Pro and Con 240

Uploaded 12-31-98, PM

May this be the best year of our lives. Happy New Year all.

Incoming Email

Noah was not taken out of the world. He experienced the same rain and flooding as those that perished. That being said.

I hope we will be raptured, because I sure don't want to be here when no one can buy or sell without alligning himself/herself with the Anti Christ. Very few people in the world could go on very long without being able to go the the Grocery store, or buying electrcity, or gasoline, or water and sewage etc. How long could you make it if you could no longer buy groceries, had no electricity. We have enough food for a couple weeks. If electrcity went off and we lost our refrigerator we would have even less.

Another intersesting verse is pray that it doesn't happen in the Winter.

My reply

Noah was above the tribulation of those days. He did not go through it. He was in a safe place on the waters that were above (i.e., in the heavenlies), above all the high mountains (Gen. 7:19,20). The Ark rode upon the waters, both in the water, the draft (depth of water a loaded ship sinks down in) and out of the water. It was a symbol of Heaven riding in an ocean of ice crystals.

There are waters on Earth and waters in Heaven. Gen. 1:6-8 says, Let there be a firmament (expanse of space) in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. And God made the firmament and divided the waters which were under the firmament (on Earth) from the waters which were above the firmament (expanse of space): And it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven (lit., heavens)." Psa. 148:4 says, "Praise him, ye heavens of heavens, and ye waters that be above the heavens. Let them praise the name of the LORD: for he commanded, and they were created." The Lord created the rings of Saturn, that ocean of ice crystals called the Crystal Sea.

Rev. 4:6 says, "before the throne (in Heaven) there was a sea of glass like unto crystal (krustallos, ice)." Rev. 15:1,2 says, "I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God. And I saw as it were (symbolic language, let the reader understand) a sea of glass mingled with fire (the rings of ice crystals reflecting the sunlight): and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God." The last plagues are ready to be poured out on Earth. ALL (I Cor. 15:51) of the saints, those taken up before the Tribulation, at the first trump, and those taken up during the Tribulation, are in Heaven by now. The Tribulation saints have just arrived at the "last trump" (I Cor. 15:52).

"And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven" (Mk. 13:27). The Church saints are gathered from Heaven, where they were taken in the Pre-Trib Rapture. The Tribulation saints are gathered from Earth in the Pre-Wrath Rapture.

Now can you picture how Noah's ark riding out of the water and in the water could represent the saints in Heaven, which rides out of the water and in the water of the Crystal Sea? The rings of Saturn, made up of floating ice crystals, surround the equator. Saturn seems to float in the Crystal Sea, and is literally light enough to do so if the Crystal Sea was liquid water. There is our true Ark.

Ezek. 1:26-28 in the NEB says, "Above the vault (firmament, expanse of space) over their heads (farther out in space than the terrestrial planets) there appeared, as it were (symbolic language, the reader understand), a sapphire (which means 'dear to the planet Saturn,' from the Sanskrit 'Sani,' Saturn, and 'priya,' dear) in the shape of a throne, and high above all, upon the throne, a form in human likeness (Christ). I saw what might have been brass (KJV, 'the colour of amber;' Saturn has golden clouds brushed with amber) glowing like fire in a furnace (Saturn radiates more heat than it receives from the sun) from the waist (equator) upwards; and from the waist (equator) downwards I saw what looked like fire with encircling radiance (the Berkeley Version has 'with a bright halo all about it.'); it was like the appearance of the glory of the LORD."

Ezekiel saw Saturn with its bright halo all about it. That is where I think we will be taken in the Rapture.

> I hope we will be raptured, because I sure don't want to be here when no
> one can buy or sell without alligning himself/herself with the Anti Christ.

Amen to that. I don't even want to be here when the Y2K troubles hit. We might not be writing to each other this way then, because I hear that the mainframe computers that control the Internet are not Y2K compliant.

> Another intersesting verse is pray that it doesn't happen in the Winter.

