Pro and Con 187, Uploaded 9-30-98, PM

Note: 9-30-98 (Tishri 10, 5759, Yom Kippur). On TV, I just saw the "Rapture" (a yacht) dock in Newport Beach, CA. This was skippered by the man who was just released from prison in Mexico. What a great day on which to arrive home. Reminds me of the "Exodus," a ship loaded with Jews that wanted to return to the land of Israel before they became a nation again.

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FROM CAPS. Just a couple of observations. There is a TRUMPET--singular, blown on the DAY OF ATONEMENT. This is the Jubilee trumpet. The Hebrew word for Jubilee--YOBEL- is used only on three occasions in the O.T. -in Ex. 19:19- in Joshua ch. 6 and in Lev. ch. 25 when discussing the Jubilee trumpet to be blown on the DAY OF ATONEMENT. The counting of 49 years in Lev. ch. 25 seems to parallel the 7 Priests marching around Jericho 7 times blowing 7 trumpets--and then on the 50th "blowing" the walls falling down.The year of Jubilee was also to be the 50th year. Could this perhaps be THE Last Trumpet? It doesn't hurt to watch. Also re the Harvest Moon--the Sky and Telescope magazine made an error. The Harvest Moon is October 5, 1998 at 4:12 p.m. EDT.

This is from the 5 Doves site:
"The Days of Noah"

Very important to Sukkot (Tabernacles) is that it is the major harvest festival of the year. It is Chag He'asif (the Feast of the Ingathering).

Note: Wouldn't the harvest be from the year 5758?

Also, Sky and Telescope made an error in their magazine last month. The Harvest Moon is October 5, 1998 at 4:12 p.m. EDT.

My reply

It doesn't hurt to be ready on Yom Kippur (Day of Atonement), but it is on Wednesday (Sept. 30) in Tishri, the month of the former rain. Sukkoth (Tabernacles is on Monday (Oct. 5), also in Tishri. Yes, this harvest is of growth during 5758.

I downloaded this from the Internet. Jewish sages say that:
> As to the trumps the Feasts are called by the names
> Pentecost= First trump
> RoshHaShanah=LAst trump
> Atonement= Great trump

This fits the First Rapture on Pentecost, the second on the Feast of Trumpets and God's acceptance of the remnant of Israel on the following Day of Atonement, doesn't it.

I'm glad that I remembered how to figure the harvest moon correctly. I wondered how they could arrive at the earlier date. Thanks for letting me know. You would think Sky and Telescope would get it right, but that's the way human beings are. We can all make mistakes.

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Re:TURTLEDOVES: FROM CAPS:
In a book "All The Birds Of The Bible" author Alice Parmelee has the following comments:

On pg. 64 she writes:"It's (the turtledove--TD) arrival in Palestine every spring when "the voice of the TD is heard in our land", is one of the most striking events of the bird year."...."Only from April to October can the TD be obtained(for sacrifices), for they spend the winter in Africa. This is the reason another bird had to be authorized for the winter sacrifices."

An author by the name of Henry Tristram reports an account of the TD 's arrival in April (in Palestine). He reported that "while other songsters are heard chiefly in the morning...the TD immediately on its arrival pours forth from every garden, grove, and wooded hill its melancholy... yet soothing, unceasingly from early dawn till sunset."

Later, Parmelee on pg.183 says "April in Palestine might well have been called stork or turtledove month. The barley harvest was usually under way when the TD appeared in veritable clouds and settled down to feed on clover and leguminous plants. Tristram said that 'they stock every tree and thicket.. they perch on every tree and bush--they overspread the whole face of the land'. And they sing from dawn to dark."

After researching 20--25 books on this subject, here is what I have concluded.It is very difficult to determine if the TD "summers" in Palestine or goes back to Europe in the summer. For sure most of the TDS summer in Europe and winters in Africa. Yet some maps on their migration show Palestine being a possible site for their summer breeding. The above account would seem to indicate that in April the TD heads North to Europe - but Palestine may also be a summer breeding ground as well as Europe. If this is true then the season of the TD in Palestine would be from April to October--fitting a Pentecost timing for Song of Sol. ch 2. However, I wonder if the above account is possibly describing the northern migration of the TD in April THROUGH Palestine back to Europe. I simply do not know. Based on the above infor. it appears that there is a Good chance that the TD does summer in Palestine from April to October.Tristram wrote some journals in the 1800's about his visits to Palestine. I will try to get his books if possible and will update you if I am able to obtain them. What do you think the phrase in S.o S. ch 2 re the "vines are in BLOSSOM" RSV ,VS.13 means? Does this refer to the flower part of the grape vine--before the grapes come on the vine, or to the grapes themselves being in blossom?? Thanks.

