Pro and Con 506

Posted 5-13-00

Incoming email

> I think the little horn, the False Prophet, will be a Jew, probably from the tribe of Dan.

Is there a particular scripture reference that supports your view? God Bless You

My reply

Jn. 5:43 says, "I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive." The Jews are expecting their Messiah to be Jewish. I don't see how they could ever accept a Gentile Messiah, do you?

Zech. 11:15-17 says, "And the LORD said unto me, Take unto thee yet the instruments of a foolish shepherd (the False Prophet). For, lo, I will raise up a shepherd IN THE LAND (of Israel), which shall not visit those that be cut off, neither shall seek the young one, nor heal that that is broken, nor feed that that standeth still: but he shall eat the flesh of the fat, and tear their claws in pieces. Woe to the idol shepherd that leaveth the flock! (he moves to Babylon) the sword shall be upon his arm, and upon his right eye: his arm shall be clean dried up, and his right eye shall be utterly darkened."

Dan. 11:37 says, "Neither shall he regard the God of HIS FATHERS, nor the desire of women (Christ), nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all."

The False Prophet will be Satan possessed. Gen. 49:17 says, "Dan (i.e., his descendant) shall be a SERPENT by the way, an adder in the path, that biteth the horse heels, so that his rider (probably the Beast of Rev. 6:2) shall fall backward." Dan is not mentioned among the 144,000 in Rev. 7, either.

Incoming email

Re: 38 years in Deut 2:14 -> 1998

I was thinking about how a large portion of your position regarding the timing of the rapture hinges on a 40 year generation counting from 1967. Somehow the verse in Deut 2:14 about the children of Israel came to mind. That particular verse spells out 38 years in the travels from Kadesh Barnea to the brook Zered. Why did the Holy Spirit record that small detail?

If indeed the rapture will take place this year then perhaps 1998 is again marked as a significant year:

1967 + 40 years generation - 7 years tribulation = 2000 1967 + 38 years (Deut 2:14) - 7 years tribulation = 1998

Maranatha!

My reply

Thanks for pointing this out. The year 1998 was definitely marked. It was the 480th year in the Modern Parallels. God singled out six blocks of years in the 400s, totaled them up and listed them in Scripture. When you add them to 1517 (when the Ottoman Turks took Jerusalem and Martin Luther started the Protestant Reformation when he tacked his 95 theses to the church door in Wittenberg, Germany on Oct. 31) the results are startling.

5278 (1517) + 400 (Acts 7:7) = 5678 (1917/1918) - Modern Exodus to the Promised Land began
5278 (1517) + 430 (Ex 12:41) = 5708 (1947/1948) - Israel declared her Independence
5278 (1517) + 450 Acts 13:20 = 5728 (1967/1968) - Israel grew leaves in the Six-Day War
5278 (1517) + 480 (I Ki 6:1) = 5758 (1997/1998) - Yr 6000, living stones given "SPACE TO REPENT," 4 years of the parable of the barren fig tree probably began, they may indicate Pentecost, 1998, 1999, 2000 and 2001, Christ comes and speaks only in 3rd year, I think the Tribulation starts on the Feast of Weeks/Pentecost in 2001
5278 (1517) + 483 (Dan 9:26) = 5761 (2000/2001) - Beginning of Tribulation
5278 (1517) + 490 (Dan 9:24) = 5768 (2007/2008) - Day of Wrath, then 7 mo later - Second Advent

Aside from the Israelites wandering in the wilderness 40 years while one generation died, we know that "THIS GENERATION" in Mt. 24:32-34 indicates 40 years. In 30 AD, Jesus told the Pharisees, "Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon THIS GENERATION" (Mt. 23:36). They did, 40 years later, in 70 AD. Agape

Incoming email

Re: Great Sign of Rev. 12:1
I have read somewhere that this sign occurred last year and will reoccur this year. After this year it shall not occur again for a very long time. If this information is correct, it could be interpreted to mean that the events in Rev. that precede the Great Sign will take place between now and the next time it appears. When this year will the Great Sign reappear? This Great Sign would seem to be yet another indication that the rapture is very near.

