Pro and Con 67, Uploaded 2-17-98
Thank you for your wonderful books. They have stirred my pure mind so that the Holy Spirit can guide me in His word. I am a Bible teacher for a small church and have taught Revelations for some times. On Monday night i have a core group of Bible studiers and we have incorporated your book with our revelations study. Of course we started with the End of the Age. And maybe we will be finished by the Rapture. However, I have never seen such a change in personal spiritual growth as this little group. I personally have read your End of the Age 4 or five times and Heaven Found twice. At the present I am reading Revelation 2000. All total my husband and I have given away over 15 books of End of the Age and have purchased 8 Revelation 2000 books.
I enjoyed the picture of yourself and the testimony. God bless and thanks for your listening and doing what the Holy Spirit as has directed.
Thank you so much for all the longdays you put into responding to emails - not to mention your research. Especially when you have answered the same question 10,000 times. I appreciate your example too in patiently responding to the many self- rightous remarks that come your way. Whether everybody agrees with everything is immaterial - we are all brothers and sisters in Christ.
I would be grateful if you clarify the key question I have with the pre-trib rapture (that you must have addressed 10,000 times before!).
** What happens when the world wakes up and finds a few hundred million missing, from every part of the planet? **
This would surely be greatest event of all time to the secular world (the greatest will always be Jesus comings and goings). Of a magnitude that even the blindest would relate it to Christ because it will be obvious that all who went are Christians. Wouldnt everyone all then scurry after Christ during the Tribulation? If so, doesn't that violate God's basic gameplan that people must come to him because they love him, not because they are scared to death?
All the biblical indications seem to be that there will be no dead bodies lying around.
So how will the rest of the humanity possibly 1. explain it? 2. deal with it?
(Just as a matter of interest - the New Agers have been hotting up their own rapture scenario the last few years.... their "Celestine Prophecy" series that has sold millions ends up with their "elect" vibrating their way out of here, supposedly like the Mayans! Only problem with that will be that it will actually be the Christians that disappear.)
It is nice that someone appreciates the amount of time it takes. I don't get enough sleep and hardly watch TV at all. Ice skating will draw my attention, but not much else. I have had to go to the chiropractor many days since we got rearended in the car in September, much of the time once a day and at times even twice a day. I was just released this week. Now we go to the gym instead to build up my muscles to hold my back in place. I lost lots of muscle tone when I had pneumonia in late December and early January. Today, we used just about every machine we are supposed to, upper body and lower body.
> we are all brothers and sisters in Christ
That is my outlook. If we agree on the right things about Christ and his sacrifice for us, we can disagree on other things and still display Christian love for other cells in the Body of Christ. We are working for the same end, though our paths may differ. We are given different gifts and are different parts in the Body. Naturally, our functions are not all the same.
> ** What happens when the world wakes up and finds a few hundred million missing,
> from every part of the planet? **
So many think the Rapture will be secret. I don't. I think we will be seen going up and that probably those that see it will be given a double portion of the Holy Spirit as Elisha was when Elijah was taken up. We not only have Elijah as an example, but Jesus was seen ascending. In Rev. 11:12 the two witnesses are told, "Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and THEIR ENEMIES BEHELD THEM. Psa. 40:1-3 says, "I WAITED patiently for the LORD; and he inclined (bent down) unto me, and heard my cry. He brought me up also out of an horrible pit (as Jeremiah was taken up out of a pit), out of the miry clay (our bodies of clay), and set my feet upon a rock (Heaven), and established by goings. And the hath put a new song (sung after the Rapture in Revelation 5:9) in my mouth, even praise unto our God: MANY SHALL SEE IT, and fear, and shall trust in the LORD."
> it will be obvious that all who went are Christians. Wouldn't everyone all then
> scurry after Christ during the Tribulation?
You would think so, and there is "a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues" (Rev. 7:9) that will be saved during the Tribulation. However, the False Prophet will rise up, "whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a LIE: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness" (II Thess. 2:9-12). Therefore, not everyone will scurry after Christ after we are gone.