My reply

Wow! Thanks so much for looking all this up. I am really grateful for I have no time to do it and the libraries here in Riverside, CA, are not nearly as good as I am used to. They lack money for new books, have cut help and hours, etc. When I lived in Yorba Linda, I used four public libraries, in Yorba Linda, Anaheim (2), and Fullerton. They were so much better.

> arrival in Palestine every
> spring when "the voice of the TD is heard in our land", is one of the most
> striking events of the bird year."...."Only from April to October

Then because of the former and latter rains in Tishri and Nisan, our Rapture time-slot is likely to be limited to Iyar through Elul (our Apr/May through Aug/Sept). Of the seven feasts, only Pentecost is in this time-slot.

> What do you think the phrase in S.o S. ch 2 re the "vines are in BLOSSOM" RSV ,VS.13 means?

I take it to mean the blossom that precedes the grape. Green's Interlinear has under the Hebrew words, "and the vines (by) the blossom give a fragrance." In English, the phrase would make sense without the (by) if you added commas: "and the vines, the blossom, give a fragrance." Unger says that grapes begin to ripen in Sivan. They produce through Elul, when the vintage begins....

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Re: Rapture = Biggest 'HOME RUN' ever
Hi sweet lady, I follow you closely and am delighted that Ed is better. Talk about trials and tribulations: all you did was write a book about the biggest event of the century and you get what-for. I suspect you are close to the whole truth because that old serpent is attacking hard, and if you weren't close to God, 'it' wouldn't be bothering w/ you half as much. You have been a major wake-up call even to those who don't agree with you. It can't be easy for them if they are all pre or all post oriented. Then the pan tribbers thought, why fight? So you have been a spark to all positions, but how can they argue when your position covers both sides so eloquently. I've seen one unfortunate attack regarding the Grace/works/merit doctrine, but since this is not an issue here, it too,will pass. Have you used Dake in your research? Have you read Allen Beechick's book, "The Pre-tribulation Rapture?". Have you catalogued the double rapture scriptures? (I'd love a copy, if you have) Allen beautifully resolves the polarized interpretation of the controversial scriptures by using the double reference concept  and comes up with two raptures. Dake has lists of lists and references that outdo most others. He must have been the first human computer.I will continue to visit your site with great admiration and anticipation.

He 9:48 Christ...will appear a second time to bring to full salvation those who are (eagerly, constantly and patiently) waiting for and expecting Him, (And lovin' Him)

My reply

Thanks for such a nice email. I am certainly praising God that Ed has had no setbacks. He has gotten well slower than some, but he is 74 too, and his recovery is steady.

In light of recent home run records by McGwire and Sosa, I thought, "I love your subject: Rapture = Biggest 'HOME RUN' ever. It will be outta the park. I watched McGwire hit his 70th at his last at bat this year. That was neat.

> Have you used Dake in your research? Have you read Allen Beechick's book, "The
> Pre-tribulation Rapture?".

No to both. I have been studying the Bible since before 1960. Early in my studies, I read everything I could find for seven years, about an 18" stack of books every week. But, I got frustrated. I couldn't find answers to some burning questions. Either that part was left out or the author went off on a fanciful trip that I knew wasn't true. I opened my Bible, put my hands on it, and asked the Lord to show me. Since then, I have mainly used as many different versions of the Bible as I can get my hands on, Strong's and Young's concordances, Green's Interlinear, the LXX, plus Thayer's and Gesenius' lexicons. I have "The Treasury of Scripture Knowledge," but don't use it. Lists are what someone else has found. There is more in the Bible to be uncovered than any of us have found. I have to read Scripture itself. I have read quite a few other books along the way, but not Dake or Beechick. The latter sounds especially interesting.

> Have you catalogued the double rapture scriptures?

Not exactly. I just use the scriptures to explain my view, which is on my Web site. The file is 2rapt.html...

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Just wanted to drop you a line about the Celestine Prophecy. I did read the book a few years ago when I was still in my search for the truth.  The Celestine Prophecy is totally New Age and should be avoided at all costs.

