Pro and Con 387

Uploaded 9-12-99

Incoming Email

I will give you a hint about the date that the believers are looking for. Jesus was born September 29th 1 B.C just advance forward 2000 years. The ancient Rabbis wrote the year of the resurrection of the dead would come at the end of the Jewish year 5760. We have one more year to go. Maranatha.
----- From the Tribe of Benjamin

My reply

I just don't think Sept. 29, BC 1, was the birth of Christ.

Jesus was baptized in the 15th year of Tiberius, 26 AD. Tiberius began to Co-Rex with Augustus in 12 AD. He had authority over Palestine from then on, Augustus concerning himself with other parts of his kingdom. Tiberius became Sole-Rex in 14 AD.

Jesus was about 30 years old when he was baptized in 26 AD. This puts his birth in BC 5 (30 - 5 + 1 for there was no zero year = 26 AD). I think he was born on Tishri 1.

At his first Passover after John baptized him, the temple was 46 years in building. It was started in BC 20/19. This makes the 46th year 27 AD.

I don't see how these things can be changed.

Lets see where adding 2000 years to the Jewish Tishri 1, in the fall of BC 5 brings us. 2000 - 5 + 1 = Tishri 1, in the fall of 1996 AD. Strange that adding 3 1/2 years, like Jesus' ministry, brings us to spring 2000. Food for thought.

His reply

Also watch for the 7 year peace agreement between the Jews and Arabs to be signed on September 29th 2000 and confirmed by the Anti-Christ. Jesus was born on Tishri 15th The Feast of Tabernacles. The Rapture will occur 12:00 midnight Jerusalem time.
---- From the Tribe of Benjamin

My reply

...I think Jesus was born as the former rain (Hos. 6:3) on Tishri 1 (Joel 2:23), the Feast of Trumpets, and will return on Nisan 1 (Eze. 29:17,21), the first day of the Regnal Year, in a Jewish leap year (Eze. 39:12). Why do you pick Tabernacles? Shalom

His reply

Re: Hyssop Tea
Marilyn, My daughter contracted Mono last September in her second year of college. I made her drink three cups of Hyssop tea every 24 hours, one cup every 8 hours, for three weeks and she was totally cured. Anti-biotics will not kill the virus but the hyssop will. To make the tea use two to three teaspoons of cut and sifted hyssop with eight ounces of water, bring to a boil then let the tea steep for ten minutes. The high Levite Priests cured leprosy with the Hyssop that grew out of the wall at the Temple. The tea will also kill fungi. The tea is excellent for respiratory, digestive, and nervous problems with absolutely no side effects.

Also the Levite Priests used Hyssop to cleanse the Temple in Jerusalem. Since our body is a temple for the Holy Spirit there may be some connection and hidden symbolism. Maranatha
---- From the Tribe of Benjamin

My reply

Thank you so much. I printed it out for Dave. A neighbor told me today she had Mono when she was 16. I think she will also be interested in this.

I have read that when Hissop molds, it produces penicillin too.

In your former email, you said,
> Also watch for the 7 year peace agreement between the Jews and Arabs to be
> signed on September 29th 2000 and confirmed by the Anti-Christ.

The Final Status Agreement is supposed to be signed Sept. 13, 2000. I expect it to be confirmed by the Beast (first beast of Rev. 13), the Tribulation Pope, on the Feast of Weeks in 2001 (Sivan 6, 5761). The 2300 days of Dan. 8:14, counted by inclusive reckoning, run between the Feast of Weeks in 2001 and the Feast of Trumpets in 2007 (Tishri 1, 5768, first day of the millennial Day of the Lord). That is the last time that span will equal 2300 days before the 40 years of the probation of the last generation are up (1967 + 40 = 2007).

