Pro and Con 540

Posted 6-22-00

Incoming email

Are you still there??? Haven't seen a post in 2 or 3 days. Wondering if you are alright?

My reply

I'm ok, and giving a big sigh of relief. I just now finally figured out how to uninstall a Download Demon that turned out to act like one. I went to McAfee to DL the latest antivirus data, made the mistake of clicking the one with this Zip DL Demon that is supposed to be able to pick up a dropped DL. It kept me from opening my Zipped Web site file to get an image I need to put on the Geocities site. I think I'm ok now. Have restarted my PC. Back to business. Will try to UL to my web site tonight. Agape

Incoming email

Re: Feast of Israel
Can you recommend a good source for studying the feast of Israel from a prophetic standpoint? Preferably something on the web.

I think that there are 7 major feast. It is interesting that the first three Passover, First Fruits and Pentecost were fulfilled in the NT on the very feast days. Christ was crucified on Passover. He was resurrected on First Fruits. The Holy Spirit came upon the disciples on Passover.

If God is consistent in fullfilling the OT "Spring Feast", on the very feast days in the NT, it would not seem unreasonable to expect Him to fullfill the OT "Fall Feast" on the very feast day in the NT. The next feast that I expect to be fulfilled is Rosh Hashana (sp) which I believe is associated with the blowing of trumpets. Could it be that the rapture will be the dramatic event that will fulfill the first of the "Fall feast' in the NT and rather than Pentecost? Cheers

My reply

Try The Seven Festivals of the Messiah, by Eddie Chumley. I don't agree on every point, but it is good to get a Messianic Jewish point of view. Here is one URL. You may have to go back to his home page to access the whole thing.
(http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/2175/chap8.html#CHAP8)

This email just came in today.
"Messianic Rabbi Michael Rood [www.6001.com] announced today on the Prophecy Club that the corrected Solar Calendar proves that Shavuot begins this year on July 9th. This because the barley was 'Abib', green/ripe, on June 5th.

"This makes Oct. 28th Tishri 1, 6001.

"If his calculations are correct then the Pentecost Rapture may still occur this year."

One thing that has always stopped me from thinking that the Feast of Trumpets could be the Pre-Trib Rapture is Song of Sol. 2:10-14. The former rain starts Tishri 1, on the Feast of Trumpets. The latter rain starts on Nisan 1, the first day of the Regnal and Sacred Year. If that passage in Song of Sol. applies to the Rapture, it should be in late spring or early summer. The other thing that stops me is because there are so many things happening on the Feast of Trumpets that begins the millennial Day of the Lord. It will be fulfilled. I think the Coronation of Christ, the Pre-Wrath Rapture, the Judgment Seat of Christ, the Marriage of the Lamb and the Marriage Supper of the Lamb all happen on Trumpets.

If the Tribulation is to start on the Feast of Weeks/Pentecost, 2001, and there is to be a gap between the Rapture and the Tribulation (Rev. 17:12,14), it looks like we are fast running out of time....

Tamuz 6 or 7 is July 9 or 10. I hope we will be raptured by then. Agape

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Re: July 9th Pentecost?
I have studied Rood to some degree. He hold's the view that we will go through the tribulation, which seems to be common among many Messianic Jews, but if we can set that error aside, he has EXTENSIVELY studied the Jewish dating system and how they determined when different feasts should actually occur. I believe him to be as accurate as anyone on determining these dates. He is adamant about Shavout being on July 9th. Could it be, a July 9th Rapture? Blessings

My reply

I think you are right about some Messianic Jews thinking we will go through the Tribulation. Dr. Tabor thinks that way too.

Thanks so much for giving me more information about Michael Rood. I hope we go on July 9. Do you have access to information about the way he starts counting the Omer? July 9 is Tamuz 6. It seems to me that July 10 could also be included. After reading Josephus, I decided that it was counted from Nisan 16, making day one Nisan 17 and Pentecost on Sivan 7. One month later would be Tamuz 7.

Do you know if Michael Rood teaches anything about the true Jubilee cycle? Agape

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RE: Amazing work!!!
Been "surfing" your profound explanations re Bible Prophecy... Haven't been able to read and "digest" it all yet, but simply want to express my thanks to you for so generously sharing this amazing, massive work on the internet! You have certainly caused me to appreciate the Bible's marvel and to desire to work however I may (out of love for Jesus Christ/Triune Godhead) for our Lord and Savior, to share the excitement of the free gift of eternal life with Him!!! I would expect you to hear the "Well done, thou good and faithful servant" as you enter into His rest!!! Appreciatively

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Re: Flying scrolls.
Well done, keep up the good work. We also beleive that the rapture is close. A couple of questions:

I am not sure how you get a Flying scroll to be an asteroid.(Zech 5:1-4). The curse in verse 4 refers back to the flying scroll in verse 1.

