Using the rubric Peace, Security and Disarmament, the U.N. "reformers" want to establish a U.N. standing army under the command of the U.N. secretary-general, with the ultimate goal of disarming national armies. The U.N. reformers want to eradicate national sovereignty as a barrier to U.N. action and use the shibboleth "security of the people" to rationalize U.N. action inside sovereign countries (as in Kosovo)....(See the whole story).
My question is about the end of the church age. I was told that the church age and the dispensation of grace ends at the pre trib rapture of the chuch. Is this true? I read in P&C 573 a letter from someone or was it your reply to him who stated that the church age actually ends with the pre wrath rapture and the catching up of the 144,000. Could you clear this up for me with scripture to back this up?
I do not know if it was your reply or his statement. I do have a berean attitude about everything I read. You have cleared up many many stumbling blocks in scripture for me by my reading of your P&C's especially the Ten Virgins. The Holy spirit told me that my pastors interpretation was flawed. He said that the unwise virgins are Jews, and that Matt. Mark, luke ,and some of John were written to the Jews and do not apply to the church because the church was not formed yet. Which I know is false. I do not blame him because he went to Bible college and has been exposed to mans pre concieved notions that are taught in those places.
I ask this because I have sown many many seeds, but I can't seem to get any one to listen and get saved. Especially my family. They are all catholics. I am worried for their salvation. They are like most unbelievers who have to see it to believe it. I think that when millions of people disappear they will wake up, but there is going to be alot of deception in the world. I am leaving tons of info to help them understand what is going to happen.
They do believe that Jesus is their savior, but I don't know if that is going to save them. They do not have a personal relationship.
I have told them and others about the coming rapture, the OWG, the UR, antichrist ect. to no avail. Another question is if the seeds I have sown come to fruition during the first half of the trib will I recieve rewards for it? I know we recieve our rewards at the judgement seat which comes later. God bless you and may Jesus keep your heart.
> > church age actually ends with the pre wrath rapture and the catching up of the 144,000
That's correct. I think the Pre-Wrath Rapture is right after this age ends and the Millennium begins. It is between the breaking of the 6th and 7th seals. I think the 5 wise Philadelphian virgins are caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture before the 1st seal breaks and the 5 foolish Laodicean virgins are caught up in the Pre-Wrath Rapture after the 6th seal breaks.
At the 1st Rapture, Christ comes in the air and with a voice like a trumpet, shouts, "Come up hither" (Rev. 4:1) (I Thess. 4:13-18). At the 2nd Rapture, he sends his angels to do the gathering.
Mt. 13:38-42 says, "The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world (aion, age); and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world (aion, age). The Son of man shall send forth his ANGELS, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."
Mk. 13:27 says, "And then shall he send his ANGELS, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the EARTH (the Pre-Wrath Rapture) to the uttermost part of heaven" (to gather those caught up to Heaven in the Pre-Trib Rapture to the "general assembly" (Heb. 12:23) when the Judgment Seat of Christ is ready to convene in Heaven on the 1st day of the Millennium.
The 1st Rapture is as the days of Noah (Mt. 24:37-41; Lu. 17:26,27). No fire fell, only water, the symbol of the Spirit of Christ. The 2nd Rapture is as the days of Lot. "But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed" (the Sign of the Son of Man, Mt. 24:30; Rev. 6:14f).
There are three 2000-year ages, Age of the Gentiles, Age of the Jews, and Age of the Church. Just as the Age of the Jews has the 70th week of Daniel tacked on at the end of this age, I think all 3 ages have this same trial that is to come upon the whole world tacked on. I expect them to all end in a photo-finish as the Millennium begins.
Those that are already wearing spiritual white robes of righteousness will be caught up at the first trump, in the Pre-Trib Rapture. I Thess. 4:16,17 says, "For THE LORD HIMSELF shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."
