Pro and Con 1914

Posted 6-8-16


> > In order for us to be at the mid trib point the two witnesses would have had to of been in existence on Earth here for the last three and a half years what is your opinion of that concept

The two witnesses, Moses and Elijah are on earth during the Great Tribulation, the last half of the 7-years. They arrive as the Mid-Trib Rapture takes place.

This is suggested in Acts 1:9.10. It says, "And when he (i.e., Jesus) had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel".

Mal 4:5,6 says, "Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse."

Zec 4:14 says, "These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth."

Mat 17:1-3 says, "And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, 2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him."


Rev 11:1-3 says, "And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, RISE (i.e., in the Mid-Trib Rapture), and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. 2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months. 3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses (i.e., Moses and Elijah), and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth."

Rev 11:7-15 says, "And when they (i.e., the two witnesses) shall have finished their testimony (i.e., at the end of the Great Tribulation), the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them. 8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified. 9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves. 10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth. 11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them. 12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, COME UP HITHER. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them. 13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven. 14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly. 15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."

Rev 13:5,6 says, "And there was given unto him (i.e., Antichrist, the first beast) a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months (i.e., the first half of the Tribulation). 6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN."

Rev 12:6-12 says, "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days (i.e., during the Great Tribulation). 7 And there was war in heaven: MICHAEL and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels, 8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven. 9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. 10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation (soteria, rescue, deliverance, i.e., the First-Trump Rapture), and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. 11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. 12 Therefore REJOICE, YE HEAVENS, AND YE THAT DWELL IN THEM. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."

Dan 12:1 says, "And at that time (i.e., Mid-Trib) shall MICHAEL stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time (i.e., Mid-Trib) thy people shall be delivered (malat, escape, leap out, i.e., be raptured), every one that shall be found written in the book." Agape

INCOMING EMAIL, Re: Rapture June 12

You are telling me without a doubt Jesus will take us his believing sons and daughters to heaven in the rapture June 12, 2016?! What happens when we are still on earth? I always believed the rapture will come first ( pretrib)then the 7 years of tribulation. What about WW3, ( Ps 83 war), Armageddon, NWO, Obama's head wound Rev:13:3, a meteorite ( Wormwood) mentioned in Revelation, Prince William of England ( second Antichrist mentioned in Revelation ) - all this I believe will happen in 2016 right Marilyn?! I also saw a video on YouTube that Russia will destroy America in early 2017 with a secret EMT weapon that will paralyize and kill just about everyone in the US: stop electricity, food, gas, water, is there any truth to this Marilyn?! In Jesus' Love


I am not saying "without a doubt", but I think the Rapture should take place near Mid-Trib. To me, the Tribulation started when Antichrist was chosen on 3-13-13. Three and a half years after that will be 6-13-16.

June 12, 2016 is Pentecost, a perfect time for the Rapture of the church that was born on Pentecost in 30 AD. It seems like something the Lord would arrange. He had the males go up to Jerusalem on Unleavened Bread, Pentecost and Tabernacles. At the Rapture, we will go up to New Jerusalem.

Rev_3:12 says, "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God".


I think there are three Raptures. The first has already been fulfilled by Jesus himself, the best reason I can think of to show that the other two will take place as scheduled.

1. Firstfruits, 2nd day of Unleavened Bread in 30 AD, when Jesus took the OT saints to heaven

Eph_4:8 says, "When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men."

2. Pentecost (Mid-Trib, 2016)

3. Tabernacles (end of Great Trib, 2019)


I used to think the Rapture would be before the Tribulation until I read Rev. 13:5-11 carefully. In a flash, I realized that "THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN" are there when Antichrist is in power just before the False Prophet emerges Mid-Trib.