Yes, an interesting verse. Here, you have very good perception. In Mt. 24, Jesus was talking to "the disciples." They asked, "Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world (age)" (24:3). He proceeded to answer their questions. When he was talking about the middle of the Tribulation, when those in Jerusalem would have to flee, all of a sudden, he threw in that statement about winter. Remember who he was talking to, the disciples.

In Mt. 24:19,20, Jesus said, "And woe unto THEM that are with child, and to THEM that give suck IN THOSE DAYS (during the Great Tribulation)! But pray YE that YOUR FLIGHT be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day." Believers, even those that give suck in those days, the middle of the Tribulation, are going to have to flee Jerusalem. They can pray that their flight be not in the winter or on the Sabbath (I don't think it will be). But, Jesus suddenly changed from those he was talking ABOUT to those he was talking TO, the disciples. "But pray YE (disciples) that YOUR flight (the Rapture) be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day."

I think the Rapture will be on Sunday. In the Preview of the Rapture in Rev. 1, John was caused to act out the Rapture that takes place in Rev. 4:1. I believe the Preview took place on Sunday. The same trumpet voice of Christ talked with him both times. After the "Come up Hither" of 4:1, John was told things of the Tribulation, "things which must be hereafter."

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ" is written as if the Rapture were at hand. It is "at hand" in 1:3 and 22:10. Jesus signs off with "Surely I come quickly." He comes quickly at the Rapture (2:5; 3:11). In Rev. 1:19, John was told to "Write the things which thou hast seen (things before the Rapture), and the things which are (at the time of the Rapture), and the things which shall be hereafter (after the Rapture)." The "hereafter" appears in 4:2.

In the Preview of the Rapture in Rev. 1:9,10, John said that he "was in the isle that is called Patmos ('mortal,' i.e., he was in his mortal body of clay), for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ. I was (lit. became) in the Spirit on the Lord's day (Sunday, as Resurrection Day, when Christ triumped), and heard behind me a great voice (saying, 'Come up hither,' Rev. 4:1), as of a trumpet (Rev. 4:1, also the first 'trump of God,' I Thess. 4:16). Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last (Christ, LORD of the Old Testament and Lord of the New Testament)...And I (John) turned to see the voice that spake with me (Christ's voice). And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks (the churches, Rev. 1:20); And in the midst of the seven candlesticks (churches) one like unto the Son of man (Christ), clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle. His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow (as the hair of 'the Ancient of days,' Dan. 7:9); and his eyes were as a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass (symbol of judgment), as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters ('as the voice of the Almighty,' Ezek. 1:24). And he had in his right hand seven stars (star performers of the churches he has just caught up): and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword (to cut off the lukewarm Laodiceans, Rev. 3:16; Lu. 12:46, Mt. 24:51): and his countenance was as the sun (Mal 4:5) shineth in his strength. And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me. Fear not; I am the first and the last: I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death."

The Rapture not being in the winter fits Song of Solomon 2:10-12. It says, "My beloved (Christ) spake, and said unto me (the Bride of Christ), Rise up (the Rapture), my love, my fair one, and come away. For, lo, the WINTER IS PAST, the rain is over and gone. The flowers appear on the earth; the time of the singing of birds is come..." I think the Rapture will be in the spring, hopefully, on the next Orthodox Pentecost, Sunday, May 23, 1999.

Be ready. Confess all sins (since you accepted Christ) so you are as a wise virgin with enough oil of the Holy Spirit. Then watch and wait patiently. Rev. 3:10-12 says, "Because thou hast kept the word of my patience (waiting), I also will keep thee FROM (out of) the hour of temptation (peirasmos, trial, i.e., the Tribulation), which shall come upon ALL THE WORLD, to try (peirasai) them that dwell upon the earth. Behold I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem."

Incoming Email

Beatty, Troy (TD) wrote:
> > mmm...I thought the Bible warned about setting dates!!!!

> Hi: Find me a verse that says that.

