Pro and Con 214, Uploaded 11-13-98, PM

Note: If the Lord came last Pentecost and checked on Israel as in the parable of the barren fig tree, it would parallel Vashti being called, but would not come. After that, her estate was given to Esther, who was purified 12 months. That may fit us. Stay ready.

Mt. 22:8 might fit in. It says, "Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden (Israel) were not worthy." As they got first chance before, maybe they get first chance today. It certainly emphasizes that we should be sure we are "accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man" (Lu. 21:36). If, as a nation, Israel did not make it, we should take warning. Another thing just caught my attention. You know how Jesus said, "nation shall rise against nation...And Great earthquakes...famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven" (Lu. 21:11)? The SOHO spacecraft observed a rare celestial spectacle when the sun was hit by two pieces of a comet June 1 and 2, 1998. Here is an animated picture (27 frames) I downloaded from: http://www.eagle-net.org/phikent/orbit/june/projectile.html:

Here is the NASA press release I found at:
http://umbra.nascom.nasa.gov/comets/SOHO_sungrazers.html
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On Tuesday, 1998 June 2, telescopes on board the SOHO spacecraft viewed two sungrazing comets following similar but not identical orbits, and entering the tenuous outer atmosphere of the Sun --- the solar corona --- never to reappear on the other side of the Sun.

Shortly after the comets disappeared behind the occulting disks of the LASCO C1 and C2 coronagraphs, a bright coronal mass ejection (CME) with an enormous erupting prominence appeared on the southwest (lower right) limb of the Sun. (East and West are reversed in heliographic coordinates to match the compass directions for an earthbound observer.) The prominence eruption is visible in the SOHO EIT images.
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Notice how the outer edge of the Sun is called the limb? Think of Ezekiel's vision of the cherubim (terrestrial planets). Ezek. 1:7 says, "and the sole of their feet (extremeties, outer edges, limbs) was like the sole of a calf's foot (disk shaped): and they sparkled like the colour of burnished brass." Verse 13 says, "their appearance was like burning coals of fire, and like the appearance of lamps." Then it adds, "it went up and down among the living creatures (lively things). I think "it" is an asteroid orbiting among the terrestrial planets. It is the Sword of the Lord that will stop the army under Gog when it attacks Israel and will destroy Babylon. It must be a binary asteroid, for it splits into the "mountain" that impacts the Mediterranean Sea (Rev. 8:8) and the "star" (aster) that destroys Babylon (Rev. 8:10; 18:21).

Incoming Email

ok if israel is a nation and a generation is 40 years, how do we explain Matt 24:32-34? The disciples asked Jesus three questions in Matt24:3. When shall these things be,and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and the end of the world? explain.

My reply

The KJV's "end of the world" should be translated "end of the age." The fig tree parable shows us what the Sign of the end of the Age was. It was what we were to watch for.

Mt. 24:32-34 says, "Now learn a parable of the fig tree (Israel); When his branch (klados, scion, i.e., modern Israel grafted into her old rootstock) is yet tender (apalos, young, i.e., no more than 19, as at the Exodus), and putteth forth leaves (she put forth West Bank, Gaza Strip, Sinai, and Golan Heights in the Six-Day War of 1967, when 19 years old), ye know that summer is nigh (the war started June 5; summer starts June 21): So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it (the Rapture) is near, even at the doors (Rev. 3:8). Verily I say unto you, This generation (born in 1967) shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."

"THIS GENERATION" of Mt. 23:36 was 40 years (30 AD to 70 AD). Therefore, "this generation of Mt. 24:34 is 40 years, just as a generation was indicated when Israel wandered in the wilderness 40 years.

"Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world (ages) are come. Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall" (I Cor. 10:11,12).

The year 1967 + 40 = 2007. On the Jewish calendar, 5728 + 40 = 5768 (our 2007/2008). The first day of 5768 is, I think, the beginning of the millennial Day of the Lord. It is the Feast of Trumpets, Sept. 13, 2007.

The Oslo accords were signed Sept. 13, 1993 and ratified in Israel on Tishri 1. There are to be seven good years and seven bad years. Sept. 13, 1993 + 14 = Sept. 13, 2007. Tishri 1, 5754 + 14 = Tishri 1, 5768 (our Sept. 13, 2007).