> doesn't that violate God's basic gameplan that people must come to him because
> they love him, not because they are scared to death?
Psa. 111:10 says, "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom." Job 28:28 says, "Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding." Psa. 19:9,11 says, "The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever: the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous...Moreover by them is thy servant warned." Psa. 2:11,12 says, "Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him."
Jude 21-23 says, "Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life. And of some have compassion, making a difference: And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh." You know, whatever it takes.
> All the biblical indications seem to be that there will be no dead bodies lying around.
I agree. As examples, we have Enoch, Elijah, and the two witnesses of Rev. 11.
> So how will the rest of the humanity possibly 1. explain it? 2. deal with it?
As for unbelievers, I expect Satanic forces will put forth a lot of cock and bull stories, but deal with it, they will, because they have no other choice. They can't do anything to reroll it, so life must go on.
For believers like the foolish virgins, they will get on the stick and wash their robes in the blood of Christ (Rev. 7:14). THEY WON'T GET LEFT BEHIND THE SECOND TIME. There are those caps again. Neither the shift key nor the caps lock key is down.
...the 4th Chapter of Song of Solomon finds the groom coming for the Bride and she is ready. Without spot or wrinkle. She has prepared herself as Rebeccah was ready, as Esther was ready. There is also the reference to the precious onitments and perfumes that are often referenced with Jesus. Then in verse 9, Jesus loves His Bride so much, She has ravaged His Heart.....I just love this word ravaged. The Lord has had this word resounding in my mind for weeks, that this word is a key. He takes The Bride out that very second, He sees her ready. With not a spot. Yes. Notice the reference to her looking for Him and running into the watchmen, The Bride is not hurt, but in the duplicate scenario that follows in chapters 5-8, the believers are sick with love and cannot find the groom. they also run into the watchmen but this time they are wounded and hurt(tribulation?). Oh my what wonderful stories and pictures Yahwee has created. In this short book there are proof of believers taken twice. Two raptures. One is for those who are Holy and in White garments without spotand wrinkle. Praise the Lord Jesus....just wanted to share our discussion with you. With great admiriation for your dedication and perserverance in publishing the Warnings and Reminders. Peace be unto you in Christ Jesus
So good to hear from you. Thanks for sharing.
Here is how Song of Solomon talks to me:
As the Song starts out, the Bride is talking. She says, "Let him kiss me" (1:2). Verse 3 says, "the virgins love thee." This suggests the five wise virgins who are the Bride for they go with the Bridegroom when he comes. This fits verse 4, which says, "Draw me, WE will run after thee."
As Chapter 2 starts out, the Bridegroom is speaking. He says, "As the lily among thorns, so is my love among the daughters" (2:2). This fits the wise virgins too. The Bride speaks again starting with 2:3. In verse 5, she says, "I am sick of love." This reminds us of the Philadelphians, who show love.
In 2:8, she hears his voice and says, "HE COMETH."
In Song 2:10-14, she tells us that he says, "RISE UP, my love, my fair one, and COME AWAY" (2:10). I think this is the first Rapture, and it is in the spring "For, lo, the winter is past, the rain (of Nisan) is over and gone; The flowers appear (April showers brings May flowers)...The fig tree putteth forth her green figs, and the vines with the tender grape give a good smell (it is the time of the firstripe grapes, end of May or beginning of June). Arise, my love, my fair one, and come away (the first Rapture). O my dove, that art in the clefts of the rock (in Christ), in the secret places of the stairs." Places is in italics and was not in the original. This is the secret of the stairs, like Jacob's ladder.
Look at 2:16,17: "My beloved is mine, and I am his: he feedeth among the lilies. UNTIL THE DAY BREAK, and the shadows flee away." I wonder if this could indicate that the gathering of the Bride of Christ takes from midnight to the break of day. Feeding seems to tie in with the Laodicean foolish virgins being spewed out of his mouth.
In 3:1, the foolish virgins seem to speak. "BY night on my bed I sought him whom my soul loveth: I sought him, but I found him not." Verse 2 emphasizes it, "I found him not." Then she found him, but is not yet caught up. Just before the Bride said, "he cometh," she said "stir not up, nor awake my love, till he please." Now, in 3:5, the Tribulation saints say exactly the same thing.