My reply

There is some information about this on Pro and Con 411. You can visit Bob Wadsworth's site too, at: http://www.atlbible.org/astronomy/astronomy.htm. His email address is: starguy@e-z.net.

Bob says that this sign occurs about every 2 to 3 years, but can occur 2 years in a row, as it did on Oct. 21, 1998 and Oct. 11, 1999 (which is in the Jewish 5760). This year was not mentioned for another of these signs. We are in the year 5760 until Sept. 30, 2000. Agape

My outgoing email

Re: Cherubim
Sorry to be so long answering. Your email is on the Mac and too long for me to want to type it all on the PC. You searched the places where angels were mentioned in Scripture. I take it that you meant without finding any references to them having wings. This left you wondering if cherubim and seraphim were really angels as many teach. Then you read my conclusion that the cherubim represent planets and asked, "How do square that with the description of the representation of the cherubim on the Ark of the Covenant. They had wings and they faced each other."

1Sam. 4:4 says, "So the people sent to Shiloh, that they might bring from thence the ark of the covenant of the LORD of hosts, which DWELLETH BETWEEN THE CHERUBIMS." I think the cherubim on the ark are symbolic representations that tell us that Christ, who is the "redeemer the LORD (YHVH) of hosts" (Isa. 44:6), actually dwells on Saturn between two planets, between Jupiter and Uranus.

That squares with Paul's being "caught up to the third heaven" in II Cor. 12:2. These heavens would be Mars, Jupiter and Saturn.

Ezekiel saw vision of the heavens in chapters 1 and 10. First, he saw the Sun in the center. It was a fire infolding itself, with "nogahh," sunlight about it. Around that central hub orbited the 4 terrestrial planets, Mercury, Venus, Earth, and Mars. Their concentric orbits looked like wheels within wheels. Eze. 1:15 is a good clue. It says, "one wheel upon the earth." If one of these cherubim is the Earth, then they do not really have four faces, four wings, etc. Those are to make it possible for believers to figure out what they are without the unsaved having a clue as to what they mean. Those particular four faces were on the banners placed at the compass points when Israel camped in concentric circles around the Tabernacle, where the Holy of Holies represented Heaven. They stand for North, South, East and West. The planets orbit smoothly in all directions. Of the wings, two portrayed flight, and two "covered their bodies." Verse 8 says, "they had the hands (extremities) of a man (adam, red clay) on their four sides." This shows that they are the terrestrial planets, with red clay soil on them.

Over their heads, farther out in space, "was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man (Christ) above upon it" (Eze. 1:26). Sapphire means dear to the planet Saturn, from the Sanskrit Sani, Saturn, and priya, dear. I think Christ's throne is on Saturn, between the cherubim Jupiter and Uranus.

It has "brightness round about" (Eze. 1:28). This is Saturn's ring system. Zech. 3:9,10 in the Septuagint says, "I bring forth my servant The Branch. For as for the stone which I have set before the face of Jesus, on the one stone are seven eyes (orbs, rings)." Saturn has 7 rings. They, like our rainbows, are made up of ice crystals reflecting the sunlight. Gen. 9:13 says, "I do set MY BOW in the cloud, and it shall be for a token of a covenant between me and the earth."

The number 7 that marks Christ's throne has another meaning besides the rings. It is the 7th lamp in the candlestick. The ancients called all heavenly bodies that moved along the ecliptic planets, including the Sun. According to Josephus, the candlestick lamps stood for (1) the Sun, (2) Mercury, (3) Venus, (4) Earth, (5) Mars, (6) Jupiter and (7) Saturn.

You also discussed the location of Eden and quoted Gen. 2:10: "And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads." It sound to me like the meaning of heads is different from the way we use headwaters to mean the source of a river. Think about it. First, a river went out of Eden. The source was already there by that time. Then it parted into four streams later. You said "the Hebrew word for heads is roshe which can be translated head, top, summit, upper part, chief, total, sum, height, front, beginning." #7218 in Strongs Concordance can also be translated end. I think that gives us a better understanding of these 4 rivers that split off of one river.