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how much consideration do you have for Feast of Tabernacle being the rapture of the living saints?

My reply

Not a whole lot. The rainy season began with Rosh HaShannah, Tishri 1, the time of the former rain. Song of Sol. 2:11 shows that winter is past and the rain over and gone. Since the Rapture is probably not in the rainy season, and the feasts of both Tishri and Nisan (latter rain) are in rainly times, the only feast that is left is Pentecost. I am hoping for Pentecost, 1999.

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I heard on a CNN Headline faktoid, that the world population will reach 6 billion sometime before the end of 1998. I think I also remember reading on Weekend News Today that the population of Israel will reach 6 million sometime soon. The number 6 is the number of man and maybe man's number is up. Maybe there is no connection in these numbers but I found it interesting to ponder just what it might mean. I don't need a response. I hope all is well, and I thank you and Ed for all the hard work. Sincerly...

My reply

Thanks. Maybe this is marking the 6000th year for us.

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Yom HaKeseh: The Hidden Day
In Psalm (Tehillim) 27:5 it is written, "For in the time of trouble He shall hide me in His pavilion; in the secret of His tabernacle shall He hide me; He shall set me up upon a rock."

Yet another name for Rosh HaShanah is Yom HaKeseh, "The Day of the Hiding" or "the Hidden Day." The term keseh or keceh is derived from the Hebrew root kacah, which means to "conceal, cover, or hide." Every day during the month of Elul, a trumpet is blown to warn the people to turn back to G-d, except for the thirtieth day of Elul, the day preceding Rosh HaShanah. On that day the trumpet is not blown, and is therefore silent. This is because much about Rosh HaShanah is concealed and shrouded in mystery. The mystical aspect of Rosh HaShanah is indicated in Scripture: "Sound the shofar on the New Moon, in concealment of the day of our festival" (Psalm [Tehillim] 81:3). Satan, the accuser, is not to be given notice about the arrival of Rosh HaShanah, the Day of Judgment.

Rosh HaShanah is called Yom HaKeseh, or the Day of the Hiding, because it was hidden from satan (Ha satan), the adversary. The Bible says that satan comes to rob and to steal (John [Yochanan] 10:10, and to confuse (1 Corinthians 14:33). Because it is the Day of Judgment, it is symbolically hidden from satan (satan did not know and understand the plan of the cross [tree], First Corinthians 2:7-8). This was hidden from him as well. Believers never said when the day of Rosh HaShanah was; they simply said, "Of that day and hour no one knows, only the Father."

One of the reasons most often given to disclaim that the resurrection of the dead and the catching away of the believers is on Rosh HaShanah is the statement given by Yeshua in Matthew (Mattityahu) 24:36, as it is written, "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but My Father only." Because Rosh HaShanah was understood to be the hidden day, this statement by Yeshua is actually an idiom for Rosh Hashanah. Thus it should be given as proof that He was speaking of Rosh HaShanah because Rosh HaShanah is the only day in the whole year that was referred to as the hidden day or the day that no man knew.

Spiritual Application (Halacha). Rosh HaShanah takes place on the new moon. Colossians 2:16-17 says that the new moon will teach about the Messiah. The Jewish (biblical) month is based upon a lunar cycle. The moon can barely be seen as the cycle begins. But then the moon turns toward the sun and begins to reflect the light of the sun. The sun in the sky is a picture of Yeshua (Malachi [Malachie] 4:2), and the moon is a picture of the believers in the Messiah. The sun has its own light, but the moon's light is a reflection of the sun. When we first become believers in Yeshua, we can hardly be seen spiritually, and we know very little about G-d. But then our lives begin to revolve around the Messiah as the moon revolves around the sun. As we begin to turn more and more toward the center of creation, we begin to reflect that light (Yeshua) more and more, just as the moon reflects the light from the center of the solar system....

I will never stop looking up but am grateful for more time to spread the Good News. A Sister in Christ

My reply

Thanks for the information.
> "For in the time of trouble He shall hide me in His pavilion; in the secret
> of His tabernacle shall He hide me; He shall set me up upon a rock."

This seems to be Rapture II, on the day of Jacob's trouble, Rosh HaShannah, 2007.

