Pro and Con 402

Uploaded 10-8-99

Note: Kaitlyn Hudson, the very sick 10-year old who needs our prayers, is in Amarillo, Texas.

Incoming Email

...much sifting from satan. It has been a very hard time for me. But then we are all suffering now...All my friends and family are calling to Jesus now "come swiftly my Beloved like a hart on the mountain of spices".... I read this this morning doesn't this scripture support your Pentecost June 10 Rapture 1? Isaiah 18: 3-7 isn't that an early summer season? I pray you are both well...I have been unable to read pro's and con's but I will soon catch up. I have missed you. Much Love

My reply

Welcome back. Oh, I am so sorry for all that you have been through. The Lord be with you and comfort you. We never know what testing each of us has to face, but the Lord will see us through it all.

Isa. 18:3-7 is interesting. I have it marked, and have wondered about it before. Let's explore the possibilities.

In Green's Interlinear, it says, 3 "All you dwellers of the world and dwellers of the earth, as one lifts a banner [sign] (on the) peaks, you will see [the Sign of the Son of Man, Mt. 24:30, after the sixth seal breaks, Rev. 6:14-16]; and you will hear as the blowing of a TRUMPET ['last trump,' Pre-Wrath Rapture, I Cor. 15:52].

4 "For so Jehovah said to me, I will take My rest [i.e., it's the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord], and I will watch in My dwelling place [Heaven]; as the glowing heat on light; as the dew-cloud in the HEAT OF HARVEST [Pre-Wrath Rapture, Rev. 14:14-16]."

Then, verse 5 drops back to a previous time, probably to the Pre-Trib Rapture. "For BEFORE THE HARVEST [i.e., at the Pre-Trib Rapture, the FIRST of the firstfruits, before the Pre-Wrath Rapture main harvest], when the bud is perfect, and the sour grape is ripening in the flower [The Pre-Trib Rapture in the spring, Song of Sol. 2:10-14], then he will cut off the sprigs [zalzal, shoots, from their shaking, fr. zalal, to shake, as in the wind, fig., to be loose morally, worthless, i.e., cut off the foolish Laodicean virgins] with pruning hooks, and cut down and take away the branches.

6 "They shall be left together to the birds of the hills, and to the beasts of the earth. And the birds shall SUMMER [summer follows the Pre-Trib Rapture] on them, and all the beasts of the earth shall WINTER on them.

7 "THEN [at the Second Advent, Nisan 1, in the SPRING] shall be brought to Jehovah of hosts [Christ, Isa. 44:6], the present of a people (the remnant of Israel] scattered and peeled, and from a nation terrible, from that (time) and onward; a nation [Israel] mighty and trampling under foot, whose land the rivers have divided, to the place of Jehovah of hosts' name--Mount Zion" (the earthly Jerusalem).

The rivers divide Israel after Christ sets his feet on the Mt. of Olives. It will split, half moving north, the other south. "and the LORD my God shall come and all the saints with thee....And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea [Mediterranean], and half of them toward the hinder sea [Dead Sea]" (Zech. 14:4-8, KJV).

Isa. 11:10,11 (KJV) says, "And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse [YHVH of hosts, Christ, Rom. 15:12], which shall stand for an ensign [sign] of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and HIS REST [the Millennium] shall be glorious. And it shall come to pass in that day, that the Lord shall set his hand AGAIN the SECOND TIME to recover the remnant of his people."

Mt. 24:33, in the Concordant Version, says, " know that SUMMER is near (i.e., the Pre-Trib Rapture is in the spring]. Thus you, also, whenever you may be perceiving all these things, know that He is near--at the doors."

Dr. Tabor pointed out Jeremiah 5:24 to me. He said, "There we have reference to our former and latter rains--and how they come in their proper TIME, but also we read: "and he keeps for us Shavuot, appointed for the harvest." Shavuot, Pentecost, is APPOINTED FOR THE HARVEST." I think that is appropriate. And THE LORD KEEPS IT for us. Praise the Lord. Maranatha. Agape

Incoming Email

I have thoroughly enjoyed your book,"Exit:2007", but I have questions. Throughout the book, you intimate that the rapture will take place on May 31, 1998.

