Pro and Con 613

Posted 10-14-00

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From Jean Kincaid:
Thanks for posting Cindy's note to Jim Bramlett which appeared on the 5 Doves' site. I know and am deeply grateful that so many devoted Christians have been praying for me. Those prayers have not gone unanswered. Just during the past few weeks I've received definite miracles. I was told in August that I needed a kidney and pancreatic transplant and needed to start dialysis immediately. I told my doctor that I'd never become a transplant patient and would not either start dialysis, that I was ready to go home if that was what the Lord wanted. Otherwise I expected Him to heal me.

Shortly afterward I was in an evangelistic meeting and the preacher pointed directly at me. He said, "A lady back three is receiving a new left kidney from the Lord"

I immediately believed that he was pointing at me and by faith accepted the new kidney. Within days the terrible swelling was leaving my body and I felt ever so much better. However, the pancreas was functioning even worse and I began subsisting on orange juice, rice, mashed potatoes, and pre-digested protein powder. No fats, no milk, no bread, no other vegetables. It was a grim diet and I lost a great deal of weight, was extremely weak and was in constant pain. If I ate more the pain increased.

After Jim Bramlett received Cindy's note he got my phone number and called me at home. He told me that the Lord had been impressing him with James 5:15"...and the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed any sins the Lord will forgive him."

Jim said that he felt that someone needed to pray the prayer of faith for me, which he proceeded to do. I agreed with him that I would just rest in the Lord, in faith believing for the Lord to bring about His promise to heal at our request. Certainly there were so many others who were also agreeing for my healing.

I am pleased to report that the pain began to leave my body right away, and I have been able to tolerate many foods that just a couple of days earlier had made me feel ghastly ill. The fact that most of the weakness and pain has left is a wonderful feeling. I know that you understand this since you have suffered so with pain. What a blessed relief not to have pain constantly nagging at you, as you well know.

I used to have so little sympathy for patients who constantly begged for "pain pills" unless I had seen the image of a tumor via ex-ray or cat scan. I was beginning to suspect that the pain that I was feeling must be emanating from a tumor pressing on a nerve. I was going to have a cat scan next week but now probably won't bother since that specific pain is gone, praise God.

Thanks again for your prayers. It is wonderful to believe that I'll be able to do some other small thing in the service of our King of kings. With love, Jean

My reply

Praise the Lord. I am so glad you are feeling better. I have been praying for you ever since your heart attack. About the last time I heard from you, your treadmill test was not good. As I didn't hear anything after that, I was afraid you had another problem with your heart. All I could do was to just keep praying for you. The Lord could do what I couldn't about your vision?

Her reply

My vision is very much better than previously since it was 20/800, legal blindness, in May. After laser surgery on both eyes it is considerably better and I was able to get my drivers' license renewed, although restricted to daylight hours. I'm believing for total healing in the eyes also since reading and driving are so very important today. I've learned to appreciate the great good health I've enjoyed for most of my life, thanks to God's goodness.

Hope all is going well with you and Ed. With love, Jean

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This is really for Joshua's sake. God already knows your heart Joshua and he knows that you are believing in him! I believe God is talking to you and asking you to accept Jesus as your saviour so you WILL NOT be here during that horrible time. God wants to save his people FROM wrath he does not want you in it. If he did, he would not have sent Jesus to offer his salvation.

Please listen to God Joshua! Please accept Jesus as your personal saviour!

Check out this web page too is a cool web site on the prophecies that have already happened and what is to come backed up by biblical scripture and after that turn on the news and see whats going on in the world right now as we speak...In the Bible is says that Jerusalem will be a burdensome stone and look what is going on right now with every one talking about what they should do with Jerusalem.

You might want to check out this web page as well:
This one brings forth some interesting proof of the Bible being the inspiration of God with proof. Check them out! I pray that we will be sitting with you at the feast in Heaven right after the rapture! May God Bless you!

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Re: Thanks, and I had a preposition to make. Thanks Agee. I went to church and pray through yesterday.

He show me this two message, Acts 1:4-8 and 2 Chronicles 20:1-30. Seems to me, I will be left behind to serve a purpose.

I would be interested to help you maintain this web site, I am a webmaster(one never design any homepage). I am currently studying internet stuff for a diploma. I feel that I can help you to gatekeep this website til the pre-wrath rapture.

