Pro and Con 258

Uploaded 1-29-99, PM

Incoming Email

I just visited the 5 Doves site and I found this little jewel there. I have pasted it in for you. To read more of this person's work I have included the addresses. It is very lenghty but worth the read.

http://web.singnet.com.sg/~spirit5/jan99/prerapture1.htm
http://web.singnet.com.sg/~spirit5/jan99/prerapture2.htm
http://web.singnet.com.sg/~spirit5/jan99/prerapture3.htm
http://web.singnet.com.sg/~spirit5/jan99/prerapture4.htm

Essentially since Israel gained four times her territory in the six day war there have been only three Israeli leaders (Kings): Meir, Rabin & Netanyahu. Netanyahu {Netzer means "branch", in Hebrew & The "Net" in Netanyahu is a derivative of "branch". According to Zech 6: . 12Tell him this is what the L-RD Almighty says: `Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the L-RD. 13It is he who will build the temple of the L-RD, and he will be clothed with majesty and will sit and rule on his throne.} is an extremely highly educated (wise, like Solomon) man. In his fourth year (1999 Jewish inclusive reckoning--- 1996 being the first) the 3rd Temple will be started. In Oct./Nov. 1999 the Hale-Bopp Comet will intersect the orbital path of Saturn. Please refer to the discussion of Saturn and its significance at the end of this paper and recall Isaiah 55: 11 so is my word that goes out from my mouth:

It will not return to me empty, but will accomplish what I desire and achieve the purpose for which I sent it.

PS: More on the Temple
I forgot to include this additional information on the temple. This was copied from the 5 doves site. The writer has some new ideas and shares many of your findings. I hope you will look over the work done by this person. I gave you the web address earlier today....I sure feel excited because it seems many new exciting things are being uncovered lately. Look at what you have found in the last year. Amazing isn't it?

483 years 1517 to 2000. The 3rd Temple will probably commence in 1999. Solomon commenced construction on the first Temple in the fourth year of his reign. Netanyahu (& recall the "Net" in Netanyahu derives from the root base word for "Branch"), is the perfect type, foreshadow & similitude for modern day Solomon. Netanyahu had a younger brother who was killed on the raid in Entebbe, Uganda, Solomon's younger brother died. Netanyahu, an MIT grad (symbolic of Solomon's wisdom), began as the 3rd leader (type of King) of enlarged (post 1967) Israel (ignoring the brief & ineffectual reign of Levi Eschol). Netanyahu began in his reign in 1996 and using Jewish inclusive reckoning, 1999 will be his 4th year; and like Solomon in his fourth year, Netanyahu will commence the 3rd Temple. The end of 1999 and the year 2000 will probably commence "The time of Jacob's trouble". In the Brit Chaddasha we see that Kefar and Shaoul did not, for all practical large-scale purposes, preach the "Good News" (Gospels) to the Gentiles until 7 yr. After crucifixion at Cornelius' house. The Hebrew people will get the final 7 years of present human history to accept Yeshua.
---
In Christ

My reply

Thanks. Several have asked what I think about these files. I have downloaded all four parts and, Lord willing, will review them as I can and post on future Pro and Cons, maybe in sections. I'll see how it goes. I appreciate the URLs. Downloading goes like a jack rabbit compared to my email program if something is long. There seems to be a break in the quote ("will sit and rule on his throne.} is an extremely highly educated"). It could be that something dropped out in transmitting the email.

> "Net" in Netanyahu is a derivative of "branch".

And I understand that "yahu" means the same as the "iah" in Isaiah, which means "the salvation of the Lord." In Zech. 6:12, I think "The BRANCH" represents Christ.

Wow! This is off the subject, but I turned to this passage in the LXX. Look what verse 14 says, "And the CROWN shall be to them that wait PATIENTLY." That ties in with Rev. 3:10,11: "Because thou hast kept the word of my PATIENCE, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take they CROWN." Patient waiting pays.

