Pro and Con 68, Uploaded 2-25-98

Incoming Email in answer to previous email

> > She (her mother) says it will be on Thursday, April 9th.

> That is an important date all right. It is Nisan 13, the anniversary of the
> Crucifixion. Even the Thursday is right, but why on that date? According to Song of
> Solomon 2:10-14, the Rapture is at the time of the firstripe grapes, which is late
> May or early June. The only feast that fits that is Pentecost on May 31.

Thank you. I didn't know this day was a special day, that certainly makes things interesting. She doesn't believe rapture will take place that day. Just some extraordinary "signs of the times" storms.

Incoming Email

Reading your site gets my spirit very excited, especially with parts with the capital letters. Your loving answers to the confused folks writing to you are so filled with peace. What a fine example of a Christian you are. In the scriptures, two will be working side by side and one will be taken away, two will be sleeping side by side and one will be taken away, the ten virgins, five wise and five foolish. Do you think this is an indication that of all the people that profess Christianity, only 50% will be caught up at the rapture? May the good Lord give you the strength to continue reaching out into the electronic world. Bless you!

My reply

Thanks for such nice comments. You are appreciated.

I don't know about 50/50, wise and foolish. It may be, and it may not. Remember that Joseph TOOK UP 1/5th of the grain in the 7 good years. Maybe the number five is the connection. According to some, it is supposed to be the number of grace. However, It could mean division. In Lu. 12:51-53, Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather DIVISION: For from henceforth there shall be FIVE in one house divided, THREE AGAINST TWO, AND TWO AGAINST THREE."

When I wrote Exit: 2007, I thought maybe 1/5th would be taken up, but the 5 wise virgins and 5 foolish sure suggests the 50%. Another thing to consider is that there are seven church groups, and only Philadelphia has the open door before it. All I can be sure of is that there will be some left behind.

Thank you for your prayer. I hope there are lots of people out there praying for me and my family. When one tries to work for the Lord, the opposing forces always show their hand. We have to call on the Lord for his protection.

Incoming Email

Greetings from Oklahoma! I have always believed the Ez. 38 battle to be the beginning of the tribulation and a likely time for the rapture of the church. After researching your book "End of the Age" I find my spirit confirming that timeline. Jack Van Impe has long appeared to hold the mid-tribulation time period for the battle with the antichrist stepping in and claiming credit for the supernatural victory. Ez 38:23 states "Thus will I magnigy myself and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the Lord." This seems to leave no doubt as to whom credit is given. My questions are:

1. If the battle is at the end of the tribulation and part of the battle or battles of Armageddon, verse 38:11 describes a time of peace and unwalled cities. How can this be when all hell is literally breaking loose all over the world? Help!

2. Does the description of antichrist begin with Daniel 11:36? Dake's Bible indicates so.

3. What time frame in the tribulation is described in Daniel 11:40-45?

4. Since Syria is not mentioned in the lineup of Ez. 38, is Isaiah 17:1 to be fulfilled beforehand ..and if so could it be real soon..as in before the hoped for May 31st rapture?

Thanks for the upcoming help in advance. God Bless!

My reply

> 1. If the battle is at the end of the tribulation and part of the battle or battles of
> Armageddon, verse 38:11 describes a time of peace and unwalled cities. How can this be
> when all hell is literally breaking loose all over the world? Help!

This battle is on the 2300th day of the shortened Tribulation. The catastrophe of this day is not Armageddon. Christ must be on Earth before Satan's last ditch stand can take place.

This 2300th day is the Feast of Trumpets, the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord. Christ will not return for 7 more Jewish months (Ezek. 39:12). This Feast of Trumpets is the day the united nations army will attack Israel. They blow the alarm on the trumpets, and God comes to their aid. The "great mountain burning with fire" of Rev. 8:8 will hit the Mediterranean Sea at noon (Psa. 91:6; Zeph. 2:4,5)). Ezek. 38:20 shows what will happen: "the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the man that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence" (translated "sight" in Eze. 36:31; this is the Sign of the Son of Man).

This is Coronation Day in Heaven. Psa. 97:1-6 says, "THE LORD reigneth...righteousness and judgment are the habitation of his throne (the Judgment Seat of Christ takes place this day). A fire goeth BEFORE him, and burneth up his enemies round about. His lightnings enlightened the world: the earth SAW, and trembled. The hills melted like wax at the presence of the LORD, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth. The heavens declare his righteousness, and all the people SEE his glory." They see him in the heavens. This is not the day he sets his feet on the Mt. of Olives. This is a day of thick darkness (Joel 2:2), and it is not a dark day when he returns (Zech 14:6).

