Pro and Con 373

Uploaded 8-14-99

Incoming Email

Thank You for your marvelous website and for all the inspired study you have put into it. It rings very true! I really like how your projected chronology page correlates with Jewish holiday dates. amazing!...With Thanks for All and the Lord's special Blessings to you.

My reply

Thanks to you for such kind words. I am not a prophet. These things are just the way it looks to me. So compare everything with Scripture and see if these things are so. I have studied as hard as I can go since before 1960, and I am still learning all the time. If you have special insight on anything, please share it with me. Agape

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Marylin how could the body of Christ be also the Bride of Christ? If the body is the bride of christ then we would not be able to use his name until after the ceremony right? We have his name to use right now. Since we are all definitely apart of the body of christ, it seems to me the bride is something else. I was reading in revelations and the new jerusalem seems to be the bride. (the exact passage escapes me right now)

Also wouldn't the bride be our bride also since we are apart of his body??

I know you study alot and thats great but you really aren't open to september for a rapture date are you? everytime someone mentions it you always refer back to the Spring time of 2000. I guess we'll find out right?

My reply

Mt. 9:14,15 says, "Why do we and the Pharisees fast oft, but thy DISCIPLES fast not? And Jesus said unto them, Can the CHILDREN OF THE BRIDECHAMBER mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them." Therefore the disciples are members of the Bride of Christ. In Mt. 25, five of the ten virgins go with the bridegroom when he comes. They represent the Philadelphians before whom the open door is set (Rev. 3:8).

> how could the body of Christ be also the Bride of Christ?

The Body of Christ includes all believers. Therefore, it includes the foolish virgins like the Laodiceans. The Bride of Christ is that part of the Body of Christ that is accounted worthy to escape all these things that are to come to pass during the Tribulation (Lu. 21:36). They are the group that are taken up in the Pre-Trib Rapture. It seems that the rest have to wait for the Pre-Wrath Rapture.

We are called Christians now, and the Bride of Christ, but each of us will get "a new name" individually (Rev. 2:17) and will collectively be called the "Lamb's wife" (Rev. 21:9). Our home will be New Jerusalem. Rev. 3:12 says, I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem."

The Body of Christ is a spiritual body held together by the Spirit of Christ. In that way, we are one with him. However, You can't take that analogy too far. We are not going to marry ourselves, but Christ.

If the Song of Solomon 2:10-14 applies to the Rapture, it will take place in the spring. There are ranks in the first resurrection. The first group was raised after the Resurrection on the Feast of Firstfruits. It seems reasonable to expect the next group to be raised on Pentecost since the third group will be raised on the Feast of Trumpets. Those three feasts are consecutive. Also, the first trump of the Bible sounded at Sinai on or very near Pentecost.

I saw two meteors tonight. The first was a very long thick streak of light starting almost directly overhead. That was the most spectacular one I ever saw. The other was small, off to the side, and quickly gone, more like what I expected to see. I just got lucky on that first one, because I went out an hour early that time.

His reply

Re: body of christ
Hello again, I don't fully understand what you mean by this, Who is the BrideChamber? Where does it say that we are the Bride of Christ in the Bible?

I still don't understand how the bride of Christ can be from the body of christ? Is seems like an either or type of situation.

I can find plenty of places in the bible that says we are the body of christ. And how can his name be given to the bride if not maried yet?

My reply

The Bridechamber is a place, not a who. In Joel 2:15,16, it is called a "closet." That scripture says, "Blow the trumpet in Zion (it is the Feast of Trumpets in the heavenly Zion), sanctify a fast (The Day of Atonement is 10 days away), call a solemn assembly (for the Coronation of Christ and the Marriage of the Lamb): Gather the people (at the Pre-Wrath Rapture), sanctify the congregation, assemble the elders (12 patriarchs of the 12 tribes of Israel plus the 12 apostles), gather the children, and those that suck the breasts (the children are caught up to Heaven before the Wrath of God falls on unbelievers on Earth): let the bridegroom (Christ) go forth of his chamber, and the BRIDE (the Bride of Christ) OUT OF HER CLOSET (chuppah, a canopy, chamber or closet, i.e., the wedding canopy)."