Secondly, in P & C 538 you suggest that the ancient and honourable is the Pope. However the context of this passage refers to Israel. ' Therefore the Lord will cut off from Israel head and tail branch and rush, in one day. The ancient and honourable he is the head; and the prophet that teacheth lies, he is the tail.

Who therefore is Israel in this context?

Next, Paul being a castaway. I do not think that Paul actually considered that he could possibly become a castaway, but rather that if he did not keep his body under submission he would APPEAR TO BE a castaway to those to whom he was preaching. The word 'be' should have been translated 'appear to be' and the word for castaway actually should be better translated ' not approved'. (Adokimos....

Next. Thyatira. Strongs says the word means 'odour of affliction'. You suggested that it meant 'thoroughly married'. Are both meanings correct? They seem rather far apart to me.

I know you hold the date of September 13 1993 in some relevance. I agree. That very day we were driving back from a short holiday in the Isle of Skye on the west coast of Scotland, and listening to the morning service on BBC radio. If there is a sort of national expression of 'religion' in this country then this is probably it. (incidentally we now only listen to it as a useful study in watery doctrine, political correctness and apostate teaching, with the odd bit of truth mixed in!) Anyway as a matter of fact that very day, knowing that the agreement was to be made on the White House lawn a few hours later, the Old Testament reading on this broadcast over the whole nation was Ezra chapter 9, which includes the following verses...' Now therefore give not your daughters unto their sons, neither take their daughters unto your sons, NOR SEEK THEIR PEACE OR THEIR WEALTH FOR EVER: that ye may be strong, and eat the good of the land, and leave it for an inheritance to your children for ever.'

I very much doubt whether the people who chose the passage had any idea what they were actually doing. I doubt whether anyone involved in the broadcast at that level is actually aware of the significance of Israel. But it was certainly more than a coincidence. See you soon.

My reply

> > I am not sure how you get a Flying scroll to be an asteroid.(Zech 5:1-4).

Zech. 5:1-4 says, "I turned, and lifted up mine eyes (it is in the sky), and looked, and behold a flying roll (megillah, something that rolls, like a scroll, i.e., a rolling thing). And he said unto me, What seest thou? And I answered, I see a flying roll; the length thereof is twenty cubits, and the breadth thereof ten cubits (it is twice as long as it is wide, maybe a binary asteroid). Then said he unto me, This is THE CURSE (i.e., the 'flaming sword' of Gen. 3:24) that goeth forth (i.e., orbits) over the face of the whole earth: for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it; and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it. I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts, and it shall enter into the house of the thief (the False Prophet, son of perdition like Judas Iscariot), and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name (the Pope, who claims infallibility): and it shall remain in the midst of his house (at Babylon, 'in the land of Shinar,' Zech. 5:11, Gen. 11:2), and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof."

Rev. 18:21 shows us that the curse, this flying rolling thing that will be chased by a whirlwind and "fall grievously upon the head of the wicked" (Jer. 23:19), is a stone. It says, "And a mighty angel took up A STONE like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.

Isa. 22:16-19 says, "What hast thou here (Babylon)? and whom hast thou here (the Satan-possessed False Prophet), that thou hast hewed thee out a sepulchre here, as he (Satan) that heweth him out a sepulchre on high (in the sky), and that graveth an habitation for himself in a rock (the asteroid, a piece of his split-apart planet, Rahab)? Behold, the LORD will carry thee away with a mighty captivity, and will surely cover thee. He will surely violently turn (by means of a whirlwind) and TOSS THEE LIKE A BALL into a large country (Iraq): there shalt thou die, and there the chariots of thy glory shall be the shame of thy lord's house. And I will drive thee from thy station, and from thy state shall he pull thee down."

Remember David's sling? It was a leather thong. He placed the smooth rock in it, whirled it around, and let go of one end. The rock struck Goliath (symbol of the world government) in the forehead and killed him. Then, to finish painting the symbolic picture, David cut off Goliath's head with HIS OWN SWORD. This asteroid is called "the flaming sword" (Ge. 3:24) and the Sword of the Lord.