As for Israel thinking they are safe, the seven-year peace treaty is in effect.

> 2. Does the description of antichrist begin with Daniel 11:36?

Yes.

> 3. What time frame in the tribulation is described in Daniel 11:40-45?

Verse 40 says, "at the time of the end." Verse 45 say that the False Prophet "shall come to his end." Dan. 12 says, "there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time." It is the first day of the Millennium, the same day the northern army comes against Israel, the day of catastrophe.

> 4. Since Syria is not mentioned in the lineup of Ez. 38, is Isaiah 17:1 to be fulfilled
> beforehand..and if so could it be real soon..as in before the hoped for May 31st rapture?

No."Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap" the day of the catastrophe. The cities of the nations will fall (Rev. 16:19). Babylon will be destroyed in one hour (Rev. 18:21). "At that day shall a man LOOK to his Maker, and his EYES shall have respect to the Holy One of Israel....the harvest shall be a heap in the day of grief and of desperate sorrow...The NATIONS SHALL RUSH like the rushing of many waters: but God shall rebuke them, and they shall flee far off, and shall be chased as the chaff of the mountains before the wind, and like a rolling thing (the asteroid) before the whirlwind." (Isa. 17:7,11,13).

Incoming Email

Re: Is the first "rapture" a great annointing of the Spirit? ...had a few thoughts that I would be grateful for your comment on, should you be able to spare the time. We are all be deeply indebted to you for the patient and persevering commitment you make in responding to all our numerous incomings of every flavour. I don't take it for granted.

So I was thinking..... maybe there's a possibility that the first "rapture" could be something different from what we've come to expect here. God usually does seem to surprise us with all the tricks up His sleeve.... He certainly surprised the Jews with the nature of our Messiah. The problem then (as always) was that our expectations tend to be human-centric eg. looking for a warrior instead of a Lamb.

So.... what if instead of us (I pray that my own family makes the grade, this is definitely not an occasion to take his Grace for granted) vanishing the first time around and creating a theological hole for those left, He brings His Philadelphian elect a super-dose of the Holy Spirit, pre-Tribulation? What if he douses us all with an Upper Room or Road to Damascus experience instead? Tongues of fire and violent wind? Blinding light ... and Insight?

It gives "He will pour out His Spirit in the last days, young men will see visions, old men will dream dreams" a new dimension? Perhaps all the Revival around today is just the warm up for the big one? Who knows, maybe He'd even go as far as turning us into third Adam's? (Or - not to be forgotton - second Eve's - just in case my wife ever reads this!) The symbolic significance of your Pentecost anniversary date is not coincidental under this scenario either.


Perhaps that is our "first door"? A similar experience perhaps to John being taken up and given the grand tour through the open door in Rev 4?

Yes, He promises to deliver his Philadelphians: "I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on earth" (Rev 3:10). But He might still keep us hanging around here - maybe just exempt us from the suffering. There is a good precedent; Exodus of the first Passover (Ex 12:22-24).

Recall the blood of the Lamb around the **door** frame? Will we, the elect, be marked like the Passover faithful by the blood of the Lamb sprinkled around our spiritual doors. And somehow be personally spared from the horrors all around us? By the way, can I suspect there were probably "Laodician" Jews at that first Passover who thought "get real, this blood on the door frame business is only for the fanatics", and maybe even mocked the faithful? If so, they wouldn't have been so confident about that the next morning..... "And all the Egyptians got up during the night and there was loud wailing in Egypt, for there was not a house without someone dead" (v30).

I also note that the Passover angel of death began at midnight ..... coincidentally(?) many of the Luke and Mathew parables are hot on midnight thieves and various nasty happenings around the changeover from the second to the third Watch. Is there an end time meaning to "Obey these instructions as a lasting ordinance for you and your descendants"..... ie. keeping the spiritual blood sprinkled around our door. The passover doors were closed. In this case, does he come knocking at midnight and we open them to find our Saviour's annointing?

Us still being around would be another reason for Him to "shorten the days for the sake of the elect". Then He zaps us all after the sixth seal - the final Rapture?

Well, thats enough for now. I confess much is speculative ... when I read Mathew 25, it doesn't all seem to fit...... I plead the theological Fifth Amendment now. Just one beggar looking for a feed. Remember my Bible study comes from the train, which is where I'm heading right now!...

1. "This generation" can mean "within the lifetime off those alive at the time"? So assuming those born in Israel in 1967 can last for say 100-110 years, is there the possibility of the doors opening up until 2067 or even 2077. That would allow time for another 50 year Jubilee in 2048..... Or, as I suspect, is that just wishful thinking?