I still think Eden is Eridu, 12 miles south of Ur. The Weld Prism says that the first two kings of history reigned at Eridu. Ancient Babylonian inscriptions read, "Near Eridu was a garden, in which was a mysterious Sacred Tree, A Tree of Life, planted by the gods, whose roots were deep, while its branches reached to heaven, protected by guardian spirits, and no man enters" (p. 27, Halley's Bible Handbook). It also says that the oldest known historical document was found 15 miles from Eridu. This is the 1964 edition, so others could have been found since. However, the Weld Prism was found at Larsa, just 40 miles from Eridu.

There is another reason I stick with that area. Adam was driven out. Man has reason to not live in that area of the world. Yet, man will build a great city at Babylon, 150 miles from Eridu. It will be destroyed. It will prove that man would have done better to heed what God told Adam and stay out of that area. Agape

Incoming email

...I wrote you awhile back...It was in regards to why the rapture cannot happen at Pentecost...My motherinlaw, being a hebrew scholar, and teaching the original language of the bible had some interesting comments in regards to your thoughts on Pentecost... Read it when you can, and respond when you have time....thanks... here it is...

I read some of the stuff on the catching away being at Pentecost, or in June. In the comings of Jesus, he was to fulfill the meanings of each feast. When that was done, he does not have to come back and refulfill them. I think that is what they are doing to him in their discussions. When

you finish a task, you go on to the next one. So Jesus came and he fulfilled Passover, Unleavened Bread, Firstfruits, and Pentecost. That is not the end. There is Rosh haShanah, Yom Kippur and Sukkot. Why go back to the others unless you do not understand the next three. In their discussion

of counting of the Omer to Pentecost, one statement was made that the dates of Unleavened Bread and Firstfruits were set. Leviticus 23 only speaks of the date of Passover and Unleavened Bread. The only time element for Firstfruits is the statement that it shall be the day after the Sabbath, which is our Sunday. It makes no difference what day of the week the date for Passover and Unleavened Bread falls on, the feast of Firstfruits will always be on the day after the weekly Sabbath, not the festival Sabbath. Why do I say that? Verse 15, last phrase, seven sabbaths shall be complete.

So that is seven weeks of seven days equals 49 days, and the 50th day always falls on the day after the weekly Sabbath. So Firstfruits and Shavuot, or Pentecost is always on the first day of the week, the morrow after the Sabbath (weekly) or our Sunday.

Part 2
1 Cor. 15:51 Behold, I (Paul) show you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: (not the 7th trump of Revelation, but of Rosh haShanah) for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible (incapable of dying) and we shall be changed. Rosh HaShanah is known as the 'day no man knoweth' because of the feast of the New Moon, Rosh Chodesh, which is a picture of our new birth in Christ, the moon increasing in size to full, picturing our growth in Christ as we learn

by facing Him as the moon turns to face the sun from which it gets its light, and we as born again ones get our light from Christ, and the waning of the moon pictues the catching away unto Christ. Where in Scripture does it give indication that the church could end at Pentecost? Just because we are born on a certain date does not indicate our life will end on that date. Stephen in his defence before the council speaks of the children of Israel being 'the church in the wilderness. The 'church' is

a group of 'called out ones' with a purpose. They have a responsibility. The 'church' was also a secular idea. When Paul was in Ephesus and they had

a city wide uproar over Diana, Acts 19:32 . . the assembly was confused; the city had rushed into the theater in confusion. That word 'assembly' is the same translated 'church.' They were called out citizens of Ephesus who helped determine courses of action. So church is a group of 'called out ones' for the spreading and teaching of the gospel. The New Testament church will end with the rapture which is pictured in the