That day is the 2300th day (Dan. 8:14) of the shortened Tribulation, counted by inclusive reckoning from the Feast of Weeks in 2001. I expect the final 7-year peace covenant to be confirmed (made stronger) on that day.

Watching and recognizing the Sign of the End of the Age makes understanding the framework of the end of the age possible.

There is another parable to consider, the parable of the barren fig tree in Luke 13:6-9. It looks like Christ comes to check on Israel for four years before the Tribulation begins. The first time may have been last Pentecost/Feast of Weeks.

I wonder if he checked on the Church at the same time. Esther is a type of the Church and she had a 12-month purification period before she was taken to the king. This was customary before Jewish weddings to prove that the bride was a virgin. I am hoping that the Rapture of the church will be next Pentecost.

We must be sure we are as pure virgins now for the Pre-Trib Rapture is drawing nigh. We certainly do not want to get caught not being ready. If this is a special time that Satan is allowed to sift us like wheat, we must be strong and withstand all tests.

I liked the way a friend put it to me this week, "Take a DEEP BREATH and LEAN into the WIND! This TOO will pass!" We should encourage each other.

First Peter 4:7-8 says, "The end of all things is near. Therefore be clear minded and self-controlled so that you can pray. ABOVE ALL, LOVE EACH OTHER DEEPLY, BECAUSE LOVE COVERS OVER A MULTITUDE OF SINS."

Incoming Email

Re: mondex, from Finland
Found this at Jerusalem Post internet version: JERUSALEM (November 13)

Cinema goers may soon be able to purchase their tickets with an electronic wallet after an agreement was signed between Globus Group, one of the country's largest cinema chains, and Mondex International, a specialist in electronic cash smart cards.

The two companies began working together this week on a pilot scheme at a cinema in Ness Ziona. Customers can automatically purchase their tickets using an electronic card produced by Mondex....

"It's another way for our customers to purchase their tickets, like a credit card or cash," said Yisrael Horowitz, marketing manager for Globus....

Mondex, which is jointly owned by Discount Investments and Paz, is currently running two pilot plans for its electronic wallet, in Ness Ziona and Rehovot. Customers can buy a range of goods from many different stores. The company plans to begin marketing the card across Israel in 1999.

Incoming Email

Bridges for Peace, Clarence H. Wagner, Jr., International Director - Jerusalem
November 13, 1998

"7) WILL ISRAEL HAVE A GOOD RAINY SEASON?
Despite the fact that Israel has received little rain this year, Tzvi Halperson of the Israeli Meteorological Service says that above-average precipitation is forecast from December through February. Specifically, some 110% or more of the average winter rainfall is expected to fall this year. Rain falls in Israel only during the winter months. The predictions of the Meteorological Service for this winter contrast with those of two world-wide weather services, which have forecast an unusually dry winter for Israel this year. Halperson noted that those services use different forecast methods, and "they have only been covering Israel's weather for two years." This week Jerusalem received her first heavy rain of the season. (Arutz 7, November 9, 1998)...

"SCRIPTURE: "Then I will send rain on your land in its season, both autumn and spring rains, so that you may gather in your grain, new wine and oil...." (Deuteronomy 11:14-15)." [NIV]

***From Marilyn: Israel got her FIRST RAIN this year on Sept. 13, a significant date because it is the date Tishri 1 falls on in 2007. I think the Feast of Trumpets is Jesus' birthday. He comes as the rain (Hos. 6:3) "in his due season, the FIRST RAIN and the latter rain (De. 11:14 (KJV). Sept. 13, 2007 is, I think, his Coronation Day, also the day of the Marriage of the Lamb, the Judgment Seat of Christ and the Marriage Supper of the Lamb.

Incoming Email

You have an incredible page here. Just a few questions for you to answer:

1) You have the False Prophet killing the Two Witnesses, not the Antichrist. Would you mind explaining this?

2) I'm glad you are convinced on two Raptures. From my study, I believe there will be four, maybe five: pre-trib, pre-wrath (as proposed by Rosenthal), post-trib(7th Trump), possibly another in Rev. 14, and another after the sixth bowl. That's one for before the 7 years, and one for every cycle of judgments Have you ever considered this? Thanks.