The probation of the first generation of the church era was 40 years (as foretold in Eze. 4:6) (30 AD + 40 = 70 AD). For the Jews, this era started with a 40-year period and ends with a 40-year period. At the end of the former 40 years, Jerusalem and the temple were removed from the Jews. As the latter 40 years began, Jerusalem and the temple were returned to the Jews. The symmetry is beautiful. Just before the former 40 started, John the Baptist preached in the spirit of Elijah to prepare the way for the Messiah. Before the latter 40 end, Elijah will come to prepare the way for the Messiah (Mal. 4:5). John the Baptist ended his ministry when he was killed. Elijah will end his ministry when he will be killed. John the Baptist preached until the 3 1/2 year ministry of the Messiah, the true Christ, began. Elijah will prophecy until the 3 1/2 year ministry of the False Prophet, the Antichrist, begins. As the former 40 years began, Christ was rejected. As the latter 40 years end, Christ will be crowned King of kings and Lord of lords.

In the Jewish year that the former 40 years began, Christ ascended to Heaven. In the Jewish year that the latter 40 years end, Christ will return from Heaven. At the beginning of the former 40 years, Christ had the apostles with him as he was arrested to be taken before the judgment seat. At the end of the latter 40 years, the apostles will be with him at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

Near the beginning of the former 40 years, Jesus attended the marriage at Cana. It was at the beginning of his ministry. The timing is not perfect here, and he said that his hour had not yet come. He knew how this would stack up in our days. At the end of the latter 40 years, Jesus will attend the Marriage of the Lamb. Shalom and Maranatha

Incoming Mail

"...Matthew 24:31 is not referring to the Rapture...But doesn't it say that the "sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven?" Yes, but your guess is as good as mine as to precisely what that sign might be; perhaps it is the sign of the cross or the star of David.

***From Marilyn: Maybe I can add something that would help here. Rev. 6:14-17 seems to be a parallel passage. It says, "And the heaven (i.e., smoke in the atmosphere from the falling 'stars,' asteroid pieces or meteorites) departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places. And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the FACE OF HIM THAT SITTETH ON THE THRONE, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For THE GREAT DAY OF HIS WRATH IS COME; and who shall be able to stand?"

***I think this is the Sign of the Son of Man of Mt. 24:30. At this time, they SEE Christ in the sky. This is the day of catastrophe, when there will be a worldwide earthquake. The Lord GOD says, "Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in THE EYES of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD" (Eze. 38:23). This day is seven months before the Second Advent (Eze. 39:12).

"...Matthew 24:30,31 has to do with ethnic Jews (Isaiah 45:4)! These are the twelve tribes of the nation of Israel....It has nothing to do with the Church or the nations and, therefore, can have nothing to do with the blessed hope of the believer, the Rapture.

"It is generally not disputed (by pre-wrath rapturists, or otherwise) that Matthew 24:29-31 refers to the physical return of Jesus Christ to the earth.

***From the Day of God's Wrath on the 2300th day of the shortened Tribulation to the Second Advent is 7 months. It runs from Tishri 1 to Nisan 1; therefore, it is a Jewish Leap Year. In Eze. 38:20, "all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence (translated 'sight' in Eze. 36:31), and the mountains (two asteroid pieces, Rev. 8:8,10) shall be thrown down and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground."

***In Eze. 39:12,13, we see that "SEVEN MONTHS shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land. Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified (the Second Advent), saith the Lord GOD."

"...Perhaps the most misunderstood portion of Matthew 24:29-31 is the phrase, 'gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other..'Admittedly, I had trouble with this statement before I searched the Scriptures. It does sound like the Rapture, at first glance. But, if you're willing, come with me to several passages that together clarify the meaning of the phrase:

***I think it is the time of the second Rapture. I think Mt. 24:28-31 applies to the end of this age (sixth seal, Rev. 6:12f) and the very beginning of the Millennium. Verses 28 and 31 refer to the Second Rapture, when the Lord catches up the Tribulation saints. Verse 28 says, "For wheresoever the carcase (body, i.e., Body of Christ caught up in the first Rapture) is (in Heaven, Jn. 14:2,3), there will the eagles (high flying Tribulation saints) be gathered together." Verse 31 continues the thought: "And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet (the 'last trump' of I Cor. 15:51,52), and they shall gather together his elect (those caught up to Heaven in the Pre-Trib Rapture) from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other." The companion passage in Mark 13:27 says, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth (the Tribulation saints) to the uttermost part of heaven" (those already caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture).