> Netanyahu is a derivative of "branch". According to Zech 6:. 12Tell him this is what
> the L-RD Almighty says: `Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will
> branch out from his place and build the temple of the L-RD. 13It is he who will
> build the temple of the L-RD, and he will be clothed with majesty and will sit and
> rule on his throne.} is an extremely highly educated (wise, like Solomon) man. In
> his fourth year (1999 Jewish inclusive reckoning--- 1996 being the first) the 3rd
> Temple will be started.

Zech. 6:11-13, in the LXX, says, "thou shalt take silver and gold, and make crowns, and thou shalt put them upon the head of Jesus the son of Josedec ("Yehowtsadaq," Yahweh is righteousness) the high priest; and thou shalt say to him, Thus saith the Lord Almighty; Behold the man whose name is The Branch; and he shall spring up from his stem, and build the house of the Lord. And he shall receive power, and shall sit and rule upon his throne."

I do think a temple will be there by the beginning of the Tribulation (Rev. 11:1,2), and it is possible that it will be started in 1999, but I don't think this particular passage can be applied to Netanyahu.

> I sure feel excited because it seems many new exciting things are being uncovered lately.

It always gives me a thrill to learn something new. There is so much in the Bible, there seems to be no end to what will turn up if we apply ourselves to the study of it.

483 years 1517 to 2000.

When Gen. Allenby took Jerusalem, it was the Jewish year of 5278. 5278 + 483 = 5761 (our 2000/01). I expect the Seventieth Week of Daniel/the Tribulation to begin on the Feast of Weeks in 2001.

> the year 2000 will probably commence "The time of Jacob's trouble".

I think the time of Jacob's trouble is the Feast of Trumpets that begins the Millennium, not the Tribulation, or the 3 1/2 year Great Tribulation. That is when the seven trumpet judgments are cast on Earth.

Dan. 12:1 says, "AND at that time (when the False Prophet 'shall come to his end,' 11:45) shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a TIME OF TROUBLE, SUCH AS NEVER WAS SINCE THERE WAS A NATION EVEN TO THAT SAME TIME."

> In the Brit Chaddasha we see that Kefar and Shaoul did not, for all practical
> large-scale purposes, preach the "Good News" (Gospels) to the Gentiles until
> 7 yr. After crucifixion at Cornelius' house. The Hebrew people will get the
> final 7 years of present human history to accept Yeshua.

Good point.

Incoming Email

May 22, 1999 May be Rapture Day -Awesome Information-
I am just so excited, one thought after another its just flooding my mind, things are coming together like never before and I believe maybe, just maybe, that MAY 22, 1999 could very well be "THE RAPTURE". Just read for yourself and see what you think about this scenario: May 15, 1948 INDEPENDENCE OF ISRAEL
NOAH'S 7 DAY WARNING +7 + 50 YEARS JUBILEE, + 1 YEAR WAITING PERIOD
May 22 1998 + 1 = 1999
(MAY 22, 1999)
RAPTURE DAY?

SOMEONE HAD STATED QUITE AWHILE BACK ON ONE OF YOUR P & C'S, THAT THE LORD HAD SPOKEN TO THEM LAST PENTECOST 1998 AND HAD SAID "JUST ONE MORE" I BELIEVE THAT IT IS THE WAITING PERIOD FOR THE BRIDE, THE 1 YEAR

LOOK THIS OVER TOO, IT JUST SEEMS AMAZING:

ARAFAT WANTS TO DECLARE JERUSALEM--ISRAEL'S INDEPENDENCE ANNIVERSARY
..........ON.............................ON
MAY 4, 1999........TO........MAY 15, 1999 = 11 DAYS
ADD NOAH'S 7 DAY WARNING.....................+7 DAYS
MAY 4, 1999........TO........MAY 22, 1999 = 18 DAYS
(MAY 22, 1999)
PROBABLE RAPTURE DATE

Now Look over this last one:

This is a quote from Jim Bramlett Article "Signs in the Heavens" from the Five Doves Site, which you list on your Links.
"There is more evidence that 21 fragments of the Shoemaker-Levy Comet slammed into the planet Jupiter July 16-22, 1994 was a heavenly sign of Messiah's soon return. The total force of the 21 collisions is estimated at 100 million megatons of TNT (World Book Encyclopedia); the first collision alone 200,000 megatons, more than all the combined nuclear arsenals of the world, leaving a hole in Jupiter half the size of Earth." (I was amazed I have never read this article before, this is one of the places my number 21 comes into focus, but read on, there's more) "This is speculation, but it may be no accident that the comet collisions extended over seven days, possibly representing the SEVEN YEARS OF TRIBULATION. THE 21 SEPARATE COMET COLLISONS MAY REPRESENT THE SEVEN SEALS, SEVEN TRUMPETS AND SEVEN BOWLS OF REVELATION. Also, the SEVEN-DAY COLLISIONS ENDED JULY 22, the very day BEFORE the Jewish joyous celebration of TU BE-AV, which I am told could symbolize the Millennium."

Jesus said there would be signs in heavens before his return, I believe that this is definetely one of the signs he was speaking of, and I believe this may answer my question about the #21 the Lord gave me in the vision a few days back while I was in prayer. I think that God's Judgements are soon to fall, and I believe that God had shown us that he will give us a 7 DAY WARNING JUST LIKE HE DID FOR NOAH. THE COLLISIONS AS STATED ABOVE ENDED AFTER 7 DAYS.

It's seems like the Lord is revealing bit by bit, the information he wants us to have, I have never had so many thoughts racing through my mind about this subject until now. I am getting exciting, It is near even at the door. In the Love of Jesus Christ, Maranatha!

P.S. Marilyn you had stated in your writings that ISRAEL WAS REBORN on MAY 14, 1948, if this is the case then there it is the #21 again.
May 4th 1999 to May 14 1999 = 10 days
NOAH'S 7 DAYS WARNING............7 days
May 4 1999 to May 21 1999 =.....17 days
(MAY 21, 1999)
POSSIBLE RAPTURE DATE?
I don't know why but both dates seem right May 21 & May 22, 1999.
I just can't seem to make my mind up. Is it possible?

My reply

It could be Sivan 6, because the 2300 days of the shortened Tribulation run from Sivan 6, counted by inclusive reckoning, from Pentecost in 2001 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2007. Actually, the Jewish Talmudic calendar lists both Sivan 6 and Sivan 7 for Pentecost. Maybe I should follow suit.

Incoming Email

Re: Comet: From Jim Bramlett:
I checked that out the other day. It's a sham. In an e-mail to me, the "Chilean astronomer" denied any knowledge. He said to me: "It is not true. I am only interested in CCD astrophotography. The people that place a link to my page is lying. Maybe is a joke from a friend of mine."

The Web page owner is apparently depending totally on Nostradamos, nothing more, not God, not the Bible, and not science. Not credible, in my opinion. Jim

Note: I took the comet info off.

Incoming Email

Please send email re: 1998/1999.

My reply

I think I missed the Rapture by one year. I didn't take into consideration the 12 months Queen Esther was purified before she was taken to the king, or the fact that engagements were about a year to ensure that the bride was a virgin.

This seems to be a time of testing to see which are wise virgins and which are foolish virgins. Jesus told Peter that Satan wanted to have him to sift him in a sieve. We seem to be going through one year of special sifting right now. We must stand fast.

In the parable of the ten virgins in Mt. 25:1-13, first all ten "went forth to meet the bridegroom." Then "While the bridegroom tarried, they all slumbered and slept. And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him." This tarrying seems to be 12 months.

I am hoping for the Rapture next Pentecost, May 21 or 22, 1999. We must accept Christ as our own personal Saviour. We must also be ready, all sins since accepting Christ confessed, so we will win the best prize, being "accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man" (Lu. 21:36).