> > Only God knows when Jesus will return. The date is not given to man only the times and
> > seasons we are in. When that time of His appearing comes we will "know" from within.
> > Our spirit will bare witness.

***New from Marilyn: I notice that you did not find a verse. You gave me your own words. Now which verse says this new information?

> In Mt. 24:36, the word "knoweth" is present tense.

> > ---Galatians 5:19-21: It shows us who will not "enter" the Kingdom.
> > The ones that practice [ Greek Prasso - regular practice ] these
> > things...and he lists the sins that will hold you back from "entering"
> > the dominion and authority of God on the earth.

***Gal. 5:18-21 says, "But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." Which one of these things says that "the Bible warned about setting dates"?

> > Jesus told us to pray " Your Kingdom come ". Why would He tell us to pray for the
> > Kingdom to "come" to us if in fact we are going to go to it.

***Mt. 6:9,10 says, "Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed by thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven." It is talking about the 1000-year reign of Christ over Earth. As you can see, there is both His Kingdom in Heaven and His Kingdom in Earth.

> > The word "come" comes from the Greek word "Erkomahee", meaning to come from one place
> > to another. This does not mean that there is no heaven but it means that while we are
> > on the earth we must pray for our generation to seek the Kingdom and it's righteousness
> > in order for it to "come" to us.

> "He is so near, He is at the door" (Mt. 24:33, Berkeley Version).

> "Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching" (Lu. 12:37).

> > Yes we are to watch and know the seasons we are in ,But we are NOT to set dates.

***It does not say that anywhere.

> > We are to warn people of His coming. So when the Gospel is presented to us the first
> > thing that we have to do is Call upon the Name of the Lord and you shall be saved. This
> > means you confess Jesus as the Christ and yourself as the sinner. Repentance follows
> > salvation and then the Kingdom of God is near you to "see" then to "enter" and then
> > finally to "Inherit"

***The moment you confess Jesus as the Christ, He baptizes you with His Holy Spirit and you are born into the Kingdom of God.

> > Setting dates only makes use look foolish and does nothing to bring salvation to the
> > world...especially when the date is wrong....which they have been!!

***I would rather be a fool for Christ than to not watch. Jesus told us 23 times to watch. The Rapture always was the hardest date to pin down. I may have only missed it one year. If I get the rest right, I will feel like I did pretty good.

> > "Cast not away therefore your confidence, which hath great recompence of reward. For
> > ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive
> > the promise. For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not
> > tarry. Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall
> > have no pleasure in him" (Heb. 10:35-38).

> > Yes he will come but in the meantime I will use the authority He has given me( as a
> > believer ) to "kick the devils butt" while I am here on this earth. I will not bunker
> > down and hold the fort until He gets here but I will go out and destroy the works of
> > the enemy that has blinded the eyes of the unsaved.

Lu. 6:41 says, "And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye."

> > Why look anywhere else? Jesus said of the dominion or "kingdom", that it would not be
> > received by observation and that it would not be found here or there but rather
> > inside of you. Luke 17:20 & 21

***In this age, the kingdom cometh not with observation. In the millennial Day of the Lord, it will come with observation.

***Luke 17:20,21 says, "when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within (Gr., entos, in the midst) you." The Kingdom of God was not within the Pharisees, but Christ the King himself was standing there in the midst of the Pharisees. Jesus said to the Pharisees, "Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?" (Mt. 23:33). In His love

Incoming Email

I thoroughly enjoy your website. I also feel the Lord's return (rapture) is very, very close. I sure hope so, this world has nothing to offer of any real substance... Anyway, I have a question... You have shown that the rapture could take place on May 23, 1999 (Pentecost). How do you substantiate this claim when the scripture clearly states: " one knows the day or the hour"? Please advise....Thanks and God Bless

My reply

Thanks for your kindness. I too think this world has nothing to offer of any real substance.
As far as the passage in Mt. 24:36 goes, the word "knows" is present tense. It was true in the day in which it was stated. Jesus did not say no one would ever know. We were to watch. It was so important that Jesus repeated it 23 times.