***Mt. 24:27 is not really clear until we put Mk. 13:26 with it. Matthew says, "For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." Mark says, And then shall they see the Son of man coming IN THE CLOUDS with great power and glory." He does not touch ground in these passages. He is only seen in the clouds. He is coming in the clouds for the Tribulation saints, the Pre-Wrath Rapture, just as he comes in the clouds for us at the Pre-Trib Rapture.

***Those caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture are "caught up together with them IN THE CLOUDS, to meet the Lord in the AIR" (I Thess. 4:17). It is the same for those caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture. They meet the Lord in the air. Those taking place in the first Rapture are caught up before a 7-year period, the Tribulation. They are seen in Heaven in Rev. 5:9, before the first seal is broken. Those taking place in the second Rapture are caught up before a 7-month period, from the Day of God's Wrath to the Second Advent (Eze. 39:12). That group is seen in Heaven in Rev. 7:14, between the breaking of the sixth and seventh seals. They are before God's throne, so they are in Heaven.

***Lu. 21:25-28 is talking directly to the Tribulation saints. It says, "And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars (lit. constellations) (sixth seal, Rev. 12); and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring; Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. And then shall they (the Tribulation saints among others) SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN A CLOUD with power and great glory. And when these things (signs in the sun, moon and stars) begin to come to pass (sixth seal, Rev. 6:12), then look up, and lift up your heads; for your (the Tribulation saint's) redemption (Rapture II) draweth nigh."

"They come from a far country, from the end of heaven, even the Lord and His weapons of indignation, to destroy the whole land' (Isaiah 13:5).

***I think the FAR COUNTRY is in the heavens, and that when Scripture says "from the end of heaven," it means that. The weapons of indignation are the two asteroid pieces seen in Rev. 8:8,10.

"Although this passage is not referring to the second coming, it does serve to reveal idiomatic expressions, such as 'from the end of heaven,' and 'to the farthest part of heaven.' The context clearly shows us that the expression has to do with moving from one place on the physical earth to another place on the earth, i.e., 'from a far country,' 'the whole land.' And this is precisely what is suggested in Matthew 24:31. Jews are being transported from distant lands to Jerusalem: 'Up, up! flee from the land of the north,' says the Lord; 'for I have spread you abroad like the four winds of heaven,' says the Lord' (Zechariah 2:6). The New Testament corroborates the 'four winds' as referring to 'corners of the earth" (as opposed to clouds above the earth): 'After these things I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, on the sea, or on any tree' (Revelation 7:1).

"'It shall come to pass in that day that the Lord shall set His hand again the second time to recover the remnant of His people who are left, from Assyria and Egypt, from Pathros and Cush, from Elam and Shinar, from Hamath and the islands of the sea. He will set up a banner for the nations, and will assemble the outcasts of Israel and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.' - Isaiah 11:11,12

***I believe that when the Lord says "from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" (Mt. 24:31), he means heaven. When he says, earth, he means earth.

"Only willful resistance to the plain teaching of Scripture would deny that Jews are being gathered from far countries, to Jerusalem in Matthew 24:29-31. Notice carefully that Isaiah 11 refers to the second gathering, which has not yet fully occurred (less than half of world Jewry now resides in Israel). The first gathering occurred under the leadership of Zerrubabel, after the Babylonian captivity in 536 BC. The 'second' gathering is the subject of Matthew 24:31.

***The Jews are being gathered and will be gathered, but heaven does not mean earth.

"In summary, the subject matter and specific events described in Matthew 24:29-31 are as follows:

"- Jesus returns to the earth (as opposed to our going up to meet Him in the clouds - I Thessalonians 4:17)

***I think the Second Coming is still 7 months in the future on this day (Eze. 39:12).

"- The Great Trumpet sounds, calling for an assembly, in the land (Isaiah 27:12,13)

***I think the assembly is in Heaven. Heb. 12:22-24 talks about the assembly after the first Rapture. I think there will be one after the second Rapture. Heb. 12:22-24 says, "But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels. To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect. And to Jesus." Among other things, the assembly is for the receiving of rewards at the Judgment Seat of Christ (Rev. 11:18).