Incoming Email

Re: predictions
I wish whole-heartedly that I could agree with your "I know when the rapture will happen!" site, but I just find that impossible to do. The Bible clearly states in Matt. 24:36 "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only." Trying to predict when this is going to happen is in clear contrast with the words of the scriptures. 1 Ths. 5:1 & 2 says of our meeting with the Lord in the air: "But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night."

No one knows when Jesus is going to return, not even the angels in heaven. Only God knows. To have a site like yours seems to only be feeding the Y2K hunger for chaos and diregarding the sovereign words of the Bible. Maybe these verses, as well as the others in the Bible supporting our specified lack of knowlege as to when that day will occur, should be included on your site, as well. Thank you.

My reply

I can tell that you have not read much of my web site. I have answered this umpteen times.

> that day and hour knoweth no man

Knoweth is present tense. It was true the day it was stated. Jesus did not say we would never know. He said to watch. What we were watching for was the Sign of the End of the Age that made figuring out God's plan of end-time events possible.

I do not predict. I am not a prophet. Here is just the way it looks to me. Search the scriptures and see if these things are so.

I think the Six-Day War of 1967 was the sign. Israel grew leaves (Sinai, West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights) and fulfilled the fig tree parable of Mt. 24:32-34. One generation from then (1967 + 40 = 2007), end-of-the-age prophecies will be fulfilled. This age ends as the Jewish year 5768 begins. That Feast of Trumpets is the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. The agenda of "that day" is packed with events.

In Heaven, it is Coronation Day, the Marriage of the Lamb, the Judgment Seat of Christ and the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. On Earth, it is the day of the second Rapture, the Day of God's Wrath, the day of thick darkness, and the day the breaking of the seventh seal releases all seven of the trumpet judgments.

Seven Jewish months later (Ezek. 39:12), Christ returns on the first day of the Jewish Regnal year. At the full end of the 7-year Tribulation, there will be the Judgment of the Nations. Dominion will be taken from Satan, and then Armageddon will break out. It will last 40 days and 40 nights, then Satan and his fallen angels will be put in their prison. Millennial peace will begin.

> Trying to predict when this is going to happen is in clear contrast with
> the words of the scriptures.

Mark 13:23 says, "But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you ALL things." First Peter 1:10-12 says, "Of which salvation the prophets have inquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto YOU: SEARCHING what, or WHAT MANNER OF TIME the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow. Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into."

Are you missing "the grace that should come unto YOU: SEARCHING what, or WHAT MANNER OF TIME"? Believe me, I am searching what manner of time, and the grace does come unto you as you search. Don't miss out on it.

> 1 Ths. 5:1 & 2 says of our meeting with the Lord in the air: "But of the times and
> the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For you yourselves
> know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night."

Verse 4 says, "But ye, brethren, are NOT in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief." Verse 6 says, "Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch."

As for verses you are talking about that should be on my site. They are already on there. Every verse anyone could dredge up on it is there.

Are you watching? or are you letting yourself be lulled to sleep? Jesus said to "Watch."

Incoming Email

I came across this web site that agrees with the same date for the second advent of Christ on April 6th 2008. See if you agree with the rest of his time-line though.....
> http://www.newwine.org/

My reply

I'll take a look at it.

> Our nation is Babylon

I think Babylon is literal Babylon on the Euphrates River.

> The Bride must make herself ready (Revelation 19:7). To get ready
> for the rapture, we must get completely out of sin.

That is the safe way. How else can we be certain that we have enough oil of the Holy Spirit.

> [NOTE: The same Greek words for watch, thief, and hour are used in Matthew 24: 36, 42-44,
> saying "No one knows about that day or hour..." Jesus is teaching that if you don't
> watch, repent, and and be ready you won't know the hour He will return, and you
> won't be raptured.]

I can't see the Lord turning anyone down just because they do not know the hour He will return. We are supposed to watch, yes, but if we are ready, I think we will be included.