There is another feeling I got from yesterday prayer. He have not fully fufilled the parable of the Fig Tree and have not yet start fufiling the parables of the ten virgins. It may be next year. Please reply.

My reply

I don't think God intends for you to be left behind. Otherwise, Jesus would not have said, "Watch ye therefore, and PRAY ALWAYS, THAT YE MAY BE ACCOUNTED WORTHY TO ESCAPE all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man" (Lu. 21:36). I think we should obey the Lord and not plan to stay here. You may never get another chance to be part of the Bride of Christ, only the remainder of the Body of Christ. Eternity is a long time to be sorry of the choices we make. God has made provision for his witnesses during the Tribulation. Leave that in his capable hands.

Thanks for your kind offer to help me with my web site. Right now, I'm able to do it by myself. I'll keep your offer as a safety net in case I get stuck.

In the Parable of the Fig Tree, Israel putting forth leaves was fulfilled in the Six-Day War of 1967. At that point, we were to know that the Rapture was near. The parable of the 10 virgins will be fulfilled at the Rapture. Agape

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The Moslem "claim" to Jerusalem is based on what is written in the Koran, which although Jerusalem is not mentioned even once, nevertheless talks (in Sura 17:1) of the "Furthest Mosque": "Glory be unto Allah who did take his servant for a journey at night from the Sacred Mosque to the Furthest Mosque." But is there any foundation to the Moslem argument that this "Furthest Mosque" (Al-Masujidi al-Aqtza) refers to what is today called the Aksa Mosque in Jerusalem? The answer is, none whatsoever.

In the days of Mohammed, who died in 632 of the Common Era, Jerusalem was a Christian city within the Byzantine Empire. Jerusalem was captured by Khalif Omar only in 638, six years after Mohammed's death. Throughout all this time there were only churches in Jerusalem, and a church stood on the Temple Mount, called the Church of Saint Mary of Justinian, built in the Byzantine architectural style.

The Aksa Mosque was built 20 years after the Dome of the Rock, which was built in 691-692 by Khalif Abd El Malik. The name "Omar Mosque" is therefore false. In or around 711, or about 80 years after Mohammed died, Malik's son, Abd El-Wahd - who ruled from 705-715 - reconstructed the Christian- Byzantine Church of St. Mary and converted it into a mosque. He left the structure as it was, a typical Byzantine "basilica" structure with a row of pillars on either side of the rectangular "ship" in the center. All he added was an onion-like dome on top of the building to make it look like a mosque. He then named it El-Aksa, so it would sound like the one mentioned in the Koran.

Therefore it is crystal clear that Mohammed could never have had this mosque in mind when he compiled the Koran, since it did not exist for another three generations after his death. Rather, as many scholars long ago established, it is logical that Mohammed intended the mosque in Mecca as the "Sacred Mosque," and the mosque in Medina as the "Furthest Mosque." So much for the Moslem claim based on the Aksa Mosque.

With this understood, it is no wonder that Mohammed issued a strict prohibition against facing Jerusalem in prayer, a practice that had been tolerated only for some months in order to lure Jews to convert to Islam. When that effort failed, Mohammed put an abrupt stop to it on February 12, 624. Jerusalem simply never held any sanctity for the Moslems themselves, but only for the Jews in their domain.

My comment

King David bought the "threshingfloor of Araunah (or Ornan) the Jebusite," II Sam. 24:18-25. I Chron. 21: says, "David gave to Ornan for the place six hundred shekels of gold by weight." It belongs to Israel.

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Re: Question on Zechariah 14.
I have a question about part of Zechariah 14. There is no doubt that the first 3 verses refer to the day of the Lord, 7 months before the second advent. They read . . .
Zechariah 14:1 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city. Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle.

Now the next verse has always been interpreted as the second advent when Jesus sets his feet on the Mount of Olives. Verse 4 reads...And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

So evidently if traditional interpretations are correct, there is an immediate jump of 7 months in time in the scene from verse 3 to 4. Verse 5 is what somewhat puzzles me. It says...And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.