Since that did not happen, how does that change the timelines that you included in your book? You spoke of ten years, but could three of those years be when He comes to check the fruit, finally reaping in the third year (2000)? If there are changes to be made in the timelines, please tell me what those are. I am compiling this information in case I am gone and my family or friends decide, all of a sudden, to be interested in prophecy. (By the way, I am completely convinced that, not only can we know the day and hour, but because of I Thess. 5, we are commanded to know the day and hour. If not, we are considered "in darkness"....In Christ's Love

My reply

Nothing has changed except the time I expect the Rapture. I am now hoping for Pentecost, 2000, although I think there is a chance on the upcoming Cheshvan 17 (Oct. 27, 1999), the date Noah went into the Ark. The year 1998 is so plainly marked in the Modern Parallels, I thought it probably was the Rapture year.

> You spoke of ten years, but could three of those years be when He comes to check
> the fruit, finally reaping in the third year (2000)?

Yes. The ten years fit from the Jewish 5758 to 5768. So many things seem to lock in Tishri 1, 5768 as the 2300th day of the Tribulation, the Day of God's Wrath, that I can't see how that can change. If the 2300th day is Tishri 1, 5768, the first day of that period is the Feast of Weeks in 5761 (May 28, 2001). That is the perfect time to start the Seventieth Week of Daniel, and it is the only time that span equals 2300 days before the 40-year probation since the Sign of the End of the Age in 1967 is up.

Israel was given 40 years after the Crucifixion before Jerusalem was destroyed. I think she has been given another 40 years after Jerusalem was all back in Israeli hands.

The Oslo Accords were signed Sept. 13, 1993. Adding 7 good and 7 bad years brings us to Sept. 13, 2007. The Accords were ratified in Israel 3 days later, on Tishri 1, 5754. Adding 14 years brings us to Tishri 1, 5768, which is Sept 13, 2007. Pretty good confirmation right there. On top of that, the Wye 2 Agreement set the date for the signing of the Final Status Agreement as Sept. 13, 2000 (Elul 13, 5760). I expect to be outta here before that, even though I expect the covenant to be confirmed by the Beast and False Prophet on the following Feast of Weeks....

Incoming Email

Re: Rapture and reasons or scriptures and/or definitions to back it up
I was reading through some more of your writings and others. In one article you mention rapture and resurrection in the same sentence as I recall. Do you define a difference between the two? Sincerely

My reply

There are two Raptures, one Pre-Trib, the other Pre-Wrath. Both include both the living and the dead, so resurrection of the dead saints happens at the same time as each Rapture.

There are ranks in the first resurrection. I Cor. 15:22,23 shows this. Under the Greek words in Green's Interlinear, we find this: "in the Christ all shall be made alive. But each in his own RANK: [the] first-fruit Christ, then those of Christ at his coming" (emphasis mine). The KJV is not as clear, because they translated "tagmati" as "order" ("But every man in his own order"). If you look the Greek word up in Strong's Concordance, it is 5001: something orderly in arrangement (a troop), i.e. (fig.) a series or succession.

It is like soldiers marching along, but one platoon is separated from the next one by an extra space between the two.

At the first trump, the Pre-Trib Rapture, the "dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air" (I Thess. 4:16,17).

At the last trump, the Pre-Wrath Rapture, "the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality" (I Cor. 15:52,53).

There are two "days of the Son of man" (Lu. 17:22). The first is the Pre-Trib Rapture. It is as the days of Noah. No fire falls that day. "Then shall two be in the field (world); the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt. 24:40). The type is Enoch. Gen. 5:24 says, "And Enoch walked with God; and he was not; for God took him." We need to walk with God too.

The Pre-Wrath Rapture is as the days of Lot. "But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom, it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed...Two men shall be in the field, the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Lu. 17:29-36). These will literally be snatched out of the fiery furnace. They are taken up between the breaking of the sixth and seventh seals. Meteorites are already falling. The type is Elijah. He was taken up in a chariot of fire, but not burned.

At the first Rapture, the open door is set before the Philadelphians (Rev. 3:8). James told us that Christ stands before the door. In Jas. 5:7-9, he said, "Be PATIENT therefore, brethren (believers), unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath LONG PATIENCE for it, until he receive the early (the former rain starts Tishri 1) and latter rain (the latter rain starts Nisan 1). Be ye also PATIENT; stablish your hearts: for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh. Grudge not one against another, brethren (believers, lest ye be condemned: behold, the judge (Christ) standeth BEFORE the DOOR."

Here we also can see that the rainy season (Tishri through Nisan) will pass before the Pre-Trib Rapture. This agrees with Song of Solomon 2:10-14, which also places it in the spring around the time of Pentecost.