Those foolish Laodicean virgins will wash their robes in the blood of Christ (i.e., use I Jn. 1:9 and confess their sins so the Lord can cleanse them of all unrighteousness). Then they will be caught up at the last trump, in the Pre-Wrath Rapture. I Cor. 15:52 says, "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the LAST TRUMP: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."
> > my pastor...said that the unwise virgins are Jews, and that Matt. Mark, luke ,and some of John were written to the Jews and do not apply to the church
II Tim. 3:16 says, "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."
> > They do believe that Jesus is their savior, but I don't know if that is going to save them. They do not have a personal relationship.
The Lord knows his own. If they truly have accepted Christ as their own personal Saviour and are not just trusting church membership to get them into Heaven, they will make it at one Rapture or the other.
> > if the seeds I have sown come to fruition during the first half of the trib will I recieve rewards for it?
Yes. Even if the sown seeds do not bear fruit, you will have your reward for sowing them. Agape
I want to tell you how much your exposition on the names of God in Pro and Con 576 meant to me. Thank you for sharing your understanding with all of us...you are a blessing to me. I flew up to Kitchener, Ontario, on Wednesday, to hear Gershon Salomon, leader of the Temple Mount and Land of Israel Faithful, speak about Jerusalem and their efforts to build the third temple. This was the second time I had met him, as he was in Kitchener last year also. We spoke later, as I wanted to ask him about the tribal identities of present-day Jews living in Israel. He said that most are of the tribe Judah and Benjamin. Gershon believes that the fulfillment of all end-time prophecies (Old Testament, as he is an orthodox Jew), is very, very near. He is a very special man. I wonder if he will be one of those who asks Jesus about the wounds in His hands.
I pray you are in good health, and Ed, and your family. Every passing day brings increasing hope and joy. Much love
Of the ship ARGO (THE COMPANY OF TRAVELERS), VELA is the sail, PUPPIS the poop-deck, and CARINA the keel. This is the ship that represents those that are IN CHRIST. A representation of his face is at the water line and above is the lion's-head on the prow.
We have had the new star, Nova Velorum (5-22-99, Sivan 7, Pentecost), and the Anchor Cross in the sail (6-9-00), Eta Carinae in the keel, now (I see) this beautiful "Q" supernova in the poop-deck (publ. 12-9-99). It probably stands for Queen, since the Bride of Christ is represented as being in this ship. Over and over, our attention is drawn to this ship that, like Noah's Ark, represents Christ our Saviour. We must stay in the ship until it docks, and it is already backing into the harbor with its sail reefed. Maranatha.
Note: On the Astronomy Picture of the Day site, I saw another meaning for Vela besides the sails. It said that from the Spanish verb velar, it would mean TO WATCH. That's what Jesus said to do. We're watching. There are some man-made satellites out there. They are THE WATCHERS.
There were seven feasts given by the Lord and of those four were referenced to by Lord Jesus. The fifth feast would be Rosh Hashanah, which in all probability was the birth of Jesus. For Him to return 6000 years after He was born, at Rosh Hashanah, would culminate a lot of prophecy.
Yet Rosh Hashanah is a two day event and the exact time of the resurrection will never be known, as God says. But we know that he will be here soon and I really care not when. The resurrection could even occur this year at Rosh Hashanah.
If I'm incorrect, who cares. Let us both continue to study and receive God's blessings. Thank you
> > The fifth feast would be Rosh Hashanah, which in all probability was the birth of Jesus. For Him to return 6000 years after He was born, at Rosh Hashanah, would culminate a lot of prophecy. Yet Rosh Hashanah is a two day event
I know you didn't mean 6000 years since the birth of Jesus. That would take us back to when Adam was cast out of the Garden of Eden. You meant 2000 years.
The Feast of Trumpets/Rosh HaShanah is, in my eyes, the date of Jesus' birth. It was not set up as a 2-day feast, so we don't have to worry about that one. Lev. 23:24 says, "In the seventh month, in the first day of the month (Tishri 1), shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation."