It seems like that would fit better with the first 3 verses. I can see God telling Israel to flee to the valley of the mountains before the wrath of God on the day of the Lord, but although I guess it could happen, I never pictured them having to flee when Jesus touches down at the advent. This is before Armageddon, so why would they be fleeing to the mountains? I know that verse 4 has been always taught as occuring on the day of the second advent? Is it possible that it could refer to the same day, the day of the Lord, that the 3 verses above refer to. That would make the references to fleeing to the mountains fit better. In addition the reference to a earthquake in both verse 4 and 5 matches the earthquake referred to in Revelation that happens on the day of the Lord. Also the phrase "that day" sometimes refers to the day of the Lord. I don't know, even though other scripture only seems to refer to the sign of the Son of man on the day of the Lord and doesn't specifically refer to him touching down on that day, what's to say that in rescuing Israel from the Gog Magog invasion that this verse couldn't indicate that he does. The big earthquake and the rift that results from his touch down on the Mount of Olives seems to fit pre wrath right before he stamps on the sea and land through the asteroids hitting, rather than after the wrath at the second advent. I thought he refurbishes the earth and the heavens, before He comes back with all of us to inhabit the earth. Jesus doesn't come back with us to a scorched mutilated planet does he? Why would he cause another major earthquake after He refurbishes the earth for our habitation. And if verse 4 is the second advent as everyone says, and we come with him, where do we touch down and why doesn't that verse mention us?

I know that the last part of verse 5 definitely shifts to the second advent starting with the conjunction "and" when it says...and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. We only come with Him at the second advent. But that could be connecting with the verses that follow, which are definitely also referring to the second advent at the end of the whole seven years.

I guess with the reference to the fleeing to the mountains and the earthquake and the fact that it mentions him intervening in Jerusalem, verses after it refers to the invasion of Jerusalem by Gog Magog on "that day", that, everything combined, I wondered if you ever considered that verse 4 was referring to one of the events of the day of the Lord rather than the second advent as is traditionally taught? Your Brother in Jesus

My reply

> > why would they be fleeing to the mountains?

I think the people on Earth at Jerusalem will flee from the face of the Lord to "the valley of the mountains" at the Second Advent because of fear when confronted with the reality that they did not want to believe for many years. I'll try to place this in the big picture as I see it.

Zech. 14:1 is talking about the millennial Day of the Lord that starts on Tishri 1, the Feast of Trumpets, when, in Heaven, Christ is given dominion, glory and a kingdom. Dan. 7:13,14 says, "I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of HEAVEN, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him DOMINION, and GLORY, and a KINGDOM, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed." Zech. 9:10 says, "his DOMINION shall be from sea even to sea, and from the river even to the ends of the earth." Jude 1:25 says, "To the only wise GOD OUR SAVIOUR, be glory and majesty, DOMINION and power, both now and ever."

All saints are gathered that day to the "general heaven" (Heb. 12:23). Those that were caught up in the 1st Rapture are gathered from one end of Heaven to the other. Those that are caught up in the 2nd Rapture are caught up from Earth (Mk, 13:27). On that same first day, at the Judgment Seat of Christ, he gives the saints in Heaven their rewards and the unbelievers on Earth their just rewards for their unbelief, the 7 trumpet judgments.

The remnant of Israel left on Earth will be saved in that day. Isa. 66:8 says, "shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children." Therefore, at this point, right after the 2nd Rapture, there are again both saved and unsaved on Earth. The remnant of Israel will live on into the Millennium on Earth.

Zech. 14 goes from the day of THICK DARKNESS (Joel 2:1-3), when the Lord will fight for Israel, in verse 3 to the day that is NOT DARK, the Second Advent, which is 7 months later(Eze. 39:12,13), in 5b-9. On the day of thick darkness, the Lord is made king in Heaven. At the Second Advent, "the LORD shall be king over all the earth."

On the day of thick darkness, there is a worldwide earthquake. Eze. 38:20 says, "all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence (paneh, face, i.e., the Sign of the Son of Man, Mt. 24:30; Rev. 6:14f), and the mountains (asteroids, Rev.8:8,10) shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground." Rev. 16:18 says, "there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." Isa. 24:1 says, "the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof." Isa. 34:8 says, " For it is the DAYof the LORD's vengeance, and the YEAR of recompences for the controversy of Zion."

The Jews in Israel bury the dead for 7 months, Tishri to Nisan in a Jewish Leap Year, to cleanse the Earth for the return of the Lord. Eze. 39:12,13 says, "seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land. Yea, all the people of the land shall bury them; and it shall be to them a renown the day that I shall be glorified (the Second Advent), saith the Lord GOD." Then, 7 months into the Year of Recompences for the controversy of Zion (Jerusalem), the Lord comes to Earth in glory.