Then 3:11 says, "GO FORTH (Rapture II), O ye daughters of Zion, and behold king Solomon (type of Christ, the Son of David) with the crown wherewith his mother crowned him in the day of his espousals (Ampl: wedding, i.e., the Marriage of the Lamb).
Christ receives his golden crown on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. Sounds like Mary might place his crown on his head. Then the Marriage of the Lamb takes place. After that, the Tribulation saints are caught up just before the Judgment Seat of Christ takes place. All saints receive their rewards at that time.
Song 4:6-9 says, "UNTIL THE DAY BREAK, and the shadows flee away, I will get me to the mountain of myrrh, and to the hill of frankincense. Thou art all fair, my love; there is no spot in thee. COME WITH ME...Thou hast ravished my heart, my sister (i.e., Israel), my spouse." This sounds like the 144,000 Israelites.
In 5:1, the Bridegroom speaks: "I have drunk my wine with my milk." Jesus said he would not drink wine until he drank it anew with the apostles in his kingdom. Therefore, this sounds like he drank wine with them after the first Rapture at the Marriage of the Lamb. His first miracle, changing water to wine, was at the wedding at Cana of Galilee, which means circle and suggests the heavenly sphere.
Song 5:2-6 sounds like the ones who were left behind at the first Rapture: "I sleep, but my heart waketh: it is the voice of my beloved that knocketh, saying, Open to me...I have put off my coat; how shall I put it on?...I opened to my beloved; but my beloved had withdrawn himself, and was gone: my soul failed when he spake: I sought him, but I could not find him; I called him, but he gave me no answer."
In verse 9, the one left behind asks the Bride, "What is thy beloved more than another beloved, O thou fairest among women?"
The Bride answers in 10-16: "My beloved is white and ruddy, the chiefest among ten thousand. His head is as the most fine gold (deity), his locks are bushy, and black as a raven. His eyes are as the eyes of doves (symbol of the Holy Spirit)..."
In 6:1, the one left behind asks the Bride, "WHITHER is thy beloved gone, O thou fairest among women? whither is thy beloved turned aside? that WE may seek him with thee."
Then the Bridegroom speaks, "My dove, my undefiled is but one...the choice one of her that bare her...Who is she that looketh forth as the morning (from the "morning star" [Rev. 2:28]), fair as the moon, clear as the sun (Heaven is a sphere in this solar system "as the moon" [Psa. 89:37], "as the sun" [Psa. 89:36] and "like the earth" [Psa. 78:69]).
I love your web site and am planning to purchase all three books! I think you have done a great job on date setting Christ's return. However, I look forward to his return every day. I have read in the Bible that no one will come before the Lord without a gift. I am wondering what I will have to bring... What kind of gifts are required here?
Thanks for your kind remarks.
Re: gift. I looked in Strong's under "gift" and "gifts." Everything there seems to refer to God's gifts to us. The only scripture that comes to mind is Rom. 12:1, "I BESEECH you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service."
A friend had introduced me to your web site. I got the chills when I was reading what you had written about the coming of Jesus. Out of curiousity, when you talk about the year 2007, is that how you calculated when he shall return? I'm somewhat confused on this because I know no one knows the day or time, only he does.
I'm just very curious about the last days, the signs, and so forth. I know I shouldn't be scared, because I have accepted him as my Lord and Savior. I just fear for my young children who will have to go through the tribulations, and have no idea as to what is going on. Practically all my life, I've always wondered how the last days would be like, and how much suffering we will go through until its time to be with the Lord. I know the signs are already being seen around the world, and only get worse as each day goes by. With the floods, earthquakes, plane crashes, and etc. Its very much obvious that we are in our last days on earth. Should I fear? In my heart I know I shouldn't, but everything else in my body can't help but be terrified. Not just for myself, but for loved ones who don't take the rapture seriously. I tell you though, what makes me ache even more is when I picture the expressions on my baby's faces when the world is in chaos, when those around will be in panic, and things just won't be the same.