In II Tim. 4:1, we see TWO TIMES that Christ will judge. Paul said, "I CHARGE thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick (living) and the dead (resurrected ones) at his appearing (the Pre-Trib Rapture) AND his kingdom" (the Pre-Wrath Rapture and the Judgment Seat of Christ on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord). In verse 8, Paul said, "Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day (at the Pre-Trib Rapture, Rev. 3:11): and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing."

Bonnie Gaunt said, "I do not believe in the Partial Rapture theory, because Jesus does not marry a 'partial bride' and there are not two weddings."

There are two Raptures, but only one Marriage of the Lamb. I think it is on the same day as the second Rapture, on the first day of the Millennium. Of that Feast of Trumpets, Joel 2:15,16 says, "Blow the trumpet in Zion, sanctify a fast (the Day of Atonement is only 10 days away), call a solemn assembly: Gather the people (those of first Rapture gathered from one end of heaven to the other), sanctify the congregation, assemble the elders, gather the children (the Pre-Wrath Rapture), and those that suck the breasts: let the bridegroom (Christ) go forth of his chamber, and the bride out of her closet (chupah)." Then the Marriage of the Lamb takes place.

Mark 13:27 explains the assembling of his saints, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth (the Pre-Wrath Rapture) to the uttermost part of heaven" (including those already taken there in the Pre-Trib Rapture).

At the Pre-Trib Rapture, "The lord of that servant (the unwise one) will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder (lit., cut him off), and will appoint him his portion (the shortened Tribulation) with the unbelievers." Mt. 24:51 adds, "And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites (pretenders): there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

After the door is shut, the foolish virgins will say, "Lord, Lord, open to us," but he will answer, "I know you not." They were too distant and did not draw close to him, so he was like our neighbor far down the street that we do not even speak to because we do not know him.

In the Preview of the Rapture in Rev. 1, Jesus is seen, and "out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword" (1:16). He introduces himself to the church in Pergamos as "he which hath the sharp sword with two edges" (2:12). This church is told, "Repent; OR ELSE I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them (the Nicolaitanes) with the sword of my mouth." Some will be cut off and will have their portion with the unbelievers during the shortened Tribulation.

The Lord will be judging who will be taken up and who will be cut off and left behind until the second Rapture. The wise virgins are ready. They know and love the Lord personally, and he is well acquainted with them. He is part of their lives. They are filled with the Spirit of Christ and walk with him every day. They will be taken up when he comes as the Bridegroom. They are chosen as the Bride.

In Rev.5:9, we see in Heaven those caught up in the first Rapture. They are "out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation." They are there before the Tribulation begins as the first seal is broken in Rev. 6.

In Rev. 7:9,14, we see in Heaven those caught up in the second Rapture. They are the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues. "These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." They did not go in the first rank because of their soiled robes, but they wise up and get right with God before the second Rapture. These are caught up between the breaking of the sixth (Rev. 6:12) and seventh seals (Rev. 8).

The first rank sing "a new song" (Rev. 5:9). The second group also sing. Rev. 15:2,3 says, "And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God. And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb." There clearly are two groups caught up at two different times.

Micah was playing the role of the Tribulation saint when he wrote Micah 7:1-4. He said, "WOE is me! for I am as (symbolic language) when they gave gathered the summer fruits, as the grapegleanings of the vintage: there is no cluster to eat: my soul desired the firstripe fruit (the firstripe grapes come on at Pentecost). The good man is perished (abad, escaped, i.e., raptured before the Tribulation) OUT OF THE EARTH: and there is none upright among men."

Incoming Email

I love your site and share a keen interest in this topic. Yet, I disagree slightly with your interpetation. I to take the taking of Jerusalem as the starting of the generation clock. However, I calculate 40 Biblical years of 360 days to arrive at 10 Nov 2006 as the possible date for the Lord's return. This puts the beginning of tribulation 7 biblical years earlier on 17 December 1999. Do you have any thoughs on this?

Although I have gone through these calculations, I truly feel it's in the Lord's timing and the most important thing for me is to win as many souls to Jesus as possible. I would be blessed to hear your opinions. Your Brother in Christ

My reply

I think the 40 years of probation from 30 AD to 70 AD were normal years, and I think the 40 years of probation from 1967 to 2007 are normal years. After 19 years, the Jewish 19-year cycle matches up very closely with our solar years. Of their six year types, not one of them is a 360-day year. They are 353, 354, 355, 383, 384, or 385-day years.