De. 11:14 says, "I will give you the rain of your land in HIS DUE SEASON, the FIRST RAIN and the LATTER RAIN." Job 37:6 follows along. It says, he saith to the snow, Be thou on the earth; likewise to the small rain, and to THE GREAT RAIN OF HIS STRENGTH." The small rain is the former rain in the autumn. The great rain is the latter rain in the spring.
Hos. 6:3 says, " the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and HE SHALL COME UNTO US AS THE RAIN, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." The former rain starts Tishri 1 (1st day of the Jewish Civil Year), and the latter rain starts Nisan 1 (1st day of the Regnal and Sacred Year). I think the First Advent was on Tishri 1 in BC 5, and the Second Advent will be on Nisan 1 in 2008 AD.
Eze. 29:17 sets the day, Nisan 1. It says, "in the first month, in the first day of the month." Then v. 21 says, " In that day will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (the Word, the Logos) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."
I think the Pre-Wrath Rapture is on Tishri 1, the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. It would be neat if the Pre-Trib Rapture was on Tishri 1, too, but I just can't think that it really will be. Song of Sol. 2:10-14 sounds like it is spring or summer. So does the fig tree parable in Mt. 24:32-34.
Song of Sol. 2:10,11 says, " My beloved spake, and said unto me, Rise up, my love, my fair one, and come away. For, lo, the winter is past, the rain is over and gone." In Israel, it doesn't rain past Nisan or before Tishri. The only major feast that falls in that no-rain time is Pentecost.
I think next Pentecost/Feast of Weeks begins the 70th week of Daniel. Rev. 17:14 mentions those that are with Christ "are called, and chosen, and faithful," so the Pre-Trib Rapture has taken place. However, at that time, v. 12 says that the 10 kings "have received no kingdom as yet." Therefore, there must be some gap between the Rapture and the beginning of the Tribulation. All 10 kings are crowned as the 1st 1260 days of the Tribulation begins in Rev. 13:1.
To me, between now and Tishri 1, 5761 (Sept. 30, 2000) seems possible. Also, between Iyar 1, and Sivan 5, 5761 (Apr. 24 and May 27) seems possible. One other thing makes between now and Sept. 13, 2000 the most likely. If the signing of the Oslo Accords on Sept. 13, 1993 was the beginning of the 7 good years, they would be up Sept. 13, 2000. We are wheat, and Joseph took up 1/5th of the grain in the 7 good years. We don't have long to wait to find out. Oh, I almost forgot an interesting coincidence. Sept. 13, 2000, is the Harvest Moon. Keep watching. Agape
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The disciples seem to be part of the Bride group. Mt. 9:14,15 says, "Then came to him the disciples of John, saying, Why do we and the Pharisees fast oft, but thy disciples fast not? And Jesus said unto them, Can the children of the bridechamber mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them? but the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken from them, and then shall they fast. This would include the apostles that are 12 of the elders seen crowned in Heaven in Rev. 4 and 5.
I think they and the 12 patriarchs of Israel are the representatives of the saints that are caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture in Rev. 4:1. Rev. 5:8,9 says, "...odours, which are the prayers of saints. And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation." This group is seen in Heaven before the 1st seal is broken in Rev. 6 to kick off the Tribulation.
This group seems to be the same as the wise virgins in Mt. 25 and the Philadelphians of Rev. 3:7-13. When we accept Christ as our own personal Saviour, our "old sins" are purged (II Peter 1:9). The slate is wiped clean. We get a fresh start. We are counted as pure virgins. The wise ones have enough oil of the Holy Spirit to keep their lamps burning brightly no matter how long the Bridegroom tarries. They use I Jn. 1:9 when they sin, confess their known sins so the Lord can cleanse them of all unrighteousness. Thus, they stay in fellowship with our Holy God and walk in the light as he is in the light. The Philadelphians are not told to repent. They already have. They are the church of brotherly love, displaying the love of God and the bond of peace that is in them.
