Pro and Con 509

Posted 5-17-00

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Re: Lot's wife
The fate of Lotīs wife has for some reason interested me. Is there some symbolism behind in that story? Could it also hint that maybe one qualification for rapture(s) is the fact that one must be willing to go the moment the calling comes. Many Christians, who have never heard of rapture, may be unwilling to go at moments notice (because of newly married, new house, new field, etc). Is there not verses in Bible that say that those that look back are not fit for kingdom of God?

Could this be another factor besides having your sins forgiven? Where your treasure is there is your heart. Finland

My reply

Lot's wife is an example of what can happen if we don't obey God. We can't love anything more than God, either. Mt. 10:37 says, "He that loveth father or mother more than me is NOT WORTHY of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is NOT WORTHY of me." God wants to be, deserves to be, and should be, first in our lives and hearts. Not worthy is a scary thing. Lu. 21:36 says, "Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be ACCOUNTED WORTHY TO ESCAPE all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man."

I think the parable of the marriage feast in Mt. 22 shows that some have not come because of earthly business. Verse 5 says some made light of the call to come to the marriage, "and went their ways, one to his farm, another to his merchandise." The rich man turned away from following Jesus because of his possessions.

Heb. 12:23 speaks of our being gathered to the general assembly in Heaven. Verse 25 issues a strong warning. It says, "See that ye REFUSE NOT him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall NOT WE ESCAPE, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:" When he says, "Come up hither," I aim to GO. To refuse is unthinkable. Agape

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Re: Psalm 26 and 28
There is a verse in the book of Revelation (13:5), which suggests that the evil one blasphemes those in the Heaven. Wonder if it means them that were taken in the first rapture? As I was reading Psalms, I noticed two points where one could get the idea that bad people were removed from earth. The finnish translation actually uses the same very word (in both verses) that is used for rapture.

In KJV the Psalms begin as follows:
(26:9) Gather not my soul with...
(28:3) Draw me not away with ...

Is there poor translation in KJV, or how exactly these verses should be understood?

My reply

As Rev. 13 opens, the scene is the very beginning of the Tribulation. The Beast out of the sea (nations, Rev. 17:15) comes to full power over both United Nations (13:7) and United Religions (13:8). I think he is the Tribulation Pope. Rev. 13:5,6 is a view during the first half of the Tribulation. It says, "And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months (3.5 years). And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN." Yes, that means that those were caught up to Heaven BEFORE the Tribulation began.

This passage dovetails with Zech. 5:1-4. From it, we can get an idea of some of his blasphemy. It says, "I turned, and lifted up mine eyes, and looked, and behold a flying roll (megillah, rolling thing). And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits (probably a binary asteroid, Rev. 8:8,10). Then said he unto me, This is THE CURSE that goeth forth (ORBITS) over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it. I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts, and it shall enter into the house of the thief (the False Prophet), and into the house of HIM THAT SWEARETH FALSELY BY MY NAME (the Tribulation Pope): and it shall remain in the midst of his house, and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof."

In Psa. 26:9, acaph is a primitive root, to gather for any purpose. I don't think it is talking about the Rapture.

In Psa. 28:1, David doesn't want to "become like them that go down into the pit. Therefore in v. 3: "Draw (mashak, a primitive root, to draw) me not away with the wicked" makes good sense. It is a drawing down into the pit. Agape

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Good Morning my Sister in the Lord,
*I am --- the one who had the death experience some years ago..was taken to Heaven by the 2 men in white..and then The Heavenly Father said, "Not Yet". Indeed, the Heaven I saw was a tawny gold.

*Last week my husband had a doctor's appointment with a new doctor. As we entered the medical suite there was a plaque and photo of the suite having been dedicated to a certain Dr.; strangely the same one who had given me the medicine who caused my 'death'.

* This week in the Baltimore area we have had the most unusual weather. Two tornado warnings with violent storms. I have never experienced the one like yesterday afternoon. The wind and the rain were fierce. As the storm passed on to the East, I looked out our front door. There was the strangest glow on the very tall trees. I went to the back door, looked to the West and the sky was immense with the breathtaking tawny yellow glow. I went to the front door again and looked to the East and there it was..a large beautiful rainbow arching the area. 'As in the days of Noah...'