If you are really thinking that the Second Coming could be Nov. 10, 2006, I can show you why I don't think so. Christ comes as the former and latter rain (Hos. 6:3). He came the first time on Tishri 1 as the former rain and will return as the latter rain on Nisan 1, in the spring. Eze. 29:17,21 sets the day. It says, "in the first month (Nisan, month of the Passover, Eze. 45:18,21), in the first day of the month...In that day (Nisan 1, first day of the Jewish Regnal and Sacred Year) will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (Logos, Word) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD." The Lord will officially take office on Earth on the same day all the other Israelite kings officially took office, Nisan 1.

There are seven months between the Day of God's Wrath and the Second Advent (Eze. 39:12). Even if Nov. 10, 2006 was the end of the shortened Tribulation, the Day of God's Wrath, it won't fit. The 2300 days of Dan. 8:14 end on the Feast of Trumpets (see Mal. 2:3; Hos. 9:5-7 and Joel 2:1-3 below). The only time left that the 2300 days will fit between the Feast of Weeks that begins the Seventieth Week of Daniel and the Feast of Trumpets that is the Day of God's Wrath (using Jewish inclusive reckoning) is between Sivan 6, 5761 and Tishri 1, 5768.

Let's look at those scriptures that show that the Day of God's Wrath is the Feast of Trumpets: Mal. 2:3 says, "your solemn feasts; and one shall take you away with it." Hos. 9:5-7 says, "What will ye do in the solemn day, and in the day of the feast of the LORD? For, lo, they are gone because of destruction...The days of visitation are come, the days of recompence are come; Israel shall know it: the prophet (False Prophet) is a fool (Satan possessed), the spiritual man (Tribulation Pope, The Beast) is mad." Joel 2:1-3 says, "BLOW ye the TRUMPET in Zion, and sound an alarm in my holy mountain: let all the inhabitants of the land tremble: for the day of the LORD (first day of the Millennium) cometh, for it is nigh at hand; A day of darkness...of thick darkness."

> beginning of tribulation 7 biblical years earlier on 17 December 1999. Do you have any
> thoughs on this? 

I think the beginning of the Seventieth Week of Daniel will begin on the Feast of Weeks in 2001. The Final Status Peace Agreement is to be signed Sept. 13, 2000. I think it will be confirmed by the Tribulation Pope and the False Prophet on the following Feast of Weeks, May 28, 2001. From that day to the Feast of Trumpets at the end of the shortened Tribulation is 2300 days. The Feast of Trumpets is also Sept. 13, 2007.

The Oslo Accords were signed Sept. 13, 1993 and ratified three days later in Israel, on Tishri 1. If you add 7 good years and 7 bad years to Sept. 13, 1993, you get Sept. 13, 2007. If you add 7 good years and 7 bad years to Tishri 1, 5754, you get Tishri 1, 5768, which is Sept. 13, 2007. That is too good to be by accident.

Incoming Email

> I think the conception was on Hanukkah (Festival of Lights) somewhere
> close to December 24th 2 B.C. and the birth was 280 days later on The Feast
> of Tabernacles the second (Festival of Lights) September 29th 1 B.C.

***From Marilyn: Here is what I think. Jesus was born as the former rain (Hos. 6:3) on Tishri 1, in BC 5, the wise men visited him in 3 BC, and Herod died not long after the lunar eclipse of Jan. 10, BC 1. He began his ministry after his baptism when he was about 30 in 26 AD. That was the 15th year of Tiberius, who began to Co-Rex with Augustus in 12 AD and was over Palestine from that time. At the Passover, in 27 AD, the temple was 46 years in building. It was begun in BC 20/19. The Crucifixion was in 30 AD. The 483 years of Dan. 9:25,26 began in the first year of Cyrus in BC 454. Martin Anstey found an 82-year mistake in Ptolemy's list of the Persion Kings (536 - 82 = 454). Also, 483 years - 454 + 1 because there was no zero year = 30 AD.

> The wise men ( 7 Levite Priests) had observed five conjunctions of Venus and Jupiter
> in 3 B.C. and 2 B.C. from Shushan Persia but the actual star they saw on the night of
> the birth and the star that re-appeared again two years later and actually moved thru
> the sky and led them to Jesus' house was the Shekinah. If you look at the over-all
> theme of the Seven Feasts. The first four have already been completed. I think the
> Messiah will return on Rosh Hashanah for the rapture

***I think the Rapture is more likely on Pentecost. Micah was playing the role of the Tribulation saint when he wrote Micah 7:1-4. I think that what he said indicates the spring for the first Rapture. He said, "WOE is me! for I am as (symbolic language) when they gave gathered the summer fruits, as the grapegleanings of the vintage (i.e., it is near Tishri 1, date of the second Rapture): there is no cluster to eat: my soul desired the firstripe fruit (the firstripe grapes come on around Pentecost). The good man is perished (abad, escaped, i.e., raptured before the Tribulation) OUT OF THE EARTH: and there is none upright among men."