elements of Rosh haShanah, for that festival represents the blowing of 100 trumpets on that festival, the last one being called 'the last trump.' It represents the resurrection of the righteous dead of all ages up until the the beginning of the Birthpains of the Messiah, the tribulation period, when Israel is in tribulation and they will be brought or born into faith of Jesus as Messiah as a nation. It represents the catching up of living righteous ones at the time of the rature, Natzal in Hebrew, for the purpose of going to the Coronation of Jesus, the Messiah, as pictured in Revelation 4 and 5, and pictured in the coronation of Solomon and Joash in the Old Testament, and the wedding of the Messiah and his bride, and Paul says we will all stand before the judgment seat of Christ to receive for the deeds done in our body, to place us in our position of rulership during the millenium. This all happening on Rosh haShanah, Tishrei 1, of the Jewish Civil Calendar. The 70ths week does start shortly after that on Yom Kippur, Tishrei 10, because Joel 2:15 tells us what day the 70th week quits on, which is Yom Kippur. The fast of Joel 2:15 is Yom Kippur, because it is the only one of the seven main festivals given by God

that you could fast on. The Bridegroom, Jesus, is coming out of his chamber, hadar-which means wedding chamber, and his bride is coming out of her closet, or chuppah-wedding canopy they were married under. Verse 17, let the priests, the ministers of the Lord, weep between the porch and the altar . . the only feast they do that on is the feast of Yom Kippur, Day of

Atonement. They cry out to be spared, because if Jesus and his bride do not come and save them, they are to be wiped out. Then Jesus says, I come quickly, or suddenly. Seven years have passed. They go into the chamber, wedding chamber-hadar, in Isaiah 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, hadar-wedding chamber, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation (tribulation) be overpast. Chapter 27, leviathan is a picture of the False Messiah. Incidentally, a messianic rabbi, or scholar, says in the EDL codes, the hebrew word'natzal' for rapture is found in 26:20 five times. I personally was able to recognize it in a pattern of 8 letters apart. I saw possiblities of other patterns but could not figure out the pattern number, but I did see it in the pattern of every 8 letters. Very interesting. Also the chapter 26 starts out with verse using words that picture Rosh HaShanah besides talking about the birthpains of a woman, the Hebrew terminology being Chevlai, or Chevlo Shel Mashiach. In Christ

My reply

> > he does not have to come back and refulfill them.

Of course, he doesn't HAVE TO, but will he? We have to look at it with open eyes and not let the fact that there are two Raptures blind our eyes to when the first one might take place. The second Rapture is the one that takes place on the Feast of Trumpets. When does the first Rapture take place, making a double fulfillment of Pentecost or making a double fulfillment of the Feast of Trumpets? There are many things that will happen on the Feast of Trumpets that begins the millennial Day of the Lord.

Lev. 23:17 says, "ye shall bring out of your habitations TWO WAVE LOAVES of two tenth deals (2/10th = 1/5th, and Joseph took up 1/5th of the grain in the 7 good years in Egypt)...they are the FIRSTFRUITS unto the LORD." What does Lev. 23:22 mean? It says, "And when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt NOT MAKE CLEAN RIDDANCE of the corners of thy field when thou reapest, neither shalt thou gather any gleaning of thy harvest." That sounds to me like the foolish Laodicean virgins getting left behind at the Pre-Trib Rapture. They will be caught up later in the Pre-Wrath Rapture.

What does Jas. 1:18 indicate? It says, "Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be A KIND OF FIRSTFRUITS of his creatures." Ex. 23:19 says, "The FIRST OF THE FIRSTFRUITS of thy land thou shalt bring into the house of the LORD thy God." Aren't the wise virgins the FIRST OF THE FIRSTFRUITS?

> > the 50th day always falls on the day after the weekly Sabbath.

I'll be happy with Sunday, if that is the right day. However, a week is a sabbath of days. Mt. 28:1 in Green's Interlinear, says, "toward the first day of the week (sabbaton)." Pentecost may fall on the day after the 7th week has run its course. After the Feast of Firstfruits on Nisan 16 (according to Josephus, Ant. III. X. 5), there are 7 weeks complete. Then the next day is Pentecost, Sivan 7. If you count it by inclusive reckoning, it is Sivan 6.