2. Very random thought - Jesus was around for just over 3 years after his annointing in the Jordan. Any analogy with the elect being around through the Trib in full Spirit with God, then getting raptured? (OK, this one draws a very long straw!).

3. The reason I mentioned the best-seller New Age "Celestine Prophecy" books in my EM last night (propogating the New Ager's vibrating to Maya) was just to highlight that, yet again, the Enemy is hard at work concocting counterfeit deceptions for everything, including the Rapture!

My reply

> what if...He brings His Philadelphian elect a super-dose of the Holy Spirit, pre-Tribulation?
> What if he douses us all with an Upper Room or Road to Damascus experience instead? Tongues
> of fire and violent wind? Blinding light ... and Insight?

I think Joel 2:23-28 shows that the greatest outpourings of the Holy Spirit were to follow Christ's two comings. From Hosea 6:1-3, we find that the Lord will come as the former rain and the latter rain. In De. 11:14, the Lord promised "That I will give you the rain of your land in HIS DUE SEASON, the first rain and the latter rain." These two rains are such definite times in Israel that they are listed on their calendars (see Unger's Bible Handbook). Jesus came as the former rain on Tishri 1 and will return as the latter rain on Nisan 1.

Joel 2:23,27 mentions that "he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month...And ye shall know that I am in the midst of Israel." Then in verse 28, it says, "And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh."

Strong's Concordance lists two words for "afterward," achar (follow after) and "ken," (just). I take this to mean just afterward--just after the First Advent, as at Pentecost, and just after the Second Advent. It would be very like God to repeat this phenomenon on Pentecost. Sivan 6, 5768, our June 9, 2008.

> Perhaps that is our "first door"? A similar experience perhaps to John being taken up and
> given the grand tour through the open door in Rev 4?

I think Rev. 4:1 is much more than this. It says, "the first voice I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither." This is the "trump of God" of I Thess. 4:16. In the Preview of the Rapture in Rev. 1, John said, "I was (became) in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet. Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last." That is Christ. As John turned to see who spoke with him, he saw the seven churches around Christ, who said, "I am the first and the last; I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death" (Rev. 1:10-18).

> Yes, He promises to deliver his Philadelphians: "I will also keep you from the hour of trial
> that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on earth" (Rev 3:10). But
> He might still keep us hanging around here - maybe just exempt us from the suffering. There
> is a good precedent; Exodus of the first Passover (Ex 12:22-24).

I think we are to be caught up before the seven-year peace covenant of Daniel's Seventieth Week (Dan. 9:27) is confirmed. This will be at the first "trump of God" (I Thess 4:16). This trumpet sound is not to be confused with the seven trumpet judgments. Those are sounded by angels. The people left behind at the first Rapture have tribulation ten days (or years) (Rev. 2:10), from the Jewish 5758 to 5768. As 5768 begins, the "last trump" (I Cor. 15:52) sounds, calling the Tribulation saints to Heaven.

The first Rapture is as the days of Noah. He went into the Ark, then waited seven days before the rain fell (Gen. 7:10). Jesus is to return as the latter rain (Hosea 6:1-3), and his return is preceded by a seven-year period. However, the Bride of Christ is caught up before the seven years. She is married as the Millennium begins.

> Recall the blood of the Lamb around the **door** frame?

The door was swiped with lamb's blood at the top, representing Christ's blood that was shed for us. Then first one side of the frame was swiped, then the other. I think this supports the two Raptures, first one and then the other.

Re: the last generation. I think we were told enough times about the Israelites being 40 years in the wilderness while one generation died off to know that a generation should be counted at 40 years.

> Jesus was around for just over 3 years after his annointing in the Jordan. Any analogy with
> the elect being around through the Trib in full Spirit with God, then getting raptured?

Jesus' ministry was 3 1/2 years; then he was killed, resurrected and ascended to Heaven. This fits the ministry of God's two witnesses in the first 3 1/2 years of the Tribulation; then they too are killed, resurrected and ascend to Heaven. It is not the time of the second Rapture. That is on the Day of God's Wrath, just before the seven trumpet judgments hit Earth.

> Us still being around would be another reason for Him to "shorten the days for the sake of
> the elect".

Actually, he shortens the days or no flesh would be left. None being left would be ok if all were unbelievers, but not ok because there are "elect" too.

Incoming Email

> I'm just a kid, and I've been looking for this kinda stuff for my mom. I was just wondering
> what was so significant about may 31st?

My reply

I wish I knew a bit more about you. Things like, how old are you? do you believe in Christ? do you know what the Rapture is? Not knowing, I may explain things you already know. Forgive me if this is so. Since you use words like "significant" (spelled right) and know how to go on the Internet and do a search on the computer, I assume that you are not a little kid, but a big kid, big enough to understand what the Rapture is.