At that time, Zech. 14:4,5 tells us what happens. "And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south. And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal (root of a mountain): yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD MY GOD SHALL COME, and all the saints with thee."

The people on Earth at Jerusalem will flee from the face of the Lord. The believers know that they did not believe until after the Wrath of God hit Earth, and that they should have believed before that. The unbelievers know that retribution is certainly due them, that pay-back time is coming.

This takes place in the spring. Zech. 14:8,9 says, "it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer (the upcoming season) and in winter shall it be. And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be ONE LORD, and his name one."

I expect that Eze. 45:18-22 will be fulfilled then. It says, "In the first month, in the first day of the month (Nisan 1), thou shalt take a young bullock without blemish, and CLEANSE THE SANCTUARY: And the priest shall take of the blood of the sin offering, and put it upon the posts of the house, and upon the four corners of the settle of the altar, and upon the posts of the gate of the inner court. And so thou shalt do the seventh day of the month for every one that erreth, and for him that is simple: so shall ye RECONCILE THE HOUSE. In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten. And upon that day shall the prince prepare for himself and for all the people of the land a bullock for a sin offering."

I think the full 2520-day Tribulation begins on the Feast of Weeks and ends with Nisan 15, the Feast of Unleavened Bread. The Judgment of the Nations will probably come on Nisan 16, The Feast of Firstfruits, Resurrection Day, the day that Christ triumphed over Satan in 30 AD.

Dominion will be taken away from Satan. The remnant of mankind will be judged as sheep and goats. Mt. 25:31-34,41 says, " When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world....Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." The sheep will live on into the Millennium on Earth.

Psa. 72:6-8,11 says, " He shall come down like rain (the latter rain, Hos. 6:3) upon the mown grass ('All flesh is grass,' Isa. 40:6): as showers that water the earth. In his days shall the righteous flourish; and abundance of peace so long as the moon endureth. He shall have DOMINION also from sea to sea, and from the river unto the ends of the earth....Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him." Psa. 145:13 says, "Thy kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and thy dominion endureth throughout all generations." Agape

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Better cosmic yardstick helps measure age, size of universe
Researchers using the testbed interferometer at Palomar Observatory have achieved the best-ever distance measurement to a type of star known as a Cepheid variable. The new results improve the "cosmic yardstick" used to infer the size and age of the universe.

In the September 28 issue of the British journal Nature, a group of astronomers from the California Institute of Technology, the Jet Propulsion Laboratory, and the Infrared Processing and Analysis Center announce that the distance to the star Zeta Geminorum in the Gemini constellation is 1,100 light years. The degree of accuracy in the measurement is about 13 percent, meaning that the star could be as close as 960 or as far away as 1,240 light-years. This represents an improvement of a factor of three over previous measurements.

The improvement is due to the use of the Palomar Testbed Interferometer, of which JPL engineer Mark Colavita is the principal investigator and codesigner....

Cepheid variables for several decades have been an important link in the chain of measurements that allow astronomers to estimate the distances to the farthest objects in the universe -- and ultimately, the overall size and expansion rate of the universe itself....

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Re: An amazing statement!
Greetings and agape from Texas! I have two sites I read every morning, Bill Koenig's World Watch Daily ( for world events fulfilling biblical prophecy - if you've never checked it out it the best site to see all the world events unfolding - and then I read yours for inspiration. I have been reading these two sites for over 2 years now and it's always so amazing to carry these thoughts through the day and pass them on to a nonbeliever whenever a window of opportunity opens.

Over the last few months there was a lot of talk about rainbows and now every time I see one my thought are of the covenant the Lord made with us and what the rainbow represents scriptural. I have the blessing where I work to play volleyball at lunch in a sand court our company's health center made for us and occasionally as I look up to follow the ball I'll notice a rainbow (or sung) around the sun. Yesterday I noticed a beautiful rainbow surrounding the sun and brought it to everyone's attention. One of the non-believing gentlemen in our group made the statement: "It looks like a big fish."

That statement struck my heart and brought to mind that maybe it was another sign from He that said He would make us fishers of men. Agape! In His glory and service, --- in Ft. Worth

My reply

Thanks for your kind words and interesting information. I have never seen a sun dog. Maybe it is because I don't look at the Sun. I don't want to be blind. Do you blank out the Sun with your hand when you look around it? Agape

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I had to write again because the Holy Spirit told me that I had assumed the rapture wold take place after the end of the Oslo Accord Agreement due to my excitement, but my error.