> > 1 Cor. 15:51 Behold, I (Paul) show you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: (not the 7th trump of Revelation, but of Rosh haShanah)

I Cor. 15:51,52 describes the 2nd Rapture. It is on Rosh haShanah/Feast of Trumpets. That is the LAST TRUMP. The FIRST TRUMP is described in I Thess. 4:13-18. The first trump of the Bible sounded at Sinai at Pentecost. That is when Israel was called to the marriage. Jer. 3:14 says, "Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I am MARRIED unto you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion" (the heavenly Zion, at the Pre-Trib Rapture).

> > Just because we are born on a certain date does not indicate our life will end on that date

Strangely enough, Enoch was supposed to have been born and raptured on Sivan 6, Pentecost.

> > Where in Scripture does it give indication that the church could end at Pentecost?

It doesn't. The Laodiceans get left behind at the Pre-Trib Rapture and are caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture on the Feast of Trumpets. The trial that is to come during the Tribulation "shall come upon ALL THE WORLD, to try them that dwell upon the earth" (Rev. 3:10), not just on Israel. The Age of the Gentiles, the Age of the Jews, and the Age of the Church all end in a photo finish at the end of the 2300-day (Dan. 8:14) shortened Tribulation. That is the consummation of the Ages. I Cor. 10:11 says, "Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ENDS OF THE world (lit., AGES) are come."

> > The 70ths week does start shortly after that on Yom Kippur, Tishrei 10, because Joel 2:15 tells us what day the 70th week quits on, which is Yom Kippur

Joel 2:15 gives this announcement, "Blow the trumpet in Zion, sanctify a fast, call a solemn assembly." The trumpet is blown on the Feast of Trumpets, Tishri 1. Don't the Days of Awe between Trumpets and Yom Kippur sanctify the fast coming up on Tishri 10, the Day of Atonement? Then on Tishri 15, a solemn assembly will be called on the Feast of Tabernacles.

> > The Bridegroom, Jesus, is coming out of his chamber, hadar-which means wedding chamber, and his bride is coming out of her closet, or chuppah-wedding canopy they were married under. Verse 17, let the priests, the ministers of the Lord, weep between the porch and the altar . . the only feast they do that on is the feast of Yom Kippur, Day of Atonement.

The Feast of Trumpets that begins the Millennium will be like no other day--ever. I think it is Coronation Day, day of the Marriage of the Lamb, the Judgment Seat of Christ, and the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. Israel is being attacked by Gog's army. People's hearts are failing them for fear at what is coming upon the world. The priests weep. They need the Lord to fight for them that day, and he does. The 7 trumpet judgments hit Earth that day. Only 1/6th of Gog's army is left (Eze. 39:2).

> > Day of Atonement. They cry out to be spared, because if Jesus and his bride do not come and save them, they are to be wiped out.

The Second Advent is still 7 Jewish months in the future (Eze. 39:12). Jesus will return as the latter rain on Nisan 1, the first day of the Regnal Year and Sacred Year (Hos. 6:3; Eze. 29:17,21) in a Jewish Leap Year. Israel has already been saved. All that remains is to bury the bodies to cleanse the land for the Lord's glorious return.

> > in Isaiah 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, hadar-wedding chamber, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation (tribulation) be overpast.

This is the Pre-Wrath Rapture on the Feast of Trumpets that begins the millennial Day of the Lord. The first group, those caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture, are seen in Heaven in Rev. 5:9. The second group, those caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture on the Feast of Trumpets are caught up on the very same day that God's Wrath is poured out on unbelievers. That group is seen in Heaven in Rev. 7:14, before the 7th seal is broken in Rev. 8.

