built by the angels on Earth were covered with sand, rock, flint gravel, stone tools and animal bones when a piece of their former planet Rahab hit Earth and dug the Pacific Basin between 5700 BC and 5487 BC, 1657 to 1444 years before Adam. This allowed plenty of time for the Moon rocks to coalesce into the Moon we know today.

Catal Hoyuk, Turkey, is dated 7500 - 5700 BC.

A series of 'extraordinary' shrines were identified which showed clear evidence of bull veneration, a vulture cult, and signs of worship of a prehistoric mother goddess.

Collins says of Catal Hoyuk: "The magnificence of its art, tools, weapon and skilfully fashioned jewellery showed a level of technology and sophistication which has forced archaeologists to review completely their understanding of the development of civilisation"

"Asikli Hoyuk began at around 8,000 BC....Archaeologists have discovered large numbers of artefacts made from obsidian - black volcanic glass - as well as bone, antler and copper." (

Catalhoyuk, a group of mud-brick domestic buildings, "existed from approximately 7500 B.C. to 5700 B.C. It is the largest and best-preserved Neolithic site found to date." (


Farming did not put an end to the angel's civilization at Gobekli Tepe, I think the Lord did it when he made the Moon.

Gen 1:16,17 says, "And God made (asah, made out of existing materials) two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. 17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth".


Jude 1:6 says, "And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day."


Isa. 51:9,10 says, "Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of the LORD (the Son of God, the pre-incarnate Christ, Isa 51:1); awake, as in the ancient (qedem, aforetime, i.e., before Adam's) days, in the generations of old. Art thou not it that hath cut (chatsab, split) Rahab (rahab, proud, strong, blusterer, i.e., Satan's planet, now our Asteroid Belt), and wounded (chalal, to bore) the dragon (Satan)? 10 Art thou not it which hath DRIED THE SEA, the waters of the great deep; that hath made the depths of the sea a way for the ransomed to pass over?"

Zep_1:14 says, "The great DAY OF THE LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly."

On the Day of the Lord, Satan's asteroid Wormwood will impact Earth.

Rev 8:8-11 says, "And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; 9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. 10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter."

Netanyahu: Re: Peace Agreement With PA

"The call which implies that the Prime Minister would insist on a national referendum before approving any potential deal, was made in remarks at the start of the government's weekly cabinet meeting Sunday. "I think, that it is necessary that any agreement, if it is achieved, be submitted to the people for a decision," said Netanyahu.

The Prime Minister also stressed that while Israel is willing to begin negotiations immediately, and without preconditions, his government would not be making any compromises on security issues."

INCOMING EMAIL, RE: Will we know our loved ones in Heaven?

Will We Know Each Other in Heaven?

Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not understanding the Scriptures nor the power of God. For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven." Matthew 22:29-30

...It's been almost two months since my John left me; I've been thinking about him in Heaven and my going there some day. I've wondered about it. Yes, we will see Jesus again [1], -- BUT will we see and recognize each other realizing our past relationship?

The scriptures tell us, we'll not be:

Male or female
Of any earthly nationality

King David said, 'I will go to him.'

When King David's infant son was taken from him, David felt his loss very keenly -- but he also knew he would see him again. David declared, "Can I bring him back again? I will go to him" (2 Samuel 12:23). When Jesus was transfigured (or changed) before the eyes of some of His disciples and they glimpsed His heavenly glory, we're told that Moses and Elijah appeared with Him, therefore we retain our individuality in heaven (see Luke 9:28-36). Our new bodies will be like the body Jesus had after His resurrection. The Bible says, "Just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven" (1 Corinthians 15:49). -- Billy Graham [2]

"For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." Galations 3:26-28

I know the important thing is we will see our Lord, King Jesus. Just wondering ... what's your view?

".. we are the sons of God, and it doth not yet
appear what we shall be; but we know that,
when He shall appear, we shall be like Him.."
I John 3:2 [3]

[1] (Titus 2:13, 1 Cor. 15:12-57)...


Yes, we will definitely know our loved ones in Heaven.

After my husband died Dec. 27, 2011, I worried about whether it was ok to cremate the body. I had to, no money to do otherwise. I was already behind with the bills. Family had to help me to even do that. He wanted to be buried in the National Cemetery. We did manage that. I worried about whether we could be together forever after I got in Heaven. Before he died, I told him I loved him so much, I wanted to be with him forever.

I worried about this scripture: "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven." I thought that we were already married, and had become one flesh, but I was not sure how it was going to come out in the end. It bothered me. I couldn't be happy without him.