As in the day of Noah, The Holy Spirit is saying that the rain has started. According to the Word of God the rain lasted for 40 days & nights. I believe at some point within this 40 days the rapture will occur, otherwise we would perish in the flood waters of the tribulation that will soon start....

I believe things will escalate very soon in Israel and according to Ps 83, several countries, Eygpt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Palastine will perish by the hand of Israel. These countries are not listed in the Gog battle.Only then will Israel have all the land that the Lord gave her when she was formed, and only then will she be able to say Peace & Safety. Then the man of sin (antichrist) will confirm the covenant of death with Israel.

Shortly after this I believe the Gog battle will start, due mostly to revenge for what Israel has done to their brother muslims & the hook in the jaw for Russia. It will be devastating to several nations, including America. But it will be by the hand of God in judgement.

We must continue to watch for the Lord & continue to keep our robes clean, Be ye holy as I am Holy says the Lord.

May the Lord continue to bless you, you have been faithful in striving to run the race & win the crown that he has for all of us who do so, may we all make it to the finish line. God Bless

My reply

> > the rain has started.

Why would the rain start before we enter the Ark and the Lord shuts the door?

> > I believe things will escalate very soon in Israel and according to Ps 83, several countries, Eygpt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Palastine will perish by the hand of Israel. These countries are not listed in the Gog battle.

In checking out Psa. 83, I noticed that v. 13 says, "O my God, make them like a wheel; as the stubble before the wind." I first thought that a wheel is an orbit of a planet in Eze. 1. Here it probably means a whirlwind. I was looking for Egypt, and it wasn't listed. Egypt is there when the asteroid impact hurts her so badly that no one can live there for the next 40 years. Eze. 29:10,11 says, " I will make the land of Egypt utterly waste and desolate, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. No foot of man shall pass through it, nor foot of beast shall pass through it, neither shall it be inhabited forty years."

I think "all nations" will attack Jerusalem just prior to the asteroid impacts of Rev. 8:8,10. Eze. 38:6 says, "and many people with thee." Verse 18 says, "at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that MY FURY shall come up in my face." Zech. 14:2 says, " I will gather ALL NATIONS against Jerusalem to battle." Isa. 34:2 says, " the indignation of the LORD is upon ALL NATIONS, and HIS FURY upon ALL THEIR ARMIES."

> > confirm the covenant of death with Israel. Shortly after this I believe the Gog battle will start

I believe it comes at the end of the 2300-day (Dan. 8:13,14) shortened Tribulation, when God's fury is unleashed on the Day of God's Wrath, and an asteroid (Rev. 8:8) impacts the Mediterranean Sea (Zeph. 2:4,5). Eze. 38:18-20 says, "it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that MY FURY shall come up in my face. For in my jealousy and in the fire of MY WRATH have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel; So that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake (the worldwide earthquake, Rev. 16:18) at my presence (paneh, face, i.e., the Sign of the Son of Man, Mt. 24:30), and the mountains (asteroids, Rev, 8:8,10) shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground."

> > may we all make it to the finish line.

Amen, and win the prize of being chosen to go with the Bridegroom in the Pre-Trib Rapture, when he says, "Come up hither." "I press toward the mark for the prize of the HIGH CALLING of God in Christ Jesus" (Phil. 3:14 ). Agape

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From Jim Bramlett: FWD from 5Doves site: Valerie Skrzyniak, 10-7-00
Just wanted to share with all of you and let all of you know, that I had a very strange but awesome experience last night.

It was just shortly after 12:00 a.m.,everyone in my family had gone to bed, and I was in the kitchen preparing lunches for the next day, when all of a sudden I heard these beautiful voices singing, at first it startled me. I thought maybe, the Televison or a radio was on, and I quickly checked it out, the T.V. was off and there wasn't any radio on. So I decided to sit down, prayed about it, and then I listened as the words came clearer and clearer. I thought to myself, it must be the Angels singing and the Saints of God joining in. They sang "How Great Thou Art". Then later on I heard them sing a phrase that I have never heard before as being a hymn I would recognize.


They sang it over and over again, and I joined in, I felt such great anointing come over me, such peace, such serenity, such oneness with the Lord. I spoke and said "Lord Jesus you are coming soon, even at the door, your holy ones are announcing your return."

I listened and went to bed and slept peacefully throughout the night, just knowing that God is still in control, and the His son our Savior is coming soon. Praise the Lord!


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