"- Angels transport His elect (Jewish people - Isaiah 45:4)

***Angels gather the Tribulation saints.

"- All Israel is gathered to Jerusalem (Joel 3:1,2, Romans 11:26)

***Jerusalem is not mentioned in Mt. 24:27-31. The saints in heaven are gathered "from one end of heaven to the other."

"- Israel is brought from the 'four winds,' which is an expression used to describe as in-gathering from far countries (Isaiah 13:5)

***Mk. 13:27 says they are gathered "from the uttermost part OF THE EARTH to the uttermost part OF HEAVEN." Therefore, "heaven" cannot mean earth.

"To attempt to place the Rapture of the Church in Matthew 24:29-31 is deception at worst and sloppy scholarship at best. May we, like the Bereans, be willing to examine all things under the light of Holy Scripture."

***The Pre-Trib Rapture is not there. The Second Advent is not there. This passage concerns the time of the Pre-Wrath Rapture for the Tribulation saints.

"ENDNOTE 3 Mark 13:27 is sometimes used in an effort to show that the Rapture is at the end of the Tribulation. Notwithstanding its idiomatic meaning, the saints are not raptured to the 'farthest part of heaven,' which is the third heaven (2 Corinthians 12:2). The third heaven is far beyond the sphere of our universe, light years away to the north (Isaiah 14:13; 66:1). This is an important point, because the Rapture removes us to the first heaven (Genesis 1:8, I Thessalonians 4:17), which is just nine miles above the surface of the earth - not to 'the farthest part of heaven.'"

***We rise to meet Jesus in the air, but we go on to Heaven. Jn. 14:3 says, "And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also." I Thess. 4:17 ends with "and so shall we ever be with the Lord." I think he is in Heaven. Our treasures are to be laid up in Heaven. Why, if we are to stay in the air? Paul was "caught up to the third heaven" (II Cor. 12:2), and I expect to be "caught up to the third heaven" also.

Incoming Email

I just read P&C 384... what a great post!

Regarding the destruction of Damascus, I am confused as to where this event occurs in the sequence of things. What is your opinion? Thanks!

My reply

Glad you enjoyed the post.

When "Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap" and "the kingdom from Damascus, and the remnant of Syria" (Isa. 17:1,3), It is "the day of grief and of desperate sorrow" (the Day of God's Wrath) (v. 11). It is the day the Sign of the Son of Man is seen in the sky (v. 7). "The nations shall rush like the rushing of many waters (the army under Gog attacks Israel, Eze. 38): but God shall REBUKE THEM, and they shall flee far off, and shall be chased as the chaff of the mountains before the wind, and like a rolling thing (the flying rolling thing, the asteroid, 'the curse that goeth forth (orbits) over the face of the whole earth,' Zech. 5:3) before the whirlwind. And behold at eveningtide trouble; and before the morning he is not. This is the portion of them that spoil us, and the lot of them that rob us" (Isa. 17:13,14).

Jer. 49:23,25 says, "Concerning Damascus. Hamath is confounded, and Arpad: for they have heard evil tidings: they are fainthearted; there is SORROW ON THE SEA; IT CANNOT BE QUIET....How is the city of praise not left." This is when the great mountain burning with fire of Rev. 8:8 impacts the Mediterranean Sea.

Amos 5:8 says, "Seek him that maketh the seven stars (Pleiades) and Orion, and turneth the shadow of death into the morning, and maketh the day dark with night: that CALLETH FOR THE WATERS OF THE SEA, AND POURETH THEM OUT UPON THE FACE OF THE EARTH: The LORD is his name."

Hab. 3:10-12 says, "The mountains saw thee, and they trembled: the OVERFLOWING OF THE WATER PASSED BY: THE DEEP UTTERED HIS VOICE, AND LIFTED UP HIS HANDS ON HIGH. The sun and moon stood still in their habitation."

Zeph. 1:7,15,16; 2:4,5 speaks of that day. It says, "Hold thy peace at the presence (paneh, face, sight, i.e., the Sign of the Son of Man) of the Lord GOD: for the DAY OF THE LORD is at hand...THAT DAY is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness, A day of the TRUMPET and alarm against the fenced cities, and against the high towers....For Gaza shall be forsaken, and Ashkelon a desolation: they shall drive out Ashdod at the noon day, and Ekron shall be rooted up. Woe unto the inhabitants of the sea coast."