"The Two-Bride Post-Wrath Rapture Theory," by Philip B. Brown

> This rapture theory is explained in two parts. First is part when. The
> Post-Wrath Rapture places the rapture after the wrath of God but before
> Christ sets his foot on the Mount of Olives

I don't think either Rapture is after the wrath of God. His wrath is poured out on unbelievers, not believers. In Rev. 11:15-18, we can see that on the day of wrath, believers are in Heaven receiving rewards. Unbelievers are on Earth receiving their just rewards for their unbelief. Verse 18 says, "thy WRATH is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be JUDGED, and that thou shouldest give REWARD unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; AND shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."

The second Rapture is as the days of Lot. Fire fell that same day, but Lot got out FIRST (Lu. 17:29).

> The entire Church goes through the Tribulation but the 144,000 get
> their spiritual bodies seven years prior because they get out of sin first.

If the entire church goes through the Tribulation, why are we to pray that we will be accounted worthy of escaping all these things (Lu. 21:36)? I think the 144,000 are part of the second Rapture.

> Timeline of the Great Tribulation...An eight-year period is shown between the two
> thousand year Church Age, and the one thousand year millennial reign of Christ. The
> eight-year period starts with Nisan 1, April 6, 2000 and is complete on Nisan 1,
> April 6, 2008.

I disagree with both the starting date and the ending date. I think Christ's Second Advent will be on Apr. 6, 2008, but that is the beginning of the Regnal Year and is not the start, end of the shortened Tribulation, or full end of the Seventieth Week of Daniel.

> The two witnesses begin to prophecy on Passover, April 7, 2001.

I think it is the Feast of Weeks/Pentecost, Monday, Sivan 6, May 28, 2001. That is more appropriate for the beginning of the Seventieth Week of Daniel.

The first day of the millennial Day of the Lord is on the Feast of Trumpets, when the seven trumpet judgments are cast on Earth. According to Dan. 8:14, the shortened Tribulation is 2300 days. Counting by Jewish inclusive reckoning, from the Feast of Weeks in 2001 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2007 is 2300 days.

The 2300-day count is not true if you shift the years a bit, either. I think it serves to drop the plan of end-time events into its proper place on our calendar.
Sivan 6, 5759 (May 21, 1999) to Tishri 1, 5766 ( Oct. 4, 2005) = 2329 days.
Sivan 6, 5760 (June 9, 2000) to Tishri 1, 5767 (Sept. 23, 2006) = 2298 days.
Sivan 6, 5761 (May 28, 2001) to Tishri 1, 5768 (Sept 13, 2007) = 2300 days.

There is another thing to take into consideration. The last year must be a Jewish leap year, having a 13th month, on the Jewish Calendar. Ezek. 39:12 shows that the Israelites bury the dead for seven months after the Day of God's Wrath before the Lord returns in glory. The years 5766 and 5767 are NOT leap years; 5768 IS a leap year. I think the 2300 days need to end on Tishri 1, 5768. Then there will be the necessary seven Jewish months from Tishri 1, 5768 to the Second Advent on Nisan 1, 5768 (Apr. 6, 2008). There will also be the necessary 2300 days for the shortened Tribulation preceding Tishri 1, 5768, from the Feast of Weeks in 2001 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2007. Everything fits. The 40 years of probation, from the Sign of the End of the Age in 1967 to the end of the age in 2007, fits too.

The year 5768 (our 2007/8) is a leap year. There are seven months (Ezek. 39:12) between the Feast of Trumpets on Tishri 1, 5768 (Sept. 13, 2007) and Nisan 1, 5768 (April 6, 2008), when the Lord returns. They are Tishri, Cheshvan, Kislev, Teveth, Shevat, Adar, and Adar II.

> From the abomination of desolation, there is 1290 days (Daniel 12:11). After the 1290
> days is Nisan 1, April 6, 2008, the beginning of Christ's Millennial Reign.

I think that Christ returns on Apr. 6, 2008, but that the 1290 days include 30 days of mourning the dead after the Judgment of the Nations at the end of the 1260th day. Dominion is to be taken away from Satan at the end of the seven years (1260 + 1260 = 2520 days).