Some that are first will be last and some that are last will be first, so the Lord is fair. We will all get the rewards we deserve. However, the only Tribulation saints that I can be sure are added to the Bride group are the 144,000 Israelites that are caught up in the 2nd Rapture, the Pre-Wrath Rapture. They are with the group seen in Heaven between the breaking of the 6th and 7th seals in Rev. 7:9,14. It says, "a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes...These are they which came out of GREAT TRIBULATION, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." They are in Heaven by the time of the Judgment Seat of Christ.
Concerning just the 144,000, Rev. 14:4,5 says, "These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are VIRGINS. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the FIRSTFRUITS unto God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are WITHOUT FAULT before the throne of God." The 1st Rapture group sang the new song in Rev. 5:9. At the 2nd Rapture, the 144,000 also "sung as it were a new song before the throne...and NO MAN COULD LEARN THAT SONG BUT THE HUNDRED AND FORTY AND FOUR THOUSAND, which were redeemed from the earth." The rest of the Tribulation saints do not sing this song. It seems to belong to the Bride group. I Cor. 15:20-23 says, "now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept...in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order (tagmati, rank); Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming." Therefore, the The Firstfruit was Christ. He was the first rank of the First Resurrection, the resurrection of the entire Body of Christ. After Christ's resurrection, the rest of the firstfruits sheaf came out of their graves and appeared to many in Jerusalem (Mt. 28:51-53). I assume that they were the OT Bride group, and included the 12 patriarchs of Israel that are half of the elders of Rev. 4 and 5. It probably included Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Sarah, etc. as listed in Heb. 11. That was the 2nd rank in the First Resurrection. I think the wise Philadelphian virgins are the 3rd rank in the First Resurrection. They are caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture of Rev. 4:1. All raised so far seem to be part of the Bride group. All this Pre-Trib Rapture group sing the new song. The last rank of the Body of Christ to be born into Heaven will be the 144,000 "firstfruits" (Rev. 14:4) that will be added to the Bride group, plus all the rest of the Body of Christ. All believers must be in Heaven for the Judgment Seat of Christ by the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. Rev. 11:15-18 says, "the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, Saying, We give thee thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come (this is the Feast of Trumpets, Tishri 1, 7 Jewish months before the Second Advent on Nisan 1, Eze. 39:12, Eze. 29:17,21; Hos. 6:3); because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned. And the nations were angry (Gog's army is attacking Israel, Eze. 38), and thy wrath is come (to stop Gog's army, Eze. 38:18,19), and the time of the dead, that they should be JUDGED (the Judgment Seat of Christ), and that thou shouldest give REWARD unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, SMALL AND GREAT; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth." Therefore, I think the Bride group started to be resurrected in 30 AD. The next rank of this First Resurrection is the Bride group that will participate in the Pre-Trib Rapture. The last rank of the First Resurrection includes the 144,000 that will be added to the Bride group, plus all the rest of the Body of Christ that participate in the Pre-Wrath Rapture on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. Mk 13:27 says, "And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the EARTH (the Pre-Wrath Rapture) to the uttermost part of heaven" (those caught up in the Pre-Trib Rapture). These are gathered in the heavenly Jerusalem to the "general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the JUDGE of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant" (Heb. 12:22-24). The 1st Rapture is as the days of Noah. No fire fell. The 2nd Rapture is as the days of Lot. "But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all" (Lu. 17:28). The 1st Rapture is the first trump of God of I Thess. 4:13-18. The 2nd Rapture is the "last trump" of God of I Cor. 15:51,52. At that time, the whole Body of Christ seems to be made immortal (v. 53). The "resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption" (I Cor. 15:42). Then after the whole Body of Christ is in Heaven, all are made immortal. What is ours by promise now will be ours in actuality that day. Agape Note: II Cor. 11:2 says of the Bride of Christ, "I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste VIRGIN to Christ." Joel 2:16 says of the day of the 2nd Rapture, "Gather the people, sanctify the congregation, assemble the elders, gather the children, and those that suck the breasts: let the bridegroom go forth of his chamber, and the bride out of her closet."