My reply

Thanks for your kind remark about my page.
1) Here is the way I understand it. I call the first beast of Rev. 13 the Beast and the second one the False Prophet, as in Rev. 19:20. I also call the False Prophet the final Antichrist for he is the one that is Satan indwelt. Zech. 5:3,4 speaks of both beasts: "the curse...shall enter into the house of the thief (the False Prophet), and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name (the Tribulation Pope)."

By the middle of the Tribulation, Satan is cast out of Heaven and indwells the False Prophet. He pulls off his coup and takes control of the World Church and World Government, maybe by engineering an accident for the Beast that temporarily incapacitates him. The False Prophet/Satan looses no time and heads for the Temple to sit there "shewing himself that he is God" (II Thess. 2:4). The two witnesses will not bow down to him, so he kills them. After 3 1/2 days, they are resurrected and caught up to Heaven. The False Prophet/Satan is furious and wars against the Messianic Jews (Rev. 12:17).

2) I think the second Rapture is between the breaking of the sixth and seventh seals. I don't think there can be any Raptures after the seventh seal is opened. The seven trumpets are the Wrath of God. They fall on unbelievers, not believers.

Incoming Email

Jim Bramlett wrote:
We all know the Old Testament rapture types of Noah and Lot, where both were "taken out" from the destruction God sent on the world. The other day I was reminded that God not only spared Noah and Lot, but also their families -- even though there is no evidence that any of them were righteous!

Noah was allowed to take his wife, his sons and his son's wives into the ark of safety. Lot was able to take his wife and two married daughters out of Sodom. (The sons-in-law did not make it because they made a joke of Lot's warning. Hmmmm.) Noah had God's imputed righteousness because of his faith (the only righteousness any of us have). Not sure about Lot. Perhaps God honored his the prayers of his uncle Abe. Lot's daughters were obviously not righteous but tainted with the immorality of Sodom because they later got their father drunk and committed incest with him (producing the Moabites and Ammonites -- Genesis 19:37-38). Yet God apparently allowed them to escape simply because they were Lot's daughters!

Yesterday I was reminded of another rapture type -- Rahab the harlot, of all people. God not only spared Rahab from Jericho's destruction, but "her father's household, and all that she had" (Joshua 7:25). Hebrews 11:31 tells why she was spared: "By faith the harlot Rahab did not perish with those who did not believe..." This is another dramatic example of the importance God placed on faith.

Conclusion: There are not only rapture types in the Old Testament, but in each case family members were spared, apparently without regard to their personal righteousness. This goes against our human way of thinking, but it was God's way. Personally, I believe this is a thrice-repeated Scriptural basis for believing for close family members not to miss the rapture.

Be it unto you according to your faith, and may this be an encouragement to you.
PS: Thanks to a friend, I was reminded that 2 Peter 2:7-8 refers to "righteous Lot," who "was oppressed by the filthy conduct of the wicked" (NKJV).

Verse 9 says, "the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations..." This may allude to the rapture. The Greek for word temptations is "peirasmos," which according to Strongs can mean "experience of evil, or adversity." I have often thought that the "lead us not into (peirasmos), but deliver us from evil" in Matthew 6:13 could also be a prayer to be taken in the rapture.

My reply

There is Acts 16:30,31 too that gives us some hope that the ones in the family that want to go may be able to. It says, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved? And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, AND THY HOUSE." We can't be sure that it means this would be true in other cases, for the Lord knows all ahead of time, but it does offer some hope.

I Cor. 7:14 also offers some hope. It says, "For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy." Husband and wife become one.

> The sons-in-law did not make it because they made a joke of Lot's warning.

This seems to indicate that some family members will not make it in spite of being married. I notice that all of those saved from the two disasters had to believe God enough to act on the information given them. Noah's family walked into the Ark. Lot's family walked out of the city. They demonstrated their faith by their actions. The sons-in-law demonstrated their lack of faith by their actions too. It does not seem to be automatic. The Lord will probably judge each individual case. He may be in the process of doing this now. Let's do the very best we can to make our family's calling and election sure, be a good example, tell them of the Lord in agape love, be patient, pray for them, and then trust the Lord for the rest.

> I have often thought that the "lead us not into (peirasmos), but deliver us
> from evil" in Matthew 6:13 could also be a prayer to be taken in the rapture.