Rev. 17:11 says, "And the beast (Satan) that was (in the False Prophet), and is not (has come out of him), even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition." The reign of Satan himself, after the False Prophet is deposed, is these seven months, and must equal 220 days (2520 - 2300 = 220). Tishri 1, 5768 + 220 days = Nisan 15, 5768 (Sunday, Apr. 20, 2008), the Feast of Unleavened Bread. I think the following day, Nisan 16, the Feast of Firstfruits, will be the day of the Judgment of the Nations. Dominion will thus be taken from Satan on the anniversary of the day Jesus Christ earned the right to have dominion, Resurrection Day, Nisan 16, 30 AD.

The 220 days do not fit this way in just any year.
Tishri 1, 5766 + 220 days = Iyar 13 (May 11, 2006).
Tishri 1, 5767 + 220 days = Iyar 13 (May 1, 2007).

To me, the whole plan only drops into place on our calendar if we start counting the Seventieth Week of Daniel from the Feast of Weeks in 2001. From the day, June 5, 1968, that I learned that the Six-Day War of 1967 was the Sign of the End of the Age, I have tested many blocks of years. I can only see this one place where everything works out correctly.

Oh my goodness. The doorbell just rang. Someone awfully nice sent me the Complete Works of Josephus. It's a good thing I just finished this. I've got to do a little exploring. Thank you ----, and thank you Lord.

Note: I found something interesting in the book right away. Abraham was 75 (Gen. 12:4) when he was given the promise. He was 125 when he went to the mount to sacrifice Isaac. Therefore, that symbolic picture was 50 years after Abraham received the promise.

I can easily see that the Abraham/Isaac drama at the end of a 50-year period portrayed the actual sacrifice and resurrection of the body of Jesus Christ. The 50 years may also portray the resurrection of the Body of Christ at the Rapture in the Jubilee year that starts next Nisan 1, March 18, 1999. This Jubilee year is counted from the first day of the Sacred year at the time of the Exodus, the Jewish 2231 (AH 2513, BC 1530).

Gen. 12:1,2 says, "NOW the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee: And I will make of thee a great nation." What happened 50 years ago? The year 1999 - 50 = 1949, when Israel's War of Independence was over and she was accepted into the UN as an independent nation. Those Jewish people had left other countries, as Abraham did, and gathered unto the land that the Lord showed Abraham. Just as Isaac was, in a figure, raised from the dead at the end of a 50-year period, will the dead in Christ be raised from the dead at the end of a 50-year period?

Incoming Email

I believe what you say is valid for one thing, you said that you would continue with the web-site until the end of 1998, now it is 1999 and your web- site is still the same as last year. I don't say this to judge, I just believe if word is to be taken seriously it needs actions that apply. It is cool though we all make mistakes.

Anyway's the one year is true about marriage, and marriage wasn't ordained until God made the Jew through Abraham, first mention of it was at that time not before through Noah or Adam and Eve, at least to what the word Marriage means and stands for.

I have been with you since Pro-Con 45 so hang -in there, I have alway's love you, when you care you'll see what the other can't...be their eyes to give them more vision. After all Christian First, but member of the BODY second...boy I sure would love to talk to you about that. Love

My reply

Thanks for your information and nice comments.

> continue with the web-site until the end of 1998, now it is 1999 and your web-
> site is still the same as last year.

I was pretty sure I could continue until the end of the year because it was paid until then. After that, I wasn't sure if I could manage the $24.95 per month, but several have helped me toward that end. The Lord must want me to keep it up, so I will do my best to do my part.

> After all Christian First, but member of the BODY second

We can talk about that. I think that when we accept Christ as our own personal Saviour, he baptizes us that moment with his Holy Spirit, and that is what seals us and binds us into the Body of Christ. Now, like Paul, the prize that I strive for is to be chosen as a member of the Bride of Christ.

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© 1998, 1999, Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 1-29-99