The Sword of the Lord strikes on the Feast of Trumpets. This was depicted when Gideon beat Midian, Ju. 7:18-21 says, " When I blow with a trumpet, I and all that are with me, then blow ye the trumpets also on every side of all the camp, and say, THE SWORD OF THE LORD, and of Gideon. So Gideon, and the hundred men that were with him, came unto the outside of the camp in the beginning of the middle watch; and they had but newly set the watch: and they BLEW THE TRUMPETS, AND BRAKE THE PITCHERS (of clay?) that were in their hands. And the three companies blew the trumpets, and brake the pitchers, and held the lamps (burning torches) in their left hands, and the trumpets in their right hands to blow withal: and they cried, THE SWORD OF THE LORD, and of Gideon. And they stood every man in his place round about the camp; and all the host ran, and cried, and fled."

Jesus' long day, the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord, was prefigured by Joshua's long day. The name Jesus equals Joshua in Hebrew. Jos. 10:11 says, "it came to pass, as they fled from before Israel, and were in the going down to Bethhoron, that the LORD CAST DOWN GREAT STONES FROM HEAVEN UPON THEM unto Azekah, and they died: they were more which died with hailstones than they whom the children of Israel slew with the sword." This will be true of Gog's army that attacks Israel on the Feast of Trumpets that begins the Millennium.

> > Who therefore is Israel in this context?

Israel is literal Israel. The whole world, including Israel, will first be ruled by the Beast, who I think will be the Tribulation Pope (Rev. 13:7,8), and then by the False Prophet.

> > Paul being a castaway. I do not think that Paul actually considered that he could possibly become a castaway, but rather that if he did not keep his body under submission he would APPEAR TO BE a castaway.

Paul knew he would not be a castaway, because he kept his body under submission. However, he also knew that IF he did not keep his body under submission, he would become a foolish virgin castaway (adokimos, disapproved one). The prize he was working for was to be included in the first Rapture group. In Phil. 3:14, he said, "I press toward the mark for the PRIZE OF THE HIGH CALLING OF GOD IN CHRIST JESUS."

Those that become castaways, are cut off at the first Rapture. Lu. 12:46 says, "The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder (lit., cut him off), and will appoint him his portion (2300 days, Dan. 8:14) with the unbelievers." Mt. 24:51 adds, "shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites (pretenders): there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth." Remember the parable of the marriage? One without a wedding garment was cast out. Mt. 22:13,14 says, "Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness (outside the door), there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. For many are called, but few are chosen." Rev. 17:14 says, "they that are with him (Christ) are called, and chosen, and faithful."

> > Thyatira. Strongs says the word means 'odour of affliction'. You suggested that it meant 'thoroughly married

The Seven Churches of Revelation, by Edmont Hains, has "PERGAMOS means 'thoroughly married'" and "THYATIRA means 'dominating female.'" I might have picked up the wrong meaning. Sorry.

However, it isn't far off what I think will happen. This group will join up with and head up the United Religions. Wouldn't you say she will marry the world? Also, I think the Tribulation Pope will head up the OWG as well as the UR.

> > NOR SEEK THEIR PEACE OR THEIR WEALTH FOR EVER

The Lord has his fingers in everything. He may brought that verse out on the airwaves on purpose. Israel should turn to the Lord and trust him to give them the land he promised them. Instead, they are trying to pass a law to jail anyone that tries to convert people to another religion. They are against Messianic Jews, even, not wanting to let them come to Israel. They are trusting in their own strength, which will prove to be inadequate. They are giving up land for so-called peace. Peace, peace, when there is no peace. When they are absolutely helpless, they will finally turn to the Lord, and he will fight for them. As a nation, they are too obstinate for their own good. The Lord will show them in his own good time. Then all Israel will turn to him in a day.

What gets me is that it is all prewritten in the Old Testament. Why can't they read it and understand what they are facing? Do they think Eze. 38 won't happen? Too bad, it will. Agape

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Re: Your site
I admire you greatly for all the time you spend keeping up your site and answering our letters! Thanks so much!!!! You hard work is appreciated dear Sister!

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Re: 2007
I was wondering what special significance Yom Kippur has when it falls on the Sabbath, as it will in 2007. Sincerely

My reply

I really don't know. I can only guess. I think Israel will be born in a day on the Feast of Trumpets. It seems that they will repent so they will be accepted by the Lord of the Sabbath on the following Day of Atonement. In Lu. 6:5, Jesus said, "the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath." Agape

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Re: United Religions
I was looking into the United Religions and discovered that Pope John Paul II is opposed to it. This Pope, at least, will not belong to it nor will the Catholic Church under his tenure. What the next Pope will do is anybody's guess. There is a rumor that the Third Secret of Fatima says that a future Pope will be the Biblical False Prophet. However, this part of the prophecy, according to the rumor, will be kept secret. Sincerely

My reply

Thanks. Do you have a URL we could visit to get this information? Agape (See Pro and Con 541 for article in S.F. Chronicle)

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Re: Internet site on United Religions--mentions Catholic Church's opposition
http://fatima.freehosting.net/
Here is the address of the site with info on Vatican's strong opposition to United Religions. Sincerely

My reply

Thanks. I read "The United Religions Initiative - Vatican Opposition, Liberal Support, By Lee Penn at http://fatima.freehosting.net/Articles/Art11.htm

It is "based on research done between September 1997 and August 1999."