I think so too. Deliver is "rhuomai," rescue, through the idea of a drawing rushing current. It ties in with Rev. 3:10: "Because thou hast kept the word of my patience (hupomones, patient waiting, endurance), I also will keep thee FROM (ek, out of) the hour of temptation (peirasmou, trial), which shall come upon ALL THE WORLD, to try (peirasai) them that dwell upon the earth."

We seem to be in the period of patient waiting now. "For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him" (Heb. 10:37,38). We don't want to be like Lot's son-in-laws, not even like Lot's wife, who looked back when she was told not to. We should obey the Lord.

Incoming Email

You know Marilyn, the person who had the dream/vision of the TV picture as snow and the date November 24 might be just a warning about these Leonids meteors which will pepper the earth this Tuesday, November 17. Supposedly our satellites are under a pretty huge threat from these little bullets. They will be travelling 200 miles per second!!! This dream, to me, doesn't portend the rapture, but destruction of television and cable satellites.

Get ready everybody, the ride is going to get rocky!!!

Incoming Email

First let me say that I am glad that you are thicked skinned. Running this web site leaves you open to a lot of attack. I know God has fortified you for this task.

I read some time ago this scenario from the web site called "Sound of the Shofar" by Luana Fabry. This is a shorter version of what she thinks happened that week.

In Luke 22:7 it says "Then came the day of Unleavened Bread, on which the passover lamb had to be sacrificed. So Jesus sent Peter and John saying, "Go and prepare the paasover for us, that we may eat it." They said to him. "Where will you have us prepare it?" ....verse 13: And they went and found it as he had told them; and they prepared the passover." Harper Study Bible

First she says that the Passover Seder is to be eaten on Nisan 15. I interpret this to mean a lamb had to be eaten. Jesus said at the last supper: This is my body which is given for you. This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood."

Her reasoning is that on Tuesday, Nisan 13, Jesus was arrested and tried in the middle of the night. Wednesday, Nisan 14, Jesus is crucified around 3:00 p.m. Jesus' body was taken off the cross before the start of the night portion because the Jews did not want to have the body on the cross for the Feast of Unleavened Bread. Thursday, Nisan 15 was a high holy day and everyone rested. Friday during the day the women went out to purchase the spices they needed to annoint the body of Jesus.(Luke 23:56, Mark 16:1) At sunset Friday, they all rested for the weekly sabbath. Then just at sunlight started, they went to the tomb on Sunday Nisan 18 and found it empty.

Do you see any error in this?

My reply

Actually, I am not thick-skinned. All my life, I have been very sensitive, easy to cry, and always wished I could be more thick-skinned. However, in spite of that, I am strong even if I have to take a deep breath and look through tears. In this present endeavor, the Lord has truly fortified me for what he wanted me to do. His strength holds me up. I know that I am doing what I think he wants me to do to the best of my ability. I know that I can't pay any attention at all to antagonistic words, that I have to let them wash off of me like water off a duck's back. I either delete them as soon as I determine what they are about or don't pay any attention to them. I can't let things like that get in the way of doing the Lord's work. I know the email address of one that has sent sizzling things. He has me on his mailing list, but when I see his address, I know I can just delete it. One person sent over 400 copies of the same email. That too was easy to delete. I selected the first one, held down the shift key, selected the last one, and hit delete. They all went down the drain.

The Lord didn't say that everything would be good. What he did say was "that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose" (Rom. 8:28).

We need to be strong in these evil days, no matter what happens. I keep saying that if these are the good years, I'd hate to be here during the bad ones. When people complain, I think, "What did you expect? we are living in the end of the age." It is both depressing and exciting to live in these days--depressing because of rampant wickedness and abysmal lack of true justice in this world--exciting because we have the chance to be Raptured and to see prophecy being fulfilled in our days. I wouldn't trade for any other times, but we need to hang on to our "blessed hope" of being caught up before the worst of times is upon us.

> First she says that the Passover Seder is to be eaten on Nisan 15.

Why then did the Lord say that Passover was on the 14th?

> Friday during the day the women went out to purchase the spices
> they needed to annoint the body of Jesus.

I think they would have taken them to the tomb that day if there was a day in between the two Sabbaths.

> Do you see any error in this?
Yes. For one thing, look at Luke 24:1,21: "NOW upon the first day of the week...to day is the third day SINCE these things were done." I think the Crucifixion was on Thursday and that the three days "since" are Friday, Saturday and Sunday. I think those three days were the feasts of Passover, Unleavened Bread and Firstfruits.