At that time, I did not know if there were female angels. Only male angels are mentioned in the Bible.

On the following April 2, Ed was allowed to visit me in his celestial body. He strode into the bedroom at a good clip, grinning from ear to ear. He wasn't 87 any more. He looked 30 or 33. I was propped up on the bed to watch TV, but hadn't turned it on yet....He came up between the bed and dresser, and just stood there facing the direction he came in. I got the message, "No touch," as it was with Jesus early on Resurrection Day, and started asking him questions as fast as I could get them out, and they just popped onto my mind.

I said:

"Are you 30 or 33?" He said, "33."
"Can we be together forever? He said, "Yes."
"Are there female angels in Heaven?" He said, "Yes."
"Have you gotten with your family?" He said, "Yes."
"Have you gotten with my family?" He said, "Yes."
"Do you have a piano?" He said, "Yes" and walked through the wall.

He is ok. He and both our families are ok. They are all awake, and Ed and I can be together forever. You and your husband can be together forever. Thank you Lord.

He looked normal, walked normal, had on a black suit that looked like silk shirt material the way it flowed around his shin. His voice was normal, but we couldn't touch, and he could walk through the wall. Now, my mind is at rest on that issue. I know we can be together forever. So can you and your husband.

In Mat_22:32, Jesus said, "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living." They are all awake. The asleep in Christ is just from our earthly point of view. Agape


"June 27, 2013 - SPACE - NASA said the 10,000th near-Earth object (NEO) has been discovered using the Pan-STARRS-1 telescope in Hawaii. Astronomers spotted asteroid 2013 MZ5 on the night of June 18, marking a significant milestone for the NEO search. There are at least 10 times that many more to be found before we can be assured we will have found any and all that could impact and do significant harm to the citizens of Earth. NASA spokesperson said they're asking citizen scientists, along with industry professionals, to focus on detecting and characterizing asteroids and learn how to deal with potential threats. The space agency also invited industry and potential partners to offer up some ideas on accomplishing NASA's goals to locate, redirect and explore asteroids."

A POST ON FIVE DOVES, RE: "Reply to Agee about "Patti C (25 June 2013) "THE TEN VIRGINS"

You said:
To me, those that are foolish are the lukewarm Laodiceans. Unless they repent, they will get left behind.

You are saying that the foolish virgins are saved? Yet the bridegroom says to the foolish virgins "I never knew you". If the bridegroom never knew them I would think that they were never saved in the first place. The foolish to me would be the people in church that think they are save by going to church or doing good works but have never really known the Lord. These would be very foolish and would realize later their mistake. Goes back to grace or works thing. David Blackman


Yes. The foolish virgin's are saved. Their lamps are lit. They have some oil of the Holy Spirit. Their lamps are sputtering and threatening to go out, but they have not gone out. They just need more oil of the Holy Spirit to keep them burning brightly.

These foolish ones are still virgins. They have just accepted Christ and that's it. They haven't gotten close to him the way a bride should do. They are lukewarm Laodiceans, and Jesus tells them to buy of him white raiment or he will vomit them out of his mouth.

Rev 3:19 says, "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent."

When they are caught up in the Last-Trump Rapture, they have washed their robes in the blood of Christ.

Rev 7:14 says, "These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

Evidently, it takes getting left behind at the First-Trump Rapture to wake them up. Agape

A post on five doves, Gino (25 June 2013): "RE: Patti C: 06.24.13"

Patti, You explained about the three stages of the resurrection of the believers.

I was wondering, into which of the three stages would the rising of the two witnesses go? Thank you, Gino


The two witnesses are part of the First Resurrection. The thousand years divide the First Resurrection from the Last Resurrection.

Rev_20:5,6 says, "But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection. 6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years."

Mat 22:31,32 says, "But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, 32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living."

I can vouch for that. Ed came to see me in his celestial body. He is not asleep, he is awake. He had visited his family and my family, so they are all awake.

Old Testament saints are awake, because "they desire a better country". The dead don't desire anything.

Heb 11:15,16 says, "And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. 16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city." Agape


By Marilyn Agee

In the Parable of the Ten Virgins, the fact that all ten have LIGHTED LAMPS tells me that they have ALL accepted Christ. They are all in possession of SALVATION.

Isa 62:1 (NKJV) " For Zion's sake I will not hold My peace, And for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, Until her righteousness goes forth as brightness, And her salvation AS A LAMP [THAT] BURNS."

The lamps of all 10 virgins are burning, but the lamps of 5 are sputtering, threatening to go out.