Rev. 13:5-11 says, "And there was given unto him (i.e., Antichrist) a mouth speaking great things and BLASPHEMIES; AND POWER WAS GIVEN UNTO HIM TO CONTINUE FORTY AND TWO MONTHS (i.e., the first half of the Tribulation). 6 And he opened his mouth in BLASPHEMY against God, to BLASPHEME his name, and his tabernacle, and THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN (i.e., the wise virgins that are caught up Mid-Trib). 7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints (i.e., the foolish virgins left behind), and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If any man have an ear, let him hear. 10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. 11 And I beheld another beast (i.e., the Satan-possessed False Prophet) coming up out of the earth (i.e., at Mid-Trib); and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

It looks like the church of brotherly love will be caught up in the Mid-Trib Rapture, but some from the "whore" CITY will be left behind to go through the Great Tribulation.


Rev 17:3-5 says, "So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness (i.e., desert): and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of BLASPHEMY, having seven heads and ten horns. 4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: 5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH."

Rev 17:18 says, "And the woman which thou sawest is that great CITY, which reigneth over the kings of the earth."


Rev 2:18-25 says, "And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira (i.e., now called Ak-hissar, meaning "white castle") write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; 19 I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. 20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel (i.e., in the OT, Jezebel got Ahab to abandon worship of Yahweh and worship Baal), which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. 21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I WILL CAST HER INTO A BED, AND THEM THAT COMMIT ADULTERY (i.e., join) WITH HER INTO GREAT TRIBULATION, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. 24 But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known THE DEPTHS OF SATAN, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden. 25 But that which ye have already hold fast till I come."

I searched online for meaning of pontifex maximus and found this. The author understands.

"Pontifex Maximus or Pope Seated on Satan's Throne

"The Babylonian pagan worship of Nimrod, Semiramis, and the god-incarnate son extended throughout the entire world and eventually assumed the name of Trinitarian Christianity in Rome... The Babylon Kings, who were descended from Nimrod, served as both king and priest of the pagan Babylonian Mystery religion. As priests, they bore the title "Pontifex Maximus" ...meaning "supreme pathfinder" or "bridge maker," representing "the path or connection between this life and the next." ...They ruled upon the throne of Satan, which is the throne of Nimrod as the "hidden god.'"


Rev 17:9-14 says, "And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 11 And the beast that was, and is not (i.e., Satan), even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition (i.e., the second son of perdition, the False Prophet, Judas Iscariot was the first son of perdition, see John 17:12; 2Th 2:3). 12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast. 14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and THEY THAT ARE WITH HIM ARE CALLED, AND CHOSEN, AND FAITHFUL."


Rev 13:1-6 says, "And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a BEAST rise up out of the sea (i.e., "THE GREAT WHORE THAT SITTETH UPON MANY WATERS", Rev 17:1), having seven heads (i.e., Babel, Babylon II, Medo-Persia, Greece, Holy Roman Empire, Ecclesiastical Holy Roman Empire, and Babylon III) and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of BLASPHEMY (i.e., Pontifex Maximus, meaning bridge builder). 2 And THE BEAST which I saw was like unto a leopard (i.e., Greece, Dan. 7:6), and his feet were as the feet of a bear (i.e., Medo-Persia, Dan 7:5), and his mouth as the mouth of a lion (i.e., Babylon II, Dan 7:4): and THE DRAGON GAVE HIM HIS POWER, AND HIS SEAT, AND GREAT AUTHORITY. 3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. 4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? 5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and BLASPHEMIES; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months (i.e., the first half of the Tribulation). 6 And he opened his mouth in BLASPHEMY against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN" (i.e., at Mid-Trib).


"Jesuit Pope Francis says CROSS & GOD A FAILURE!" (emphasis mine)

"POPE says Personal Relationship with Jesus VERY DANGEROUS & HARMFUL"

"God sees to the fruits of our labors," Pope Francis said during his whirlwind U.S. tour. "And if at times our efforts and works seem to fail and produce no fruit, we need to remember that we are followers of Jesus ... and HIS LIFE, HUMANLY SPEAKING, ENDED IN FAILURE, THE FAILURE OF THE CROSS."

POPE FRANCIS COMMITTED BLASPHEMY TODAY. Pope Francis said today that you cannot be a Christian or become a son of God without being "baptisted through the redeeming person of Mary".


He said "Mary is a true mother who gives us life in Christ" and "The Christian who does not feel that the Virgin Mary is his or her mother is an orphan."