If the Crucifixion had been on Wednesday, the three days since would have been Thursday, Friday and Saturday. That disagrees with the above Scripture. The third day had to be Sunday.

Incoming Email

I'm not educated in the Bible the way you are. But I just wonder about things, I see things something like this.

Seven years of plenty... 1991 to 1998
Seven years of lean..... 1998 to 2005

The seven years of lean could be started over Iraq with limited nukes being lobbed, or germ warfare, by Iraq. We know the stock market is teetering on the edge, Japan is in big financial trouble and Y2K is at the door. We could be headed for seven years of a terrible slide.

Then in 2005, with the world in financial chaos, the middle East in shambles, fighting constantly..... a new leader pops up on the scene and signs the peace treaty with Israel. He solves the financial crisis and we have three and a half years of peace and safety... you know the rest of the story with the Lord returning in 2012.

I just don't think we are near having the treaty signed with Israel, I don't see any of these present leaders involved with this process. I think there will be a whole new set, including the next Pope.

Just a thought.... I so much admire your work... I log on every day to see if there is a new pro/con. You will never know how much I appreciate you and how much I have learned from you. Can't wait to meet you in Heaven. God bless you and Ed. With deepest respect.

My reply

> Seven years of plenty... 1991 to 1998
> Seven years of lean..... 1998 to 2005

I think Israel has been given another 40 years of testing and probation in the "wilderness." From the time that she grew leaves (Sinai, West Bank, Gaza Strip and Golan Heights) in the Six-Day War, thus fulfilling the fig tree parable of Mt. 24:32-34, she has 40 years before destruction hits. The year 1967 + 40 = 2007. I think Sept. 13, 2007 (Tishri 1, the Feast of Trumpets) is the end of the age. Adding together the seven good and seven bad years and subtracting it from Sept. 13, 2007 brings us to Sept. 13, 1993 (2007 - 14 = 1993).

That date is significant. The Oslo Accords were signed that day. They were ratified in Israel three days later on the Jewish Tishri 1. Tishri 1, 5754 + 14 = Tishri 1, 5768 (our Sept. 13, 2007). That marks the day very well, on both the Jewish and Gregorian calendars.

Let's assume that the Tribulation ends in 2005. There would have to be a seven-month period from Tishri 1, 5766 to the following Nisan 1 for Israel to bury the dead to cleanse the land for the Lord's return (Ezek. 39:12). There are not seven months here because 5766 is not a Jewish leap year (but 5768 is a leap year).

There would have to be a 2300-day period preceding Tishri 1, 5766 for the shortened Tribulation. From the Feast of Weeks in 2001 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2007 is exactly 2300 days, by Jewish inclusive reckoning. But, from the Feast of Weeks in 1999 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2005 is 2329 days instead of the necessary 2300. To me, these things lock the beginning of the millennial Day of the Lord on Sept. 13, 2007. You can't move it backward and have it fit.

Can't wait to meet you in Heaven, either. I want to meet up with all my family first, then I would just love to meet all the wonderful people I have corresponded with. What a happy day that will be. If I don't have tears that day, it will be because the Lord wiped them away.

Incoming Email

I have a question and want to know what you know about this subject! When we die do we go on to heaven immediately upon death or do we stay in the grave until the last trumpet sounds then go to heaven? some verses lean towards this theory and some lean toward the 2nd theory I have here. It is just hard to believe that God would let our souls stay in the grave for that long after we served him in our lifetime. Also is our soul and spirit the one and the same thing? Or are they separate? confused

My reply

Paul said, "absent from the body, and...present with the Lord" (II Cor. 5:8). I think we go directly to Heaven. I don't think we really die at all. We just come out of the physical body and leave it behind. Without the soul, the body dies.

Man is body, soul and spirit. They are three different things. I Thess. 5:23 says, "I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." I think the soul is that kind of life that an animal has. It does not have God consciousness. The dormant spirit is kindled to life by God when we accept Christ as our own personal Saviour. Our spirit does have God consciousness. This sets us apart from the animals. Too bad what this does to the theory of evolution. ;-)

The Godhead is three in one. Believers are three in one. Animals are two in one. Unbelievers are two in one. Believers can understand what unbelievers cannot when it comes to godly things.

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© 1998 Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 11-13-98