II Cor, 11:2 says, "I have ESPOUSED YOU to one husband, that I may present you AS A CHASTE VIRGIN TO CHRIST."

Eph. 5:25-32 says, "Husbands, love your WIVES, even as Christ also loved the CHURCH, and gave himself for it. That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish....For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his WIFE, and they two shall be one flesh. This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church."

John 3:29 says, "He that hath the BRIDE (the Bride of Christ) is the BRIDEGROOM" (Christ).

Rom. 7:4 says, "Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be MARRIED to another, even to him who is raised from the dead" (Christ).

Rev. 19:7 says, "the MARRIAGE OF THE LAMB IS COME, AND HIS WIFE HATH MADE HERSELF READY. And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of SAINTS."

> I still don't understand how the bride of Christ can be from the body of
> christ? Is seems like an either or type of situation.

It was demonstrated when Eve was taken out of the body of Adam.

> how can his name be given to the bride if not maried yet?

How do you know that we won't have a new name later? Rev. 2:17 says, "To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it."

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Re: Preachers' Kids The Good, The Bad & The Ugly
Thanks for your inspiration. You have encouraged me to do what others told me I would never be able to do. I am a 25 year old writer who recently published my first book entitled Preachers' Kids The Good, The Bad & The Ugly. It wasn't easy, but when I look at what you have done I know that there is hope. You've helped me to dream a little more, think a little more and believe a little more! Doing those things I've grown not just a little--I've grown alot!, Peace, Sherry Grant

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Re: Unusual 30-day period! (Jim Bramlett) ...On or about Rosh HaShannah (September 11), the newly discovered Comet Lee will be at its closest point to the earth! This is most unusual! Comets are also seen in Jewish history as a sign of trouble. The Jewish-Roman historian Josephus recorded that a comet hung over Jerusalem "like a sword" just before the Roman invasion of A.D. 66.

THIS ONE 30-DAY PERIOD OF POSSIBLY GREAT BIBLICAL SIGNIFICANCE BEGINS WITH A RARE SOLAR ECLIPSE (8-11-99) AND ENDS WITH A RARE COMET! The period is dramatically framed by signs in the heavens. I find that incredible!
Hi: Let's hope that 5760 is the year of the Rapture.

Christine posted this interesting bit lately: "TO HAVE Jesus "tarrying" or "delaying" His coming for His Church FIRST you would need a logical prospective date or dates SET for His imminent arrival." I hadn't thought of that.

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Re: asteroid hits
Would you please clarify the timing of the coming comet/asteroid impacts?

Pat Robertson's book, "The End of the Age", has the Tribulation starting with an asteroid impact off Los Angeles, and not the Pre-Trib Rapture. As you have explained it, the impacts (will be 2 of them) will occur much later.

Also, please clarify your basis for this quote from P&C 342: "...the day the asteroid impacts Earth and turns it upside down, the days seem to be normal 24-hour days...." Does this mean the earth will change its perceived revolution here on the surface so that sunrise occurs over California instead of the present East Coast? Thanks as always for your insight.

My reply

I believe the seven trumpet judgments will strike Earth on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord, the Feast of Trumpets, Sept. 13, 2007. The second and third trumpet accounts tell of the two large asteroid impacts. The one in the Mediterranean Sea stops Gog's army that is attacking Israel. The other destroys literal Babylon. These impacts cause the smoky darkness seen immediately afterward cutting the light from the sun, moon and stars by one third.

Rev. 8:8-11 says, "And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire (probably part of an incoming binary asteroid) was cast into the sea (the Mediterranean): and the third part of the sea became blood: And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star (aster, star, asteroid or flaming meteorite) from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters: And the name of the star is called Wormwood (meaning bitter): and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter."

Zeph. 2:4,5 shows us that the asteroid strikes at noon. It says, "Gaza shall be forsaken, and Ashkelon a desolation: they shall drive out Ashdod at the NOON day, and Ekron shall be rooted up. Woe unto the inhabitants of the sea coast."