"Church is essential for faith; there are no 'free agents,' pope says" (By Cindy Wooden, Catholic News Service | Jun. 25, 2014)

"VATICAN CITY - Christians are not made in a laboratory, but in a community called the church, Pope Francis said.

"At his weekly general audience Wednesday, Pope Francis continued his series of audience talks about the church, telling an estimated 33,000 people that there is no such thing as "do-it-yourself" Christians or "free agents" when it comes to faith."

"Pope Francis described as "dangerous" the temptation to believe that one can have "a personal, direct, immediate relationship with Jesus Christ without communion with and the mediation of the church."

"Obviously, he said, it is not always easy to walk the path of faith with other people. "Sometimes it's tiring. It can happen that a brother or sister creates problems for us or scandalizes us, but the Lord entrusted his message of salvation to human beings, to us, to witnesses," he said.

"It is through our brothers and sisters with their gifts and their limits," the pope said, "that he comes to us and makes himself known. This is what belonging to the church means. Remember: BEING CHRISTIAN MEANS BELONGING TO THE CHURCH. If your first name is Christian, your last name is Member of the Church."

"At the end of his talk, the pope asked people to join him in praying that they would never "give into the temptation of thinking you can do without others, without the church, that you can save yourself, of thinking you can be a laboratory Christian."

"Christians, he said, are not manufactured in isolation, but belong to a long line of believers who handed on the faith and challenged one another to live it fully."

The Roman Catholic Church says that there is no salvation outside of the Roman Catholic Church.


Joh 3:13-18 says, "no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHOULD NOT PERISH, BUT HAVE ETERNAL LIFE. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHOULD NOT PERISH, BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. 18 HE THAT BELIEVETH ON HIM IS NOT CONDEMNED: BUT HE THAT BELIEVETH NOT IS CONDEMNED ALREADY, BECAUSE HE HATH NOT BELIEVED IN THE NAME OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD."

Rom 10:4 says, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

Rom 10:9 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

It doesn't say we have to belong to a church. We are the church, the Body of Christ.

Eph 1:22,23 says, "And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church, 23 Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all."

1Co 12:13 says, "For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit."

> > I also saw a video on YouTube that Russia will destroy America in early 2017 with a secret EMT weapon that will paralyize and kill just about everyone in the US: stop electricity, food, gas, water, is there any truth to this Marilyn?

Not that I know of. Russia will be involved in the Gog and Magog war on the Day of the Lord though. God will put an end to that with an asteroid impact. The main asteroid will come in from the north and destroy Babylon. A piece that will probably break off at the Roche Limit will hit the NE Mediterranean Sea.


Eze 38:18-23 says, "And it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that my fury shall come up in my face. 19 For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel; 20 So that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence (paniym, face, i.e., they will see the Sign of the Son of Man in the sky), and the mountains shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground. 21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother. 22 And I will plead against him with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. 23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD."


Mat_24:30 says, "And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."


Rev 18:2-4 says, "And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon (i.e., which means to confuse) the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues."

Rev 19:1-3 says, "And after these things I heard a great voice of much people in heaven, saying, Alleluia; Salvation, and glory, and honour, and power, unto the Lord our God: 2 For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. 3 And again they said, Alleluia. AND HER SMOKE ROSE UP FOR EVER AND EVER."


Rev_18:10 says, "Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come."

Rev_18:17 says, "For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off".

Rev_18:19 says, "And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate."

Rev 18:21 says, "And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all."

Before Adam, the wicked angel civilization was destroyed by an asteroid that hit the sea. The heavens became black. At the end of the Great Tribulation, wicked man's civilization will be destroyed by an asteroid that will hit the sea.

Joe 3:15 says, "The sun and the moon shall be darkened, and the stars shall withdraw their shining."

We need to be caught up to Heaven in one of the two Raptures, either Mid-Trib or Post-Trib. Nothing is as important as this.

The main thing that will take place during the Great Tribulation is the Mark of the Beast. Those that take it cannot be saved.

Rev 14:9-12 says, "And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name. 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." Agape

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