Nu. 10:2-4 says, " Make thee TWO TRUMPETS OF SILVER; of a whole piece shalt thou make them: that thou mayest USE THEM FOR THE CALLING OF THE ASSEMBLY, AND FOR THE JOURNEYING OF THE CAMPS. And when they shall blow with them (both), ALL the assembly shall assemble themselves to thee at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation (the second Rapture, as in I Cor. 15:51). And if they blow but with ONE TRUMPET, then the princes, which are heads of the thousands of Israel, shall gather themselves unto thee." The FIRST TRUMPET of I Thess. 4:16 gathers the elders of Rev. 4:4, "which are heads of the thousands of Israel," just as this suggests. These silver trumpets are not the shofar that is blown on the Feast of Trumpets. We must not confuse the trumpet calls. At the Pre-Trib Rapture, I Thess. 4:16 tells us that it is " the trump of God." It is not the shofar blasts that sound every time the Feast of Trumpets rolls around.

Since the first trump of the Bible sounded at Sinai at Pentecost, I think there is reason to expect the first trump of God of I Thess. 4:16 to sound on Pentecost. The precedent has been set. Song of Sol. 2:10-14 shows that it is in the spring too. "Come away" is yalak, depart, take away, vanish. Agape

Incoming email

Thank you so much for sharing with us your wonderful spirit filled wisdom. I cannot begin to tell you the difference you have made in my life over the past two years. It has been through you that I have learned, studied and finally understood God's written word. I lost my little boy on the 10 May 1998 in a car accident it was a Sunday, Mother's Day here in South Africa. I read with interest on your last P&C that Pentecost could be 14 May 2000, again it is Sunday, Mothers Day. Would it not be wonderful if I was reunited with my little boy again on Mother's Day? Perhaps this has been my space to repent. Marilyn, through you and thanks to you I have a deeper relationship with the Lord and I pray every day that I can be accounted worthy to escape on the first bus. Thank you once again. Agape. Kind regards to you and Ed. See you soon.

My reply

Thanks. I'm happy to know my writing helps someone. I don't know which day might be the real Pentecost for sure, but Sivan 7, June 10, seems the most likely to me. Any time soon is ok with me for the Rapture. You will see your son again, whenever it is. Time seems short. Blessings. Agape

Incoming email

Subject: April 6
Marilyn, just another interesting tidbit about that "southern jewelbox" in Carina. The article states that the "XMM-Newton observation of NGC 2516 took place on April 6 using all three EPIC cameras." Interesting date......

My reply

Yes. April 6, 2000 was Nisan 1, the same as it will be in 2008, when I think the Second Advent will take place. Agape

Incoming email

Re: calendars
While reading Pro/Con 505, someone wrote asking about the correct biblical calendar. I find it interesting that the writer says "...therefore Pentecost (Sivan 6,7) is May 10, 11 (or Sunday, May 14 for those who believe Pentecost has to be on a Sunday). "

Yesterday, while studying the parable of the fig tree, I read that Israel was formally recognized by the United Nations, on May 14th, 1948. Doesn't that essentially "re-start the clock" ?

Interesting coincidence. Keep up the great work.

My reply

Thanks for reminding me about May 14, 1948. Dr. Tabor said that was Pentecost on the natural calendar that went by the sighting of the Moon. Add 50 (for the Jubilee Year) and you get May 14,1998. I think that was the 6000th year since Adam was cast out of the Garden. If that began the grace years of Israel, as in the parable of the barren fig tree in Lu. 13:6-9, that would be the 1st year (Pentecost) when Jesus checked for fruit on the fig tree, Israel. May 14, 1999 would be the 2nd year (Pentecost) he came and checked for fruit. May 14, 2000 would be the 3rd year (Pentecost). In that year only, he comes to check AND SPEAKS. At Sinai, Moses was told to "sanctify them TO DAY and TO MORROW, and let them wash their clothes, And be ready against the THIRD DAY: for the THIRD DAY the LORD will come down" (Ex. 19:10,11).

It is possible that the Rapture could be on May 14, 2000. In the Preview of the Rapture in Rev. 1:10, John said that he became "in the Spirit on the Lord's day." That could mean the Day of the Son of Man (Lu. 17:22), the Saturday Shabbat (Christ is Lord of the Sabbath), or Sunday, which was Resurrection Day. Let's just wash our robes in the blood of the Lamb (i.e., confess our sins, I Jn. 1:9; Rev. 7:14) and be ready, whichever day he comes. Agape


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