What we were watching for turned out to be the Six-Day War, when Israel grew leaves (Sinai, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights and West Bank) and fulfilled the fig tree parable of Mt. 24:32-34. That Sign of the End of the Age made figuring the timing of endtime events possible. One generation, 40 years, from 1967 is probably the end of the age.

I think I missed on the Rapture by one year. I didn't once consider that there could be a delay until last Pentecost passed. I should have, the parable of the ten virgins suggests it, but I didn't. Now, I can see why, in Rev. 3:10, we are to be rewarded for "patience" (waiting). It is very likely the time of testing to determine who is a wise virgin and who is a foolish one. Queen Esther was purified 12 months. A Jewish espousal was around a year to prove whether the bride was a virgin or not.

The Six-Day War also fulfilled Luke 21:24, because they took all of Jerusalem, including the temple area. We are living in the end times.

We should be certain that we have confessed all sins committed since we became Christians and be filled with the Holy Spirit, i.e., get ready and stay ready. Agape

Incoming Email

Have you heard anything about a timeline being found in the pyramids? I was listening to Jack Van Impe yesterday and heard something to the effect that a timeline was found in one of the pyramids and that it shows a date in May 1999 that has great consequence (I think it was May 14th but am not certain)and that Arafat has said that he will announce the statehood of Palestine on that date.

Unfortunately I was doing other things while listening and did not get all the details. Thought you might know something about it.

Wishing you and Ed a very happy New Year.

My reply

I have read several books on the pyramids, but never put much stock it any of them. It has been too long for me to remember the proposed dates. I don't know about a timeline with a date in May 1999, but May 4 is when Arafat plans to declare a Palestinian state.

Happy New Year. Ed, Dave and I finally got to go to Hometown Buffet yesterday to celebrate my birthday and Christmas. Yum! After Ed's Rehab today, he took a tumble. We had put groceries in the trunk. He went to his side, and I went around to the driver's side. I looked through the windows and--no Ed. Found him on the blacktop, not hurt bad, just superficially, thank the Lord. I think he was just too tired. It was his good foot that lost it, not the foot where he can't pull his toe toward his face. I told him to take his time and roll over and get on his knees before trying to get up. Just as I started to try to pull him up, a man asked if I needed help. Between the three of us, it wasn't easy, but I didn't hurt my back. Saturday, we have to go see Ed's mother, Millie Sparkes. She is in the hospital with pneumonia again.

Incoming Email

This is in reference to P&C 238 where you were instructed by a reader to change the focus of your web site to fit his/her wishes. The arrogance of some people would almost be laughable if the subject matter was not so serious. In my opinion, a christian who reacts in this manner MUST already be engulfed in the "strong delusion" spoken of in II Thess 2:11 that is to be in effect on planet Earth at the time of the revealing of the antichrist.

Since that time is now, then the 'delusion' must be very close to it's totality. What else would account for 87% belief that Clinton lied under oath before a grand jury and 75% belief that it is OK? Only a "strong delusion" (I suggest). But the biggest paradox of all is how to inform one that one is deluded. The delusion itself keeps the deluded from knowing they are deluded. I'm at a total loss of how to try to inform people of the truth. This 'delusion' is so strong that even the elect would have been deceived all the way to the end if Christ hadn't shortened the end for their sakes.

If you can think of any way to help break the delusion, please let me know.

Tell Ed hello and I hope you both have a great new year. Agape

My reply

I am going to keep right on doing what I think the Lord wants me to do, as you already know. It isn't as if there are no sites out there teaching the basics.

> 75% belief that it is OK? Only a "strong delusion" (I suggest).

That is a sign of our times. All I can do is shake my head.

I have no magic for breaking delusions. All we can do is try. Happy New Year.