*I too wonder which language we will speak in Heaven. When the two men took me to Heaven and presented me at the gate, they spoke some words that I did not understand, to the Heavenly Father. Then the Heavenly Father spoke to me in English, "Not Yet". When I said that I wanted to come in, He just looked at me in the eyes and then to the men in white and then they carried me away. I saw only this tawny gold like open area and the 'City', also tawny gold off in the distance.

*Marilyn, I don't have words to express my sincere thanks to you for your obedient studies. On the forum, when that person was calling you, 'Dear Woman', I laughed to myself remembering the days when I was heavily involved in teaching Child Evangelism classes in the church and community. When I would come up with a Biblical insight from those CEF studies and share them in the church; I can remember the 'learned mature members of the church' looking over their glasses and giving me that look "what makes you think you have more Biblical knowledge than we!?" Well..we have the Joy also. Thanks for All. In the Joy of the Lord, our Strength

My reply

How nice to hear from you again. Glad you saw a rainbow. They are amazing to see. It reminds us of God's covenant with the Earth. We are hearing of several now, some very unusual. One was very low and in a wooded area, not the usual way we see them way up in the sky.

I don't like that eerie yellow look to the atmosphere. When I see it, I say, "It looks like it's going to storm." I don't know what causes it. I'd like to find out.

It's strange, but people that have different ideas about the timing of end-time events still say that they think the Rapture is probably close. Things just seem to be falling right into place so the Tribulation looms nearer and nearer.

I figure that since God could confuse mankind's language instantly, he can un-confuse it just as easily. At Pentecost in 30 AD, "every man heard them speak in his own language" (Acts 2:6). It must be a snap for the Lord to give us understanding. Zeph. 3:8,9 says, " Therefore wait ye upon me, saith the LORD, until the day that I rise up to the prey: for my determination is to gather the nations, that I may assemble the kingdoms, to pour upon them mine indignation, even all my fierce anger: for all the earth shall be devoured with the fire of my jealousy. For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the LORD, to serve him with one consent." If Earth will have a pure language, chances are Heaven does. Agape

Incoming email

Subject: My Noah
My son Noah was born on Sunday August 31, 1997, which was (first day of the week) Av 28 5757. (Interesting it was also the day Diana Spencer of England died suddenly).

Since it is now the year 5760, we are in the THIRD year since he was born. It was Sunday August 1, 1999 or Av 19, 5759 (second year and first day of the week) that Noah literally died in my arms (TOTAL respiratory failure at the very least), but came back to life with no ill effects AFTER I prayed over his totally non responsive and non breathing body, praying to the Lord to return him to us. No medical person was able to relate any case such as his from their experience and only could "guess" what happened. I don't need a medical opinion, I accept he was raised from the dead in answer to prayer. In no way am I even suggesting that I am anything special, but Paul and Peter had this capacity briefly during their apostleship. At the very least, the Lord answered my prayer for sure. Also, I SAY HUMBLY, it is incredible to me that I have ALL of the gifts of the spirit of ICorinthians12, EXCEPT of course, tongues, supernatural powers and healing. Nobody has these today, these were for the apostles only, they needed it to get out the word. As for me, I pray that the Lord will use me in any way that glorifies our Father Jehovah.

My further thoughts on the hail are that they represent judgement coming upon Israel (the tribulation). The thunder that Friday did as I said before, literally shake the ground and it was frightening. I have been trying to reach out to several Russian Jewish people recently, without any visible progress. Maybe this was an event I can share with them, maybe not. All I know is since I became a Priest in the Kingdom of God in 1997, as you helped me realize, I have seen and done things I have never done in my life. When I read the Scripture, I never could have imagined how easily I can discern it. Now I know what you must have felt like since 1960! I am up every night until 3AM at least studying! It is so wonderful! Agape

My reply

Thanks for this information. I thought Noah just might be 3 years old. That is very interesting. At Sinai, they were told to be ready against the 3rd day, that the LORD would come down. You seem to be getting your own set of signs, from being in the end of the rainbow to your experience with Noah.