I ask that you give me some words of knowledge to help me understand more clearly on what exactly will take place during the rapture. I'm confused, and very interested in what you study. Thank you for taking this time, and I hope to hear from you soon. Please pray for me, and my loved ones. God bless.
Re: no man knows. Jesus is not just a man. He has two complete natures, man and God. He inherited his human nature from his mother. His deity was given by his Father (Isa. 9:6). As God, he knew. As man, he didn't.
The word "knoweth" in Mt. 24:36 is present tense. On that particular day, no man knew. The apostles were told, "It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power. But ye shall receive power (to know), AFTER that the Holy Ghost is come upon you" (Acts 1:7,8).
At Pentecost, they received the power to know, but were told to watch. What we were watching for turned out to be the Sign of the End of the Age, the Six-Day War of 1967, when the fig tree (Israel) grew four leaves (Sinai, West Bank, Gaza Strip and Golan Heights) and fulfilled the fig tree parable of Mt. 24:32-34. The generation born then would see "the sign of the Son of man in heaven," etc.
The fig tree parable says, "When his branch (modern Israel) is yet tender (apalos, young, i.e., 19, for they counted the males from 20 and up at the Exodus), and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh: So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it (the Rapture) is near, even at the doors (symbol of two Raptures). Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."
The year 1967 was the last year that modern Israel could be considered young; she was 19. The Six-Day War started June 5 and summer started June 21. One generation from 1967 is the end of the age. Here are the figures: 1948 + 19 = 1967 + 40 = 2007, the end of the age.
Here, I can't go into all the reasons to pick the dates I have picked; they are in my book Exit: 2007: The Secret of Secrets Revealed. A lot is on my Web page. However, I don't want you to think that 2007 is the Second Advent of Christ. It is not (according to what I understand).
He will return on Nisan 1, the "first month, in the first day of the month" (Ezek. 29:17) of the Jewish Sacred Year. Verse 21 says, "In that day will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (the Logos, the Word) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."
The Jewish Tishri 1, 5768 (our Sept. 13, 2007) is the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. It is the 2300th day (Dan. 8:14), by Jewish inclusive reckoning, from the Feast of Weeks that begins the Tribulation. The 2300th day is the Feast of Trumpets (Joel 2:1,2) and the Day of God's Wrath, the day the great mountain burning with fire is cast into the Mediterranean Sea and the great burning star (aster, asteroid) from heaven destroys Babylon on the Euphrates. Jesus cannot come that day for it is the day of "thick darkness." It is not dark on the day he returns in glory (Zech.14:6).
From that day, there are seven Jewish months (Ezek. 39:12) before Christ returns on Nisan 1, 5768, the beginning of the Jewish Regnal Year. There are normally 6 months between Tishri 1 and Nisan 1, but 5768 is a leap year, when the Jews insert an extra month. This seven month period drops the schedule into place on our calendar. The Jews only insert a 13th month about every three years. Nisan 1, 5768 is our April 6, 2008.
> I have accepted him as my Lord and Savior. I just fear for my young children
> who will have to go through the tribulations
DON'T PANIC! If you are "accounted worthy to escape all these things" (Lu. 21:36) and go in the Rapture, I am certain your young children will go with you. I have covered this in my recent Pro and Cons. Read them and you will find my reasons.
> Should I fear?
Absolutely not. The Rapture is our "blessed hope." Titus 2:13 says, "Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ."
Your main concern should be to be sure you are ready yourself. Be certain you have confessed all known sins since the time you accepted Christ so he can cleanse you of all unrighteousness (I John 1:9). Be filled with the Holy Spirit and you will be waiting as a wise virgin (Mt. 25:1-13) with enough oil to go with the Bridegroom when he comes for the Bride of Christ. This way, you and your small children will escape the Tribulation. You will only see the catastrophe with your eyes. You will be watching from Heaven. Psa. 91:8,9 says, "Only with thine eyes shalt thou behold and see the reward of the wicked. Because thou hast made the LORD, which is my refuge, even the most High, thy habitation."...