Incoming Email

Thank you for the birthday email. Happy birthday to you too! Jim Bramlett happened to mention just recently that you had a birthday. Mine was number 50, but I don't feel any older. Sure do hope our LORD returns before I pass many more, though. And, I hope you are right about the rapture being next Pentecost. I currently do not have an independent opinion on when the rapture will be, but still believe Jesus will return as King in May 2004. The rapture could happen any time between now and then, and I believe one of the Pentecosts, for all the reasons you are familar, is quite possibly the correct date. Hope it is next year.

I am glad to hear you husband is doing better. My father was recently operated on for cancer. He is doing very well, but I know a bit what you have went through.

My reply

I am so sorry your dad has cancer. Hope he is doing well. Ed fell yesterday after we left Rehab. Too tired I guess. It wrenched him good, but wounds are superficial and he's just a bit sore here and there, chest included. I thank the Lord he's ok. I told him that I was glad he waited this long to pull that one, after the bone had healed, or it could have been a different story.

Note: Dave just found out that Ed has a cane. I had stuck it in the broom closet when we moved. I remember buying it when Ed fell off a ladder when installing draperies and dislocated his hip. However, none of us remembered that he had it until Dave walked in with it tonight. Guess Ed had better use it for awhile.

> believe Jesus will return as King in May 2004

I don't remember now why you chose 2004. I am just assuming that it was 1997 + 7 = 2004.

The Oslo Accords were signed on Sept. 13, 1993. Adding seven good years and seven bad years brings us to Sept. 13, 2007. The Accords were ratified in Israel three days later, on Tishri 1, 5754. Add 14 years to to that and you get Tishri 1, 5758, which just happens to be September 13, 2007. That sounds too good to be by accident. September 13, 2007 was the date I thought the shortened 2300-day (Dan. 8:14) Tribulation would end and the millennial Day of the Lord begin. That is 40 years after the Sign of the End of the Age, the Six-Day War of 1967, when Israel grew leaves and fulfilled the Fig Tree Parable of Mt. 24:32-34.

If you count back 2300 days from Tishri 1, 5768, by Jewish inclusive reckoning, you find the Seventieth WEEK of Daniel starting on the Feast of WEEKS in 2001. That sounds pretty good too.

From the catastrophe on the first day of the Millennium, Tishri 1, 5768, to the following Nisan 1 is exactly the seven months of Ezek. 39:12, when the Jews bury the dead.

I believe Christ will return that Nisan 1 (Apr. 6, 2008, the anniversary of the Crucifixion on our calendar). It is the beginning of the Jewish Regnal Year and Sacred Year, Regnal because Christ is King of kings, Sacred because he is Lord of lords. Christ would officially take office on Earth at the same time all the other Israelite kings officially took office.

Hosea 6:3 says that the Lord "shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." I believe Jesus was born as the former rain on Tishri 1 and will return as the latter rain on Nisan 1. Joel 2:23 says, he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month." This is the first day of the month. In Scripture, if no day number is listed, the first day of the month is assumed because the same word is used for new moon and month. The new moon is the first of the month.

Now take a look at Ezek. 29:17,21. I think verse 17 sets the day and month of the Second Advent: "in the first month, in the first day of the month." Then verse 21 cinches it: "In that day (Nisan 1, Ezek. 45:18,21) will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (Logos, Word) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."

I also believe that there is a gap between the Rapture and the Tribulation. Look at Rev. 17:12: "And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received NO kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast." Yet, as the Tribulation begins in Rev. 13, the ten kings are crowned as the Beast comes on the world scene. The difference is because The Revelation of Jesus Christ is written as if the Rapture were at hand. It is "at hand" in 1:3 and 22:10. Jesus signs off with "Surely I come quickly." He comes quickly at the Rapture (2:5; 3:11).

In Rev. 17:12 the time is at the Rapture. The ten kings that will be over the ten divisions of the world government are not yet in power. The time as Rev. 13 begins is at the beginning of the Tribulation. This is when they are given their crowns.

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© 1998 Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 12-31-98