The only thing to be decided after that is which Rapture they can participate in. The only thing that counts then is how much oil of the Holy Spirit they have in their bodies. Are their lamps burning brightly so Christ can see them shining like stars? Or, are their lamps threatening to go out?

Those with lamps burning brightly are Philadelphians. All will go in the First-Trump Rapture. The Lord has nothing to say against the Philadelphians.

Those with sputtering lamps are Laodiceans. Those that confess their sins as per I John 1:9 will go in the First-Trump Rapture. Those that do not will go in the Last-Trump Rapture. Christ will wipe away their tears, but they will not be his Bride.

And what was their sin? Only being lukewarm. He would rather they be hot or cold.

Mat 25:1-13 (NKJV) says, "Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to TEN virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. 2 "Now five of them were wise, and five [were] foolish. 3 "Those who [were] foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them, (i.e., they took their burning lamps, but no extra oil in their vessels (bodies). 4 "but the wise took oil in their vessels (i.e., bodies) with their lamps. 5 "But while the bridegroom was delayed, they all slumbered and slept. 6 "And at midnight a cry was [heard]: 'Behold, the bridegroom is coming; go out to meet him!' 7 "Then all those virgins arose and trimmed their lamps. (i.e., all ten lamps are burning) 8 "And the foolish said to the wise, 'Give us [some] of your oil, for our lamps are GOING OUT.' (i.e., the foolish virgin's lamps start to sputter, threatening to go out) 9 "But the wise answered, saying, '[No], lest there should not be enough for us and you; but go rather to those who sell, and buy for yourselves.' 10 "And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut.

(i.e., right there, the foolish virgins lost their chance to be part of the Bride of Christ, and it is irretrievable)

11 "Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, 'Lord, Lord, open to us!' (i.e., after the First-Trump Rapture of the Bride of Christ) 12 "But he answered and said, 'Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.' (i.e., the Bridegroom should know his Bride) 13 "Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour [fn] in which the Son of Man is coming."

How can we avoid this situation? Use I John 1:9. The KJV says, "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

When we first accept Christ, all past sins are forgiven. When we sin after that, we must confess that sin to bring it under the blood of Christ. That is how we wash our robes.

Rev 7:14 says, "These are they which came out of GREAT TRIBULATION, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

These come out of GREAT TRIBULATION, but the first group come out before the Great Tribulation starts.

The first group includes Old Testament saints and New Testament saints. These are represented by the 24 elders. They are the 12 patriarchs and the 12 apostles of Israel.

Rev 4:1 After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, COME UP HITHER, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter."


Num 10:1-4 says, "And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2 Make thee TWO TRUMPETS of silver; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest use them for the calling of the assembly, and for the journeying of the camps. 3 And when they shall blow with them (i.e., both), ALL the assembly shall assemble themselves to thee at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation. 4 And if they blow but with ONE TRUMPET, then the princes (i.e., the 24 elders), which are heads of the thousands of Israel, shall gather themselves unto thee."

The elders are caught up at the FIRST-TRUMP RAPTURE, so is the Bride of Christ.

Rev 4:1-4 says, "After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. 2 And immediately I was (lit., became) in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one (the Lord Jesus Christ) sat on the throne. 3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper (last stone in the breastplate) and a sardine stone (first stone in the breastplate, i.e., Jesus is both the first and the last): and there was a rainbow (i.e., Saturn's rings) round about the throne (on Saturn, Eze 1:1,26-28), in sight like unto an emerald (Judah's stone in the breastplate, i.e., Jesus is the Lion of the tribe of Judah). 4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders (12 patriarchs and 12 apostles of Israel) sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold."


Rev 5:8-10 says, "And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odours, which are the prayers of saints. 9 And they sung a NEW SONG, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation; 10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on (epi, on or over) the earth."


Rev. 14:1-5 says, "And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. 2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: 3 And they sung as it were a NEW SONG before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and NO MAN COULD LEARN THAT SONG BUT THE HUNDRED AND FORTY AND FOUR THOUSAND, which were redeemed from the earth. 4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. 5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God."


First, gather the Bride from one end of HEAVEN to the other.

Mat 24:31 says, "And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of HEAVEN to the other."

These are the Bride of Christ that are already in heaven. They were caught up at the FIRST TRUMP.

Second, gather from the EARTH the 144,000 Israelites and the great multitude that no one can number. These are caught up at the LAST TRUMP.

Mar 13:27 says, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the EARTH to the uttermost part of heaven."

Heb 12:22-24 says to them, "ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the HEAVENLY JERUSALEM, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY AND CHURCH OF THE FIRSTBORN, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant".

When the Last-Trump saints get to heaven, the Bride saints are already there. Agape

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