***Also, the Israelites sent 12 spies to spy out the Promised Land at "the time of the firstripe grapes" (Num 13:20). They represent the 12 elders who are the patriarchs of Israel seen in Heaven after the Rapture (Rev. 4:4), because "all those men were heads of the children of Israel" (Nu. 13:3). The time of the firstripe grapes is around Pentecost, when I hope we will go to our Promised Land, Heaven.

I think Song of Sol. 2:10-14 also indicates spring for the Rapture of the Bride of Christ. It is the time of green figs and the firstripe grapes. It is after the winter and the rains are past. The rainy season starts with the former rain on Tishri 1 and ends with the month of the latter rain, Nisan. Pentecost is the only feast that is not in a rainy month. The dry months are Iyar, Sivan, Tamuz, Av, and Elul. Pentecost is in Sivan.

> then will return again seven years later on the Day of Atonement
> to stop the battle of Armageddon.

***I think Christ will return as the latter rain (Hos. 6:3) on the first day of the Jewish Regnal Year, Nisan 1 (Eze. 29:17,21). Then, after the full 2520 days of the Seventieth Week of Daniel have run their course, the Judgment of the Nations will take place. Dominion will be taken from Satan. He will fight. That is Armageddon. It is Satan and his army against Christ and his army. It can't take place until Christ is already on Earth.

***The battle that Christ will stop in its tracks before Armageddon arrives is the attack on Israel by the united nations' army under the leadership of Gog (Eze. 38). It will not be by returning at the time for that Day of God's Wrath is 7 months before his return (Eze. 39:12), but by causing a binary asteroid to impact Earth (Rev. 8:8,10). One piece, like a great mountain burning with fire will impact the Mediterranean Sea (Zeph. 2:4,5). The other piece will destroy Babylon....

Incoming Email

The ancient Jewish commentary known as the Chesed L'Avraham states 5760 is the year of the Resurrection of the Dead and the event will occur at the end of the year. So when the 29th of September 2000 rolls around listen for the shofar (the last trump) to wax louder and louder. Maranatha

My reply

I hope he is right about the year, but I also hope we are gone before the Eve of Trumpets.

Incoming Email

If you have a moment, I would like to hear your view on what happens to a believer as soon as he/she dies. Also, along the same lines, could you explain 1 Thessalonians 4:16 "the dead in Christ shall rise first". Thank you so much for your ministry.

My reply

II Cor. 5:8 says, "absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord." We go to heaven at death if we have accepted Christ as our Saviour.

At the Rapture, Christ will bring those called asleep in Jesus or dead in Christ with him. They are alive and conscious, not really asleep or dead. Only their earthly body died. They will get their resurrection bodies first, then we will rise to meet Christ and those with him in the air.

Incoming Email

> Marilyn I don't know where you came up with the idea that saturn is heaven.

***I was writing my third book, and an unexpected book grew out of chapter four. At first, it was a 4-page report, then 6, then 30. When it got to be 150 pages, I knew it was going to be a book in its own right.

> You are trying to sell a false bill of goods.

I don't mind if you don't believe it. The thought had crossed my mind before when I read Ezek. 1:27,28 and Rev. 4:3, but I said to myself, "Nah, that can't be." So I understand if it is hard for you to accept. That is entirely ok. You don't have to know where it is to get there.

> Although have studied long and hard since the sixties, you haven't understood what you
> have been studying. Don't you even know that there is two kinds of heavens? there is
> the spiritual heaven where gods throne is. God is spirit and so is his heaven.

***Are you really sure that you want to imply that Christ's throne is not in a real place? He said in John 14:2,3 that he was going to prepare a place for us, "And if I go and prepare a PLACE for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also." To me, that is a real place. As for God being spirit. He is, and the whole Universe can't contain him. That does not keep there from being a literal Heaven that we are to be taken to.

***When we get to Heaven, we will still see God in the face of Jesus Christ. Rev. 22:3,4 says, "the throne (one throne) of God AND of the Lamb shall be in it; and his (singular) servants shall serve him (singular): And they shall see his face (one face); and his name (one name) shall be in their foreheads."