It is exciting to learn anything new from the Bible. The hair stands up on my arms. With the new computer and the Bible Plus program, I am able to work faster. I'm getting to bed between 12:30 and 1:00 AM most nights now. I think I ache less with more sleep too.

When I get P & C 508 loaded, let me know what you think about Jesus' assessment of the churches being from the vantage point of the Ascension Day just 10 days before the Rapture. This could be why it is a certain thing that the tribulation in 2:10 will only last 10 more days. Agape

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Below is further information regarding what I inquired of you about a few days ago relative to the roughly 240 difference in the Jewish and Biblical timeline. I thought you might be interested. In Christ ------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
From: Jim Bramlett
Thanks. I have read of how the Jews purposely omitted some years in their history. In January 1999 I copied the below from Larry Pahl's Web page and posted it on the 5D site. I cannot vouch for Pahl's accuracy but it is an explanation. I have read another different but similar explanation.
God bless. Jim
(From Larry Pahl's Web page, written 4-5 years ago)

Some may wonder if the above accounting is correct, why is the current year on the Jewish calendar the year 5997 if that is truly the number of years since Adam. Instead the Jews give the current year as 5754/5755.7 There is thus a 242 year difference between the date we have just calculated for 1994 (5997), and what the present Jewish calendar tells us (5754/5755). What is the source of this difference? As I surveyed Jewish material to get at the sources of the present Jewish calendar, I realized that the explanation would have to be a powerful one. Times, dates, and calendars are not things that change flippantly, casually, or often. Every effect must have a cause powerful enough to explain it. In my research I discovered an adequate cause to explain this powerful effect, that has Jews all over the world incorrectly numbering the years from Adam. It is a reminder that religious hierarchies have often misled their constituencies in the history of this world. The compilers of the Seder Haddoroth, charged with arranging the calendar, placed the rebellion of Bar Cochab as beginning at 3892 (from Adam). Now Bar Cochab's false claims to be the Messiah came in 132 A.D. So the Haddoroth compilers made 132 A.D. to be 3892. The problem is that 132 A.D. was really the year 4130, that is 4130 years from Adam. 3892 had already occured 238 years ago, in 107 B.C., the beginning of the Hasmonean Kingdom. What would have possibly led the Haddoroth compilers to so flagrantly tamper with the numbering of the years? Many times in history a mighty dictator comes in and has the history of the past changed to flatter his own accomplishments and to meet his own political ends. We saw Kruschev do this to Stalin; the Assyrian and Egyptian kinds engaged in this. So the records of history have often been slanted for political and self-serving ends.

Now Jews have always been diligent and respectful scholars when it comes to maintaining the integrity of their own history. But they have come to a time now when most Jews do not believe in the historicity of the Exodus or the account of the fall of Adam and Eve. Their much education has blinded them to their true spiritual and historical roots. They persecuted the prophets Isaiah and Jeremiah who simply were trying to tell them the truth.

But even so that has been a historic respect for the Scriptures among them. Think of Jesus' references to their phylacteries. but the one thing more than any other which has caused the Jewish mind to lose clarity and level-headed rationality is the claim of Jesus of Nazareth to be the Messiah. If the chronology of their fathers had been followed, as given in germ in this issue, they would have had to take seriously the words of Jesus given in the beginning of Mark's gospel: And saying, "The time is fulfilled..." {MAR 1:15 KJV}

No! they could not do it! The preferred to go with Bar Cochab, one who claimed to be the Messiah in 132 A.D. Bar Cochab proclaimed himself Messiah and was accepted by Rabbi Aquiba. He raised the standard of revolt in Judea and flouted the Romans. Now this is the kind of Messiah that Jesus tried to warn His disciples about, but that unregenerate human flesh longs for. A hero! A muscle man! The Romans were forced to send their best generals against Bar Cochab, and after three and one half years they utterly slayed his forces in 135 A.D. 580,000 Jews were killed in actual fighting!!!!! besides the number who succumbed to famine, disease, and fire. Over a million Jews met their death as a result of this deluded forger of the Messianic claims. The result was that in 135 the Romans forbade the Jews from entering Jerusalem on pain of death. What a price to pay for following an imposter, a false Messiah. Yet the three and a half year period of Roman siege ending with the cutting off of the Jews was said by these later compilers to be the final three and a half years of Daniel's 70 week prophecy, calculated from the 2nd year of Darius I (3402 from Adam).8 This made 132 A.D. be 3892. But 3892 had always been 107 B.C. by all former Jewish calculations. But the compilers of the Seder Haddoroth, coming this side of Jesus, had a political and religious purpose in rearranging the chronology--to discredit Jesus as the true Messiah and to put on the throne instead a Barrabbas; Bar Cochab. That is why to this day the Jewish calendar is off by over 200 years from the true number of years from Adam. Expensive delusion! It is a definite part of God's plan for God's people, true Christians, to work for the salvation of the Jewish people now, at the end of this age. {ROM 11:30 KJV} For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: {31} Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. {MAL 4:6 KJV} And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.