The secret of His tabernacle indicates where the "rock" (the planet Heaven) is located. Among other things, the tabernacle stands for Heaven, where Christ's throne is. The curtain had ten panels with cherubim embroidered on them depicting the original ten planets in our solar system: Mercury, Venus, Earth, Mars, Rahab (now the Asteroid Belt), Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune and Pluto. The Earth was represented by the curtain that hung over the back corner of the tabernacle. This is why Mk. 12:10 says, "The stone (Christ) which the builders rejected is become the head of the corner."

According to Josephus, the seven candlestick lamps depicted the Sun and the naked-eye planets: (1) Sun, (2) Mercury, (3) Venus, (4) Earth, (5) Mars, (6) Jupiter, and (7) Saturn. The semicircular arms of the candlestick represent the orbits of these planets. It is easy to see why Saturn is called the third heaven. Looking to the east from Earth, we find Mars, Jupiter and Saturn.

In Gen. 3:24, we can see reflected that cherubim (plural) are placed between Eden on Earth and the Tree of Life in Heaven (Rev. 22:2). There had to be at least two cherubims. There are, Mars and Jupiter. There also was a flaming sword placed to the east of Eden. It represents an asteroid from Satan's planet that was split apart. The Asteroid Belt is between Mars and Jupiter.

This shows that the planet Rahab was broken up before Adam was placed on Earth. That breakup and the shards that shot out into surrounding space from the explosion may have caused the Earth to become waste and desolate because of an asteroid impact (Gen. 1:2).

Mars seems to have been very hard hit. She is badly scarred on one side and has lost most of her water and atmosphere. It makes me wonder if comets are actually made up of dust and water blasted off of Rahab and Mars. Our upper atmosphere gets hit by about six small water comets every day. Where do they come from?

> the thirtieth day of Elul

I think you mean the 29th....

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FWD: Organization: Seek GOD First Ministries:
"JERUSALEM, Israel - Was a burial cave discovered in the Jerusalem suburb of Talpiot the final resting place for one of Jesus' twelve disciples? Remarkable evidence found inside the tomb seems to indicate so; and this evidence may also bear direct witness to the Savior.

"The "Valley of the Judgment of God" in Jerusalem (above) was a popular site for burial among the early Christians. Inside one first century burial cave, dedications "[To] Jesus, the Lord," and, "Jesus... [who] Ascended", were found by Israeli archaeologist"

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This is a jubilee year---no harvesting allowed in this year!!

Waitin' and Watchin'

My reply

Good point. We are wheat. I had thought the Jubilee sounded good because people were to be forgiven debts, and it would be a joyous year for us.

However, if the Jubilee year started with the beginning of the Jewish Sacred Year last Nisan 1, 5758 (March 28, 1998) and ends next Nisan 1, 5759 (March 18, 1999), there would be no conflict with Pentecost next May.

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thank you for responding to my previous inquiry on Ezekiel 38. There is one passage of scripture in Ezekiel 39 that continues to bother me concerning the battle of Gog and Magog and why I want to believe that this battle takes place at or near the beginning of the Tribulation. That passage of scripture is Ezekiel 39.9:

"And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years:"

It is inconceivable to think that Israel will continue to burn these weapons into the Millennial reign of Christ. He will surely have to "recreate" the Earth after the great destruction that it will sustain over the course of the Tribulation period.

It is my understanding that these Russian weapons are made of a type wood that is harder than some metals.

My reply

Ezek. 38:18,19 makes it clear that this is the Day of God's Wrath. His "fury" comes up in his face. He speaks "in the fire of my wrath." Ezek. 39:20 shows that "the mountains shall be thrown down...and every wall shall fall to the ground." These mountains are the two pieces of the asteroid of Rev. 8:8,10. They are part of the seven trumpet judgments that hit Earth that day. Ezek. 38:23 is when they see the Sign of the Son of Man (Mt. 24:30).

Ezek. 39:4 says, "Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands...I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured." That is the united nation's army. It won't fall until the end of the shortened Tribulation. Verse 7 says, "I WILL NOT LET THEM POLLUTE MY HOLY NAME ANYMORE." That is the beginning of the Millennium.

The next verse shows that this is what so many scriptures refer to as "that day." Verse 8 says, "Behold, it is come, and it is done, saith the Lord GOD; this is THE DAY whereof I have spoken." It is the Day of Vengeance. Verse 9 is in the Millennium. In verses 12 and 13, we see that Israel buries the dead for seven months, "and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified (the Second Advent), saith the Lord GOD." The battle with the army under Gog is only seven Jewish months BEFORE THE SECOND ADVENT. I am confident that the battle is Tishri 1 (Sept. 13, 2007) and the Second Advent is on the following Nisan 1 (Apr. 6, 2008) in the Jewish leap year of 5768.