Psa. 91:1-14 shows not only that the catastrophic impacts take place at noon, but that believers will ALL be in Heaven before the impacts. It says, "HE that dwelleth in the SECRET PLACE of the most High shall abide under the shadow of the Almighty (Christ, Rev. 1:8)....He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust...Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night; nor for the arrow that flieth by day; Nor for the pestilence that walketh in darkness; nor for the DESTRUCTION THAT WASTETH AT NOONDAY....Only with thine eyes shalt thou behold and see the reward of the wicked. Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation....Because he hath set his love upon me, therefore will I deliver him: I will set him on high, because he hath known my name."

Ed and I got an object lesson on hiding in feathers the other day. We were eating at Arby's in Moreno Valley, CA. Outside the drive-thru curbing is some grass, a hedge, and a grassy slope showing above the hedge. We often see squirrels, but this day, there were three beautiful long-legged ring-necked Sellers Jays (our neighbor's kid told us what they were). The father Jay was the lookout on top of the grassy slope. The mother and baby were on our side of the hedge. The baby would brouse around for food awhile, then run to the mother and dive right into her fluffed breast feathers. We couldn't even see the baby then. After resting awhile in that safe place, the baby would emerge and forage again. It did that several times. When the father finally wanted to find something to eat too, the Mother ran up on the top concrete step climbing the slope and played the lookout. We hated to leave, it was so interesting to watch. I've never seen a baby bird with such long thin legs. It had its feathers, so was an exact smaller duplicate of the parents.

Eze. 25:16,17 also touches on the destruction of the sea coast. The Lord says he will "destroy the remnant of the sea coast. And I will execute great vengeance upon them with furious rebukes; and they shall know that I am the LORD, when I shall lay my vengeance upon them."

Job 20:23 says of the False Prophet, the wicked one, "When he is about to fill his belly, God shall cast the fury of his wrath upon him, and shall rain it upon him while he is eating."

> "the day the asteroid impacts Earth and turns it upside down, the days seem to be normal
> 24-hour days..." Does this mean the earth will change its perceived revolution here on the
> surface so that sunrise occurs over California instead of the present East Coast?

Isa. 24:1 says, "BEHOLD, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it UPSIDE DOWN, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof." Beyond that, it is hard for me to visualize sunrise. There will be thick darkness obscuring it too. Since the Earth is rotating toward the east, it seems that this blow will cause Jesus' long day, of which Joshua's long day was a type.

Since the broom, or "besom of destruction" (Isa. 14:23) sweeps from Babylon to Egypt, and there will be fire in Russia, it seems that the asteroid comes in at an oblique angle from the north east, changing the rotation of this globe just until it regains its equilibrium.

I have an idea that the asteroid is brought in early by means of a whirlwind, shortening the time, so that it will hit Earth a glancing blow instead of blowing the world apart coming straight in on a later orbit. Mt. 24:22 says, "except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened."

Jer. 23:19,20 says, "Behold, a whirlwind of the LORD is gone forth in fury (His fury comes up in his face when Israel is attacked, Eze. 38:18). even a grievous whirlwind: it shall fall grievously upon the head of the wicked (the False Prophet, commander and chief of the united nations' army led by Gog). The anger of the LORD shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider (biyn, understand) it perfectly."

The False Prophet is the foolish idol shepherd. Zech. 11:17 says, "Woe to the idol shepherd that leaveth the flock (moves from Israel to Babylon)! the sword ("sword of the Lord," Isa. 34:6) shall be upon his arm, and upon his right eye: his arm shall be clean dried up, and his right eye shall be utterly darkened."

Pieces of the asteroid will hit in other places also. Isa 34:2-10 says, "the indignation of the LORD is upon ALL NATIONS, and his FURY upon ALL THEIR ARMIES (the united nations' army): he hath utterly destroyed them, he hath delivered them to the slaughter....And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved (vanish, flow away), and the heavens (atmospheric) shall be rolled together as a scroll (so men can see the Sign of the Son of Man, Mt. 24:30): and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree. For my sword ("flaming sword," Gen. 3:24) shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, AND upon the people of my curse, to judgment...for the LORD hath a sacrifice in Bozrah, and a great slaughter in the land of Idumea (Edom)....For it is THE DAY ('that day,' the 2300th day of the Tribulation) of the LORD'S vengeance, and the year (5768) of recompences for the controversy of Zion (Jerusalem). And the streams thereof shall be turned into pitch, and the dust thereof into brimstone, and the land thereof shall become burning pitch. It shall not be quenched night nor day; the smoke thereof shall go up for ever: from generation to generation it shall lie waste; none shall pass through it for ever and ever."