Rev. 16:19 says, "And the great city was divided into three parts, and THE CITIES OF THE NATIONS FELL; and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath."

Eze. 38:19,20 says, "Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel: So that THE FISHES OF THE SEA, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and ALL THE MEN that are upon the face of the earth, SHALL SHAKE at my presence (sight), and the mountains shall be thrown down and the steep places shall fall, and EVERY WALL SHALL FALL."

Civilization as we know it will be destroyed.

Hope this helps.

Incoming Email

I found a good page on Bible prophecy.... here's an article about wormwood and the wife accused of harlotry drinking the bitter waters in the OT....I thought you would find it interesting...I'm sure you can tie this into your interpretation of wormwood and the destruction of Babylon, or the Mystery Babylon, the Mother of Harlots, representing the False Religious system of the world...being given bitter waters to drink as a result of thier spiritual harlotry....hope it helps: question.....MUST the 3rd Temple be built before Christ returns? Couldn't the Temple that the Antichrist sets himself up in, claiming to be a god, be the Temple of the Body? Someone is arguing this with me...i think there will be a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem...but this person tends to spiritualize everything...i would appreciate your help..thanks. In Christ

My reply

Thanks for the information.

I think the temple is literal. Rev. 11:1-3 says, "AND there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months (first half of the Tribulation). And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth."

These two witnesses (Moses and Elijah) begin their ministry as the Tribulation begins. The latter part of the Tribulation is shortened to 1040 days, and they prophesy 1260 days. After they are killed Mid-Trib and resurrected, an earthquake will kill 7000 in Jerusalem. The worldwide earthquake on the 2300th day of the Tribulation will kill so many that a child could write the number of the men left. The dead will lay around the world. Therefore, I think the temple will be there as the Tribulation begins. I don't see how it could reasonably be spiritualized, because the court is given unto the Gentiles and the holy city shall they tread under foot.

I think Daniel made it clear that there would be daily sacrificing in the first half of the Tribulation. Dan. 8:13,14 says, "How long shall be the vision concerning the DAILY SACRIFICE, and the transgression of desolation (by the False Prophet after the first 1260 days), to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed." It looks like this 2300 days is split into 1260 and 1040, the latter is because the Tribulation is shortened (Mt. 24:22).

My guess is that after the Final Status Framework Agreement is signed (Feb. 13, 2000, 7 months before the Final Status Agreement is signed Sept. 13, 2000), and before it is confirmed by the Beast (Pentecost, 2001), the temple could be built, maybe beside the Dome of the Rock, since the court is given unto the Gentiles. Some think that the actual site of the temple was beside the area where the Dome of the Rock is now.

In I Chron. 21:12f, we find the account of David buying the threshingfloor of Ornan after his sin of numbering the people. "And David lifted up his eyes, and saw the angel of the LORD stand BETWEEN THE EARTH AND HEAVEN, having a drawn SWORD in his hand stretched out over Jerusalem...say to David, that David should go up, and set up an altar unto the LORD in the threshingfloor of Ornan (meaning their ark) the Jebusite (Jerusalemite)...Now Ornan was THRESHING WHEAT...So David gave to Ornan for the place six hundred shekels of gold...And the LORD commanded the angel; and he put up his sword again into the sheath thereof."

The Sword of the Lord represents the asteroid that will impact Earth on the Day of God's Wrath (Isa. 34:4-8). His sword is "between the earth and heaven."

Earth - Mars - Asteroid Belt - Jupiter - Saturn.

The Asteroid Belt is dead center between Earth and Heaven. (Saturn is the third heaven of II Cor. 12:2: Mars, Jupiter, Saturn.)

This asteroid also is the "flaming sword which turned every way (lit., whirling itself about, i.e., rotating and orbiting), to keep (guard) the way of (to) the tree of life" (which is now in Heaven, Rev. 22:2) (Gen. 3:24).

When David BOUGHT the threshingfloor, it was the time of threshing wheat, i.e., around Pentecost. This makes me wonder if the Rapture on Pentecost, 2000, could be the event that would bring about the building of the temple as soon as the Final Status Agreement is signed. Right now, we are the temple of the Holy Spirit. I expect the earthly temple to be built soon after we are gone.

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Updated 9-12-99