Lee Penn said, "At the time of the June 1999 summit conference, Bishop Swing said that "he doubted that the Roman Catholic Church would join [the URI], pointing out that it had not become a member of the World Council of Churches. But he added that he believed that Vatican would cooperate with, though not join, a body of world religions."

I think the Bible indicates that the Tribulation Pope will end up over both the One World Government and the United Religions. Rev. 13:7-9 says, " And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over ALL kindreds, and tongues, and NATIONS. And ALL that dwell upon the earth shall WORSHIP HIM, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world (i.e., pagan religions). If any man have an ear, let him hear."

In Rev. 6, the Beast rides in as a prince of peace and is a man of the cloth, hence depicted as having a fabric bow (toxon, Strong's 5115: "a bow (appar. as the simplest fabric)." Agape

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RE: Feast of Israel
I know you have heard this before but I just have to say again that your diligence in studying the Word has been a great inspiration. You are a workman that needeth not be ashamed.

My reply

Thanks. I try hard. A man who exercises at Cardiac Rehab came in and sat down briefly by me as I waited for Ed yesterday. He pointed to the things I was studying and said, "You do this all the time, don't you?" I looked at him and said, "Every minute I can." He said, "Good for you" and gave my arm a pat as he got up to go on into the exercise room. Agape

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If dinosaurs never coexisted with man, then what are the animals God spends two chapters speaking with Job about in chapters 40 and 41? The BEHEMOTH and the LEVIATHAN were some pretty awesome creatures.

JOB 40:15 "Behold now behemoth, which I made WITH (at the same time)thee;" Animals and man were created the same day. Verse 40:17 says, "He moveth his tail like a CEDAR:" A cedar is a tree isn't it? Thats one BIG tail! What animal fits that description that is alive today? That rules out most, wouldn't you agree? Verse 18 says, "...his bones are LIKE BARS OF IRON." Wow, he is big and strong. He is also quite self assured and confident. Verse 23 says, "Behold, he drinketh up a river, and hasteth not: he TRUSTETH that he can draw up Jordan into his mouth." Finally, go back to verse 19, "He is THE CHIEF of the ways of GOD:" Its as if God was saying take note of this guy, he is a sight to behold. Maybe somewhat like a diplodocus (brontosaurus) type creature that our scientists today tell us was the largest land animal that ever lived. Like A CHIEF.

And secondly, what about the Leviathan discussed at length in Job 41? What a fascinating chapter. Lets consider a few verses that describe him. Verses 8-10 say, "Lay thine hand upon him, remember the battle, do no more. Behold, the hope of him is in vain: (Message: you can't beat this guy) shall not one be cast down even at the site of him? (Message: he strikes terror in men) None is so fierce that dare stir him up:" IMPRESSIVE, but there is more. Verse 14, "Who can open the doors of his face? his TEETH ARE TERRIBLE round about." (Message: he is very dangerous, he can hurt you!) Verse 15 says, "His SCALES are his pride..." (Message: Oh, he has scales, he must also be a REPTILE! Well isn't that interesting!) Skip down to verse 25, "When he RAISETH UP HIMSELF, the mighty are afraid" (Message: Maybe he can stand up on his hind legs) And finally, consider the concluding verses of the earth THERE IS NOT HIS LIKE, who is MADE WITHOUT FEAR." Is there any animal today that has no fear of man at all? "He beholdeth all HIGH THINGS:(There it is again, is he a tall creature?) he is KING over all the children of pride." Today would our culture say that the dinosaur it named Tyrannosaurus Rex was KING over his world? I think so.
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Re: PREVIOUS E-MAIL
On June 12th I sent you a message which I have yet to hear from you about nor has it been posted on your site. I thought it went through OK from my end but who knows. Did you receive it but have not had time to answer? (I know you probably get snowed under sometimes) Please let me know. If it got lost somehow I'll send it again. Thanks. In Christ

My reply

Sorry, I have 192 emails in my Inbox on the PC and a bunch left behind on the Mac. There is no way I can answer them all. I do the best I can.

I don't think behemoth (Job 40:15-24) and leviathan (Job 41) are dinosaurs. Read about behemoth (colossal beast) again with a rhinoceros in mind. He is herbivorous. He MOVETH his tail AS a cedar. His nose pierceth through snares. Doesn't he have a horn or two on his nose?