Thanks for your reply to my note on where is heaven. Unfortunately you totally ignored the two verses I presented to you to prove heaven is the Word, which is Christ, which is God. Do you have any alternative explanation for the comparison of those two verses? Or are you content to just ignore them?
You say the spirit that tells me these things is lying. Of course, the Pharisees said that Jesus had a devil and cast out devils by Beelzebub.
You said that I had better make room in heaven for a city. Have you ever read Galatians 4:24-26, in which Paul typifies the new covenant as "Jerusalem which is above"? If the heavenly Jerusalem is the new covenant, an "allegory" as Paul calls it in verse 24, why are you looking for a physical, visible, temporal city? Don't you know that faith is the "evidence of things not seen"? Yet you insist on seeing it with natural eyes, rather than spiritual eyes. Are you going to ignore Galatians 4:24-26 as well?
Finally, you ask if I am the only one saved since Adam. The answer to your question, like the answer to all your questions, is in the Scriptures, if you would just look. In 2 Peter 3:9 God says that he is "not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance". Now if it is God's will that none should perish, then none will perish, else God is a failure and a liar, and no God worthy of worship. Your problem in understanding this verse is you see "all men" as people, rather than the Scriptures, which for me has become a glorious, risen body in which all men have been saved.
I know you cannot receive this spiritual understanding just yet but I am hoping that come Pentecost 98 you will come to see you just may have been fooled by the letter of the Word, and begin to seek the spirit of the Word.
You said (in previous email):
> Luke 8:11 Now the parable is this. The SEED is the WORD of God.
> Matt 13:31 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying The kingdom
> of heaven is like to a grain of mustard SEED, ...
> Here Jesus spells it out to you, Marilyn. Can you see it? Heaven is like a
> seed, and the seed is the Word, ergo heaven is the Word.
In the parable in Luke 4-15, it is as if someone went about telling others about the gospel of Christ. Some of this seed takes root and some does not. One plants the seeds, explaining how Christ saves us, others water them and then someone else brings in the sheaves.
In the parable in Mt. 31,32, it is talking about a mustard seed's growth from a very small beginning to something huge. It shows how the kingdom of heaven grows from a small beginning to something very large.
Neither of these is talking about Heaven itself, the place Jesus went to in order to prepare a place for us.
> heaven is the Word, which is Christ, which is God
Sorry, but Heaven is not Christ, and Heaven is not God. Heaven did not creat man. God created man. There is one heck of a difference.
> Have you ever read Galatians 4:24-26, in which Paul typifies the new covenant as
> "Jerusalem which is above"? If the heavenly Jerusalem is the new covenant, an
> "allegory" as Paul calls it in verse 24, why are you looking for a physical,
> visible, temporal city?
This passage is to show, by an allegory, that law and grace cannot co-exist. Gal. 4:19-31 starts the section saying, "My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you...I stand in doubt of you. Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai (law), which gendereth to bondage...But Jerusalem which is above is free (as salvation by grace is a free gift)...Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise...So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman (i.e., the law), but of the free (grace)."
Here, New Jerusalem, which is the city in Heaven that Jesus is preparing for believers, is "free" because salvation by grace is a free gift. Heaven is a real place. Jesus will come at the Rapture and take believers to be there with him.
> In 2 Peter 3:9 God says that he is "not willing that any should perish, but that
> all should come to repentance". Now if it is God's will that none should perish,
> then none will perish, else God is a failure and a liar, and no God worthy of worship.
You forget that God gave us free will. We have to make the choice. That is our test. God does not want any to perish, but he will not force us. We can still choose to believe in Christ or not to believe in Christ. The wrath of God will fall on those unbelievers left on Earth as the Millennium begins. Rev. 11:18 says, "And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth."
> Your problem in understanding this verse is you see "all men" as people, rather
> than the Scriptures
First, you stated that the Scriptures are heaven. Now you say that the Scriptures are "all men." If A = B and B = C, then A = C. Thus you are actually saying that heaven is "all men." It doesn't make sense to me.
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