May this humble effort at drawing out the Bible's chronology and the discrepancy in the Jewish year be used to reach the Jews with the good news of their Messiah, Y'shua, the Lord Jesus. Maranatha! ---
"The World's Greatest Truths" at:

My reply

> > The compilers of the Seder Haddoroth, charged with arranging the calendar, placed the rebellion of Bar Cochab as beginning at 3892 (from Adam).

Thanks. I appreciate your sending this to me. It was interesting. However, I can't accept it as really giving us the true number of years.

How do we know that the 3892 years from Adam is correct? Without any way of checking that out, to me, the rest is floating on air.

If we start from Gen. 5:3 ("Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son...Seth"), and build up the OT chronology from the information given in the Masoretic Text, it looks to me like there is a 283-year difference between the creation of Adam just before God rested on Tishri 1, in BC 4044, and the beginning of the Jewish Calendar on Oct. 7, BC 3761. Thus, a 242-year difference doesn't seem right to me, whatever the reason the calendar got pegged where it did.

I also think Adam was given 40 years of probation and testing before he was cast out of the Garden of Eden. The second Adam was tested 40 days. Israel was tested 40 years in the wilderness. They were tested the 40 days that Moses was on Mt. Sinai before he broke the two stone tablets. Jerusalem was tested 40 years from the Resurrection in 30 AD to 70 AD, when she was destroyed. Over and over, we see that the number 40 means probation and testing.

De. 8:2 says, "And thou shalt remember all the way which the LORD thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and TO PROVE THEE, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no."

Just as "Isaac was forty years old when he took Rebekah to wife" (Gen. 25:20), I think modern unified Jerusalem will be 40 when the Marriage of the Lamb takes place (1967 to 2007). Also, just as Moses broke the stone tablets at the end of 40 days, I think the two pieces of the asteroid of Rev. 8:8,10 will strike Earth 40 years after Jerusalem was taken by Israel in 1967.

The Lord had a lot to teach Adam. By Gen. 4:20-22, man dwelt in tents, used harps and organs, and worked with both brass and iron. From the first, the names of the animals must have been recorded for future generations so that they were not forgotten. From the time that Seth and Enoch were inspired by God to draw up the pictorial gospel story told in the stars that we call the Zodiac, the names God gave the stars have been recorded. Adam was probably in on this too. After all, Adam, Seth and Enoch were contemporaries for 565 years.

I think man's 7000 years of testing only began when Adam was judged and cast out in BC 4004/03. From that time on, man is tested being mortal and knowing both good and evil. I also think that the Tribulation years are inserted into the 7000-year timeline. Eccl. 8:5 says, " and a wise man's heart discerneth both time and judgment." I take time to be 7000 years and judgment to be 7 years. Agape

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Re: five foolish virgins in the U.S.
You are truely blessed with the power of the Holy Spirit in opening end time secrets.You have answered and shown me areas I've never even considered.Thank God for such a faithful servant at the right time!The partial rapture is new to me,although the idea brought itself up in my mind in the past.My question to you(having no other wiser than yourself to ask):If the United States is to be destroyed by nukes or asteroid or wrath,where does that leave those represented by the 5 foolish virgins living in the U.S.?