> there is also natural heavens of the creation. lets start at the first Gen i;i In the
> beginning ( of the creation ) god created the heavens ( moon, stars, planets, saturn
> included) and the earth. Now answer me this where was god living before he created saturn?

***God is everywhere--omnipresent. "for in him we live, and move, and have our being" (Acts 17:28).

> In spiritual heaven where he still lives. You take verses out of context to try to
> prove your theory. example, you say saturn is HEAVEN and if you took a plumbline and
> measured saturn it would measure the same width,length and hight, this is true but
> where does the bible say to measure heaven with a plumbline?

***I don't know where I said with a plumbline, but what difference does it make what is used to take a measurement? Nothing like a measuring tape would be adequate for the job. That can only be symbolic. However, "The length, and the breadth and the height of it are equal" (Rev. 21:16). It is a sphere.

> Rev 21;15 says, and he that talked with me had a golden reed (not a plumbline) to measure
> the city and the gates there of and the wall there of (he wasn't measuring heaven,) he
> was measuring the city (new jerusalem)

***We are promised a home in Heaven. As the Rapture takes place, the "door was opened in heaven" a voice like a trumpet says, "Come up hither" (Rev. 4:1) and we are caught up to to New Jerusalem (Rev. 3:12). Christ rides forth from Heaven, and we follow him.

> you took this verse not only out of context but you totally destroyed it.
> Another point you keep making is saturn is the third heaven. don't you
> understand anything. if you ever see a model of our solar system you
> would see that all the planets rotate around the sun, making earth the
> third (natural heaven of the creation) saturn is the sixth (natural heaven of the creation).

***In the Tabernacle were "the patterns of things in the heavens" (Heb. 9:23). Josephus was a priest, a Pharisee. He wrote of the "candlestick" in the Temple. He said, it "spread itself into as many branches as there are planets, including the sun among them. It terminated in seven heads, IN ONE ROW, all standing parallel to one another; and these branches carried seven lamps, one by one, in imitation of the number of the planets." (Ant. III. VII. 7).

***The solar system was depicted as all lined up "IN ONE ROW," and maybe it was, in the beginning. The Western light was to always be kept lit, so it probably depicted the Sun. Thus the lineup must have been Sun, Mercury, Venus, EARTH, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn. The semi-circular branches suggested the circular orbits. Looking east from Earth, Saturn is the third heaven.

> Now this talk about ice crystals. Are you
> trying to say that the rings of saturn are the same as what john saw before the throne?

***John said, "and there was a rainbow round about the throne" (Rev. 4:3). Ezekiel saw the Lord's throne. He said, "As the appearance of the bow that is in the cloud in the day of rain, so was the appearance of the brightness round about" (Eze. 1:28). A rainbow appears when the sunlight shines on ice crystals in the atmosphere. The ring system of Saturn is "the brightness round about," and it is made up of ice crystals.

> Rev,4;6 and before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal. this sea of
> glass is not ice crystals in the rings of saturn, the sea of glass is looking into the
> creation. the bible says earth is gods foot stool.

***Saturn is a lot bigger than the footstool. It fits pretty well.

> In conclution marilyn i have to say i think you had a theory about saturn and you
> have studied long and hard trying to prove it, changeing bible verses around in the
> process of trying to prove it.

***Well, God knows when I found it out. I did not set out to prove anything about the location of Heaven. Finding out was a big surprise to me. It came suddenly. The whole book was written in just a few months, in spite of the fact that I stopped and read 15 or more versions of the Bible all the way through before I finished the book. I wanted to make sure. Eze. 1:26 says that "the likeness of a throne" was "as the appearance of a sapphire stone." I looked up sapphire in Webster's Collegiate Dictionary. It said it was from the Sanskrit sani, Saturn, and priya, dear. Wow.

> I am not sure you are qualified to be writing books
> about the bible or trying to teach others when you don't understand what you are reading.

***I saw a rectangle of light on Jer. 50:2. It said to publish and conceal not. I am doing exactly what I think the Lord wants me to do.

***Please be careful. The Lord said, "Judge not, and ye shall not be judged" (Lu. 6:37). He also said, "This is my commandment, that ye love one another" (Jn. 15:12). The Rapture is approaching. We want to be as pure virgins fulled with the oil of the Holy Spirit. Nothing is as important as being ready. If we are right about Christ, we can be wrong on something else and still make it to Heaven.

***The Bible is deep. Not everything is easy to understand. No man or woman knows it all. The "word of the LORD was unto them precept upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little; that they might go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken" (Isa. 28:13). Agape

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Updated 10-8-99