Clue: Here it is the sixth month of the Jewish calendar - Adar (February/March)....
***From Marilyn: Verses 24 and 36 show that this means the 6th mo. of Elizabeth's pregnancy, not the calendar month.
Luke 1:36 "And, behold, thy cousin Elisabeth, she hath also conceived a son in her old age: and this is the sixth month with her, who was called barren."
Clue: John is conceived first week in Elul - (August/September). How do I know this? Scripture. John's parents were Levites (of the house of Aaron - priests). In Luke 1:5 John's father Zacharias, was executing his office of the lot Abia (Greek for Abijah). So what is Abijah? Well King David made a division of the Levite priests into 24. 1 Chronicles 24:10 (also Luke 1:9) says that Abijah's lot was the eighth. What this meant was that for two weeks one priest would execute the duties of his office....
***They served 1 week at a time, 2 times a year. However, you have to allow for the feasts when all served.
Jesus' birthday. I believe it was 15 Tishri 3755 (8 October 7 BC)....
***I think it was Tishri 1 in 5 BC. Hos. 6:3 shows that he will come unto us as the rain, the former and the latter rain. The former rain starts Tishri 1, the latter rain Nisan 1. I think those are the dates of the 2 Advents. The 2nd Advent on Nisan 1 is indicated in Eze. 29:17: "in the first month, in the first day of the month." Then v. 21 says, "In that day will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (the Word, the Logos) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."...
John 19:31-37 "The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.
***The PREPARATION of the PASSOVER was Thursday, Nisan 13 in 30 AD. I think that was Crucifixion Day. Friday was Nisan 14, Passover, an high day....
Cyrus was so moved that he made the decree in 539 B.C.
***Martin Anstey, author of The Romance of Bible Chronology, found an 82 year mistake in the era of the Persian kings. This year should be 454 BC. 483 - 454 + 1 (no zero yr) = 30 AD. Agape
The Beast and False Prophet are both revealed when they confirm the covenant as the Tribulation begins. We should be gone before that. The treaty may already be signed, but it has to be confirmed by the right two men, the Beast and False Prophet (Dan. 9:27). Agape
1) The 7 year Oslo Accords are THE covenant that is confirmed, but NOT the 70th week of Daniel.
2) The 70th week of Daniel starts at one of the "confirmings" of Oslo.
3) The rapture spares us from the wrath of God, but the wrath of God does not coincide with the 70th week (think about this!). For instance, the first 5 seals of Revelation are all MAN made events. Not until the later part do we see God's intervention and judgments.
Having said all this, here is the real food for thought to back it up:
1) "the many" of Dan. 9:26 can be translated as "Rabim" (Yikzak Rabim?)
2) There are at least 4 individuals whose gematria = 666 who have had their hand in the confirmations of Oslo.
3) Oslo has been confirmed on a minimum of 6 different occasions.
4) One of the individuals doing the confirming has a gematria of 666.
5) The confirmings of Oslo at both Wye on Oct.23, 1998 and Oslo itself on Nov.2, 1999 are almost exactly 2520 days from Yom Kippur 2005 and Rosh HaShanah 2006, respectively.
Time will tell... "we all see dimly as in a mirror" Aug 28 - Sept. 13 will see some real bad fireworks in any event. Shalom
The 70th week of Daniel starts when the covenant is confirmed by the Beast and False Prophet as the 1st seal is broken. The wrath of God is after the 7th seal is broken. Rev. 6:17 says, "For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? It is 6 PM on the 1st day of the millennial Day of the Lord. The asteroids seen in Rev. 8:8,10 impact Earth at noon that day (Zeph. 2:4,5).
I think the Final Status Peace Covenant will be signed, then later be confirmed by the Beast and False Prophet on the 1st day of the Tribulation. Agape
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