If this battle were to come before or at the beginning of the Tribulation, there would be no seven-year Tribulation. Civilization as we know it will be wiped out that day. There will be two main asteroid impacts. The globe will be turned upside down. The oceans will be roaring. Men's hearts will fail them for fear. There will be a worldwide earthquake. Every wall will fall. The cities of the nations will fall. So few men will be left that a child could write the number.

The harder-than-steel laminated wood was invented back in my early days of Bible study. Why shouldn't Israel burn the weapons? There is to be no more war after Armageddon. Do they want to give up space to store them? For what?

Rather, Ezek. 39:10 explains the reason: "So that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down any out of the forests." It is better to let the trees grow for awhile. Verses 22,22 and 25 show what day this is: "And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see MY JUDGMENT (the seven trumpet judgments) that I have executed (past tense)...So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God FROM THAT DAY AND FORWARD....Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; NOW will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel." This has got to be the Millennium, not the Tribulation.

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I am very interested in the events which lead to the end of the word, especially after I read the bood "Left Behind" by Tim LaHaye and Jerry B. Jenkins. I was so engrosed in the book that I also read the 2 books that follow. Since then I have been looking for and reading just about anything I can get my hands on to update me on the current times and how they inter-relate to the end times. My question is, how can you attempt to give a "date?" Jesus himself states in Mark 15:32 that NO ONE KNOWS THE HOUR, NOT EVEN THE HEAVENLY ANGLES OR JESUS KNOWS THE DATE AND THE HOUR. ONLY GO KNOWS. I'm not trying to criticize you, but I feel like you are trying to be like God. You can't know the date or the hour, only God knows. I'm just afraid that some people might be led astray if you continue to try to figure out the date. We readers would be to just have the facts. What is going on now that show that the end times are near?  Focus on things like the increase in plagues (ie. AIDS, ebola virus, bacteria that are becoming resistant to antibiotics, etc.). Or how about the increase in earth quakes and volcano eruptions in the last 40 years. What about the increase of knowledge the people have gained in the last 100 years. The list goes on, and we would like to read more about these things, because keeping our eye on the ball so to speak will help us be more prepared than anyone giving us a date, especially since the only one who will ever know the date is God.

Thank you for taking your busy time to read this note. I hope I have not upset you, that would be the last thing I want to do here. In Christian Love

My reply

Read Mt. 24:3-34; Mk. 13:4-30; Lu. 21:7-36 for a pretty good rundown on these things. They are not hard to understand. If you follow current events, you can see that these things are coming true in our times. You have already read books on these things to boot. What do you want me to say, a repeat of what you have already read? There are plenty of people out there doing that job. I have to do my job. Instead of studying to find out how many earthquakes we have in a year or how many new diseases have turned up, I am sticking to the Bible.

Don't think I am upset. I am far from it. I have just heard all this already, about a "million" times. We should discuss things in God's agape love. However, I just can't let you turn me away from what God has me doing. We are each different cells in the Body of Christ, and each is responsible to God to do what he has called us to do.

My interest is only cursory in updating the things I learned so long ago. I want to know all the deep things in the Bible, all the hidden things.

Proverbs 2:3-5 says, "Yea, if thou criest after knowledge (I do), and liftest up thy voice for understanding (I do); If thou seekest her as silver, and searchest for her as for HID TREASURES (I do); Then shalt thou understand the fear of the LORD, and find the knowledge of God."

I want to know everything, not just the things one can understand from the first reading of the Bible. I don't want to get so bogged down in surface details that I can't see the underlying meaning of Scripture. There is more there than we will ever be able to dig out in this lifetime.

I will be 70 this December. I have spent just about every available moment since at least 1960 studying the Bible as hard and I can go. I have been able, with the Lord's help, to find out things that no one else, that I have ever read of or heard of, has figured out.

I know what the cherubim and flaming sword placed to the east of Eden are. I know what the ten curtains of the tabernacle represented, even where Heaven is located. I can show you in the scripures the exact Jewish month and day of the month of the Second Advent. Do you think I would have found out these things if I spent all my time researching earthquakes, volcano eruptions or diseases?

As for no man knows, I have answered that many times before. (long explation omitted)

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© 1998 Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 9-30-98