Eze. 21:25-27 says, "And thou, profane wicked prince of Israel, whose day is come, when iniquity shall have an end, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Remove the diadem, and take off the crown: this shall not be the same: exalt him that is low (Jesus), and abase him that is high (the False Prophet). I will overturn, overturn, overturn, it: and it shall be no more, until he come (seven months later, Eze. 39:12) whose right it is; and I will give it him."

Incoming Email

Just keeping in touch...eagerly reading your website! I feel excited, a sort of a quickening of the spirit. if you will. I can't imagine how the trumpet will sound---i.e., will it be a deafening (all the saved will hear it) or normal sounding in believers ears? Will ALL (saved & unsaved alike) see Him in the clouds coming for his bride or just the bride? Only the bride will hear His Voice say, "Come up hither" and then go up to Him. Will the body of Christ also see this or, because they are not watching, miss it??? Questions, questions!! Surely it will be dreadful if they do see it, knowing they ARE saved and then not go. EVERYONE SHOULD KNOW OF THE 2 RAPTURES!! That is SO IMPORTANT!!! I continually THANK our Lord Jesus for leading me to you now at His VERY, VERY, SOON COMING and pray He will enlighten you even more so for us who look to you for wisdom and knowledge that you so graciously share for our benefit. Agape

My reply

Since Sinai seems to be the type, I expect the trumpet will be "exceeding loud" (Ex. 19:16). I don't have all the answers, but I think many people will see us go up. They might be the ones that would be willing to die for their faith during the Tribulation.

Psalm 40:1-3 says, "I WAITED patiently for the LORD; and he inclined (bent down) unto me, and heard my cry. He brought me up also out of an horrible pit (out of the Earth, as Jeremiah was), out of the miry clay (our bodies of clay), and set my feet upon a rock (the heavenly planet), and established my goings. And he hath put a new song (sung after the Rapture in Revelation 5:9) in my mouth, even praise unto our God: MANY SHALL SEE IT, and fear, and shall trust in the LORD."

The Lord never leaves himself without a witness. Those that see the Rapture take place may be the evangelists of the day, spreading the hope of being taken up in the group that appears in Rev. 7:14.

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FROM CAPS....Marilyn, here is some infor. I sent in response to someone writing about this subject on the 5 Doves:
Ralph's comments about Gethsemene reminded me of discussions last year about this same thing. I believe Marilyn Agee saw the same analogy regarding Matthew 26:36-46. This acount is also given in Mark 14:32-42. Possibly we have the following scenerio: The First watch for the Rapture was set for Pentecost 1998. The Second watch for the Rapture was set for Pentecost 1999. The Third watch is now set for Pentecost 2000. When Jesus came to the disciples the THIRD TIME He said, Mark 14:41 "Sleep on now, and take your REST: it is enough, the hour is come." Various translators have difficulty with these verses because, in the KJV they do not seem to make sense. However, I believe that the KJV probably is accurate. Here's why: The disciples were "trying" to watch. They were probably half asleep and half awake. One time when Jesus returned , the second time, the text says "neither did they know what to answer Him." This implies they were not totally asleep. People do tend to sleep when extremely depressed. So, coming to them the THIRD TIME , why did Jesus say , in effect, "You might as well go on and sleep and rest; you've tried to watch enough, and besides it is too late now to watch since the HOUR has now come .?" What hour had come? The HOUR OF TEMPTATION He had warned about. It was now too late to prepare by watching and praying. Even though the disciples had not prepared adequately, and failed the test, I believe that the words that Jesus spoke about "Sleep on now and Take your REST" were prophetic for those diciples at the END OF THE FINAL WATCH at the end of this age who WILL "TAKE THEIR REST" when raptured !! The HOUR of Temptation was entered upon by the disciples. In Revelation 3:10 the Church of Philadelphia is promised to be "kept from THE HOUR OF TEMPTATION that will come upon the whole world", because they "kept the word of my patience" in patiently waiting and watching for Jesus' return. The key seems to be maintaining the watch in order to be kept from the hour of the tribulation. Also, the THIRD watch, from the above scriptures, appears to be the FINAL WATCH. God Bless.