I print by the tens copies of 'Penticost 2000' and distribute them to, well, a lot of people. I fear for church-goer friens and others that may miss the rapture.I also have a healthy fear of the Lord myself!I'm Irish and have had many a temperment bout with myself

What more can we do for the unsaved and/or foolish virgin category,whole still battling the 'old man' nature in onesself? I love you,In HIM,your other brother

My reply

> > If the United States is to be destroyed by nukes or asteroid or wrath,where does that leave those represented by the 5 foolish virgins living in the U.S.?

There are two Raptures, one before the 7-year Tribulation (the Pre-Trib Rapture), one just before the wrath of God is poured out on unbelievers. The foolish Laodicean virgins be caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture. No believer will be left behind the second time.

Maybe if I give some of the sequence of events, you will be able to see it better as you read Revelation. In Rev. 4:1, the Pre-Trib Rapture takes place when Christ says, "Come up hither." We can be certain that means the Rapture for when Moses and Elijah hear "Come up hither" in the middle of the Tribulation plus 3.5 days, they ascend up to Heaven too (Rev. 11:12).

The Pre-Trib Rapture is before the book (title deed to the Earth) is even given to Christ. Not one seal has yet been broken. Therefore, the Tribulation has not started. It starts at the breaking of the first seal in Rev. 6. In Rev. 5:9, we see the saints "out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" in Heaven. These are those in the LESSER SHEEPFOLD in the gospel in the stars. Following the Pre-Trib Rapture, 6 seals are broken in Rev. 6. They take us from the beginning of the Tribulation to the beginning of the Millennium. Verse 17 ends up with, "For the great day of his wrath is come."

Next, in Rev. 7:9,14, we see the Tribulation saints in Heaven. It says, "After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne...These are they which CAME OUT OF GREAT TRIBULATION, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb."

Mk. 13:27 shows this gathering. It says, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth (the Pre-Wrath Rapture) to the uttermost part of heaven" (those already in Heaven, i.e., caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture.

After they too are in Heaven, the 7th seal is broken in Rev. 8, unleashing the fury of God's wrath (the 7 trumpet judgments) on unbelievers left on Earth.

This is the Feast of Trumpets that begins Christ's millennial reign as King of kings and Lord of lords. Rev. 11:15-18 summarizes some of the events of this day. All saints are in Heaven to receive their rewards at the Judgment Seat of Christ. It says, "And the seventh angel sounded (the 7th trumpet); and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever (he is given dominion and his golden crown, see Dan. 7:13,14; Rev. 14:14 below ). And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, Saying, We give thee thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art TO COME (the Second Advent is still 7 months in the future, Eze. 39:12); because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. And the nations were angry (Israel is being attacked by Gog's army, Eze. 38), and thy wrath is come (Eze. 38:18-20), and the time of the dead, that they should be judged (the Judgment Seat of Christ), and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great (every believer); AND shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth." The saints are in Heaven receiving their rewards when God's wrath strikes Earth.

Dan. 7:13,: "one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him DOMINION, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed."

Rev. 14:14-19: "upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man (Christ), having on his head a GOLDEN CROWN, and in his hand a sharp sickle. And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time (Tishri 1, Feast of Trumpets) is come for thee to reap (Pre-Wrath Rapture); for the harvest (the ones in the GREATER SHEEPFOLD) of the earth is ripe. And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe (both these reapings take place on Tishri 1, time of the vintage). And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the WRATH OF GOD."

> > What more can we do for the unsaved and/or foolish virgin category,whole still battling the 'old man' nature in onesself?

First, we must confess all known sins committed since we accepted Christ. He is faithful and just to cleanse us of all unrighteousness when we do that (I Jn. 1:9). Then we are in fellowship with our Holy God and are filled with His Holy Spirit. We can't be very effective in our own Christian walk or in helping others in our own strength. We need to do all in agape love in His strength. Prepare yourself to have an answer for the hope that is in you. Then pray that the Lord will use you to reach others. Turn it over to him. He will bring it to mind what you should do. We are all different, have different gifts and callings. Only He knows what you can do best, and what direction you should head. When you are working in the power of the Holy Spirit, you will be effective. If not, we all are as tinkling cymbals and sounding brass. We need, and must have, the Spirit of God in us till our cup is overflowing. Then God's agape love can flow through us and out to others. It sounds as if you have made a good start. Agape

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