Leviathan seems to be a symbolic representation of Satan as a great dragon (as in Rev. 12:3,4). Look at 4: "Will he make a covenant with thee?" Satan will give the Beast his power, and the Beast will confirm the covenant of Dan. 9:27. The one that will end up being the Satan-possessed False Prophet also confirms the covenant. Verse 15: "His scales are his pride" fits Satan. Turn it around. It would say that his pride is his scales. Verse 24: "His heart is a firm as a stone" fits Satan. Verses 33 and 34 fit Satan. They say, " Upon earth there is not his like, who is made without fear. He beholdeth all high things (in the heavens): he is a king over all the children of pride."

Contrast this with the symbolic description of Christ in Song of Sol. 5:10-15. It says, " My beloved is white and ruddy, the chiefest among ten thousand. His head is as the most fine gold (symbol of deity), his locks are bushy, and black as a raven (he's a Jew). His eyes are as the eyes of doves (symbol of the Holy Spirit) by the rivers of waters, washed with milk, and fitly set. His cheeks are as a bed of spices, as sweet flowers: his lips like lilies, dropping sweet smelling myrrh (which has to be bruised to bring forth its fragrance). His hands are as gold rings set with the beryl: his belly is as bright ivory overlaid with sapphires (which means dear to the planet Saturn). His legs are as pillars of marble, set upon sockets of fine gold: his countenance is as Lebanon (which means white), excellent as the cedars (that have fragrant wood). His mouth is most sweet: yea, he is altogether lovely. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem." Agape

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Re: Spaceflight Now Breaking News Report Water found on Mars
Water found on Mars, BY SPACEFLIGHT NOW. 6-21-00

Confirming what scientists had long theorized, NASA is expected to announce next week that water has been found on Mars. The discovery, if true, would have profound implications about whether there is or was life on the Red Planet.

The Mars Global Surveyor spacecraft currently orbiting the planet made the detection, according to a BBC news report today....

Rumors about the discovery were initially reported by the NASA Watch Web site earlier this week, which said the White House had been briefed on a major finding by MGS. The site later reported a paper was being prepared for the upcoming issue of the journal Science.

My reply

Thanks. I thought with all those water-cut valleys, there probably would be water somewhere, even though most of it was blasted off when Rahab split apart. Agape

Incoming email

Re: Eta Carinae
I read this today in the June newsletter of Bob Wadsworth's Biblical Astronomy website: "The star Eta Carinae, which is in the rear section of the constellation Argo (the ship or company of travellers), is expected to go supernova in the near future and may become bright enough to be seen in the daytime. The location of this star in the ship is actually in the poop deck.

I received some very interesting insight on this through a telephone conversation with ---- of ---. --- related to me that the poop deck was where the captains of ancient and not so ancient ships stood to direct the crew and oversee the voyage. From that vantage point, the captain could see everything in front of him, including the direction the ship was heading. The captain of the fabled Argo was Jason (the Graeco-Hebrew equivalent of Joshua or Jesus). It is Jesus who is the Captain of our salvation and our ship. When the star goes supernova, it will outshine millions of suns."

More signs, Marilyn. And today, it was announced that NASA has found evidence of water on Mars, an indication that life existed there.

Marilyn, you mentioned that Eta Carinae reminds you of a wedding reception decoration. Maybe this decoration is getting ready to "pop" in celebration of the event. Love

My reply

Thanks. I just got the notice about the water on Mars. Love that news.

> > "The star Eta Carinae, which is in the rear section of the constellation Argo (the ship or company of travelers), is expected to go supernova in the near future and may become bright enough to be seen in the daytime. The location of this star in the ship is actually in the poop deck.

That's strange, coming from someone as knowledgeable as Bob. I have The Star Guide, by Robin Kerrod. It has "Carina, the Keel" and "Puppis, the Poop" both listed. Under "Carina, the Keel," it says, "Eta is one of the more interesting stars...It is embedded in one of the most glorious nebulae in the heavens, the Eta Carinai Nebula (NGC3372)." 3372 is definitely labeled in the diagram of the stars in Carina.

I think it is interesting that the so-called False Cross is in the ship ARGO. Kappa and Delta in VELA, the SAILS, along with Iota and Epsilon in CARINA, the KEEL, form the cross.

One thing for sure, Eta Carinae is doing something extra ordinary. The change from the picture in The Star Guide to that in Discover, Jan. 2000, is astonishing. Discover said, "Eta Carinae may be the biggest, boldest, baddest star in the universe--100 times the heft of our sun." Agape

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