My reply

Mark 14:41 says, "And he cometh the third time (year, Rev. 12:6,14), and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take your REST: it is enough, the hour is come." This "rest" reminds me of Psa. 149:5, "Let the saints be joyful IN GLORY: let them sing aloud upon their beds." Rest sounds like Heaven to me. That is something I haven't gotten enough of because of my studying into the wee hours.

Which reminds me, last night (Aug. 12/13), around midnight, I went out to see if I could spot a meteor. I was rewarded with one blazing streak overhead that was so long and thick, I was flabbergasted. What a reward for a quick peek.

I sure hope the third watch is the last watch. The third year in the parable of the barren fig tree is the one in which the Lord speaks. He doesn't come looking or speaking in the extra year.

Incoming Email

...Appreciate all the articles and info...and the study of REVELATION [singular, tho some do pluralize] which is my favorite study also. I am saddened that so many of the BRETHREN find no need, interest or urgency in studying or "WATCHING" as the LORD told us to do. I am encouraged, however, by ALL THOSE WHO DO, as I, myself, have for over 30 years.

I live in San Diego....NOT far from you!!!!

My reply

I sent my book MSS to Avon Books titled The Master Key, Revelation's Secrets Revealed. They changed the name to Revelations 2000. At that time, I thought the Rapture would be Pentecost, 1998. I didn't think 2000 applied at all. Now, the Rapture may turn out to be Pentecost, 2000. Strange, huh?

Incoming Email

Dear Mj, I love your website and want to share something about the bride of Christ that I ran across just recently, You will enjoy this very much. Much love
The Bride of Christ
...Here is one last point concerning the identity of the bride....If the Church, "the Body of Christ" is identified as "the bride of Christ", then we would not have the legal right to take on His identity or be considered one with Him. If we were only "a bride," we would not have the legal right to use His name until after the marriage actually took place.

So you can see the far reaching implications of a simple misunderstanding of the identity of the Church of Jesus Christ. The Body of Christ vs the bride of Christ. The Scriptures plainly reveal He has already given us His name.

"And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you. Hitherto have ye asked nothing in my name: ask, and ye shall receive, that your joy may be full. These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall show you plainly of the Father. At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you." We now go directly to the Father in the name of the son. (John 16:23-26)

Here is a scripture that again will show that the bride is actually the New Jerusalem and that we will be married to her with Christ Jesus.

"Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name."(Rev 3:12)

"And I John saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God." (Rev 21:2-3)

"And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will show thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God." (Rev 21:9-10)

My reply

> Here is a scripture that again will show that the bride is actually the
> New Jerusalem and that we will be married to her with Christ Jesus.

Sure, and I suppose this person thinks the Lord is a planet, a bright and morning star, and that the literal CITY of New Jerusalem can speak and say, "Come."

After all, Rev. 22:16 says, "I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. And the Spirit and the BRIDE say, Come."

Saying "that the bride is actually the New Jerusalem" city is about as sensible as saying that since the church is the temple of the Holy Spirit, and the apostles are foundation stones, the apostles are literal stones, or that since Christ is the corner stone, he is a literal stone.

This writer should have fun visualizing drinking from a rock, i.e., with I Cor. 10:4. It says that the Israelites "did all drink the same spiritual drink: for thy drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ." Also, visualizing us as piles of wheat and salt should bring some chuckles.

However, I Cor. 10:4 shows us that we are not to take it that Christ is a literal Rock, or a planet. Neither are we to take it that the Bride of Christ is a literal city.

Jesus said, "Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given. For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath. Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand" (Mt. 13:11-13).

Christ said that he was the bright and morning star because his throne is on that bright and morning star. He is the corner stone "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ" (I Cor. 3:11). The apostles and prophets are "the foundation" (Eph. 2:20) of the Bride that will reside in New Jerusalem. Therefore, the apostles' names are on the foundation of "the wall of the city" (Rev. 21:14).

"But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned" (I Cor. 2:14).

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Updated 8-14-99