When Jesus was on Earth, he said that he would go and prepare a place for us. Here is what is recorded in the Bible. John 14:2,3 says, "In my Father's house are many mansions (dwelling places): if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also."

The Rapture is when he comes to take believers to Heaven to be with him. The passage in the Bible that describes the Rapture is I Thessalonians 4:14-17. It says, "We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him (their body died, but their soul and spirit still live). According to the Lord's own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord (at the Rapture), will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be CAUGHT UP together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever."

The word in the Latin translation of the Bible for "caught up" is "rapiemir." This is where the English word Rapture comes from.

May 31, 1998, is when I think the Rapture will take place. On my Web site, I tell the clues found in the Bible that seem to point to this date. It is up to each one of us to search the scriptures and see if these things are so. If it is possible that it might happen this soon, we should make sure that we accept Jesus Christ as our own personal Saviour now.

The Pastor of any Christian church should be able to help you understand how to become a Christian. It is basic to Christianity. The Bible is clear that we should believe in Christ. He died on the cross to take the punishment due all of the people of the whole world because of sins we commit. If we believe in him, we are saved from having to be punished for the bad things we have done. John 3:16,17 says, "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." The reward for believing in Christ is that we can have eternal life with him in his heavenly home.

Another passage in the Bible, Romans 10:9, says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." It is just that simple. God bless you and your family richly. In the love of Christ

Incoming Email

Isn't it interesting, that God told us in Ezekiel 36 how He would restore Israel back to a living nation in the last days, and how this restoration has taken place since May 14, 1948?
Isn't it interesting, how God said in Ezek. 37:19 that when Israel would be reborn it would no longer be a divided nation as in past history, and how this very issue was debated during Israel's restoration and has been fulfilled by their leader's decisions that Israel would be unified?
Isn't it interesting, that God said in Ezek. 36:35 and Amos 9 that Israel would be restored to a land that was waste and desolate, and would repopulate it, and make it so fruitful that the harvester would overtake the planter, and how this has been fulfilled so dramatically that according to the Saturday Evening Post, Israel is now getting 4 and 5 crops per year and in some places 6 and 7 from plants that were planted in the barren deserts and watered with salt water?
Isn't it interesting, that God said in Zech. 2 that the Jews would once more be in possession of Jerusalem in the lasts days, and how this has been fulfilled since 1967 when Israel recaptured Jerusalem against incredible odds?...

My reply

Yes, And isn't it interesting, that Israel fulfilled the fig tree parable when she was 19 years old? It could not be fulfilled any later, because when the nation was born the first time, when they came out of Egypt, only those 20 and up were counted. The 19 year olds were the young.

Mt. 24:32 says, "Now learn a parable of the fig tree (Israel); When his branch (modern Israel) is yet tender (apalos, young, i.e., 19), and putteth forth leaves (Sinai, West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights), ye know that summer is nigh." The Six-Day War began June 5; summer began June 21.

Isn't it interesting, that 1948 + 19 = 1967 + 40 = 2007, the end of this age. Mt. 24:34 says, "Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."

Isn't it interesting, that, counted by Jewish inclusive reckoning, the 2300 days of Dan. 8:14 run from the Feast of Weeks in 2001 to the Feast of Trumpets in 2007. The Feast of Trumpets is Tishri 1, 5768. I think it is the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord.

Isn't it interesting, that there are seven months on the Jewish calendar between that Tishri 1 and the following Nisan 1, when I think Christ will return, because the Jewish year 5768 is a leap year.

Ezek. 29:17 sets the day, "first month, in the first day of the month." Then verse 21 says, "In that day will I cause the horn (king) of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth (the Logos, the Word) in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."

Incoming Email

You're fabulous. I can't begin to tell you how much I've enjoyed you website.

Thank you so much for all your insight & knowledge of the Holy Bible.

Incoming Email

I've been reading your book and am about halfway thru. Your findings are very much like what the LORD has been showing me in the past year. God bless your service to his Kingdom. Very soon we will be blessed by the presence of our risen LORD and SAVIOUR JESUS. Look up and watch sweet sister.

Incoming Email

Please be patience with me. One more question. After the 2nd rapture, during tribulation, those people who enter the millennium, how do they get saved? How do they escape the tribulation. These have to be people that were not of the Laodiceans, but learned the message of salvation from them before they were executed for Christ's sake. thank you.

My reply

During the remaining Tribulation left after Rapture II, people get saved by believing in Christ. They do not escape the Tribulation, but stay on Earth to live on into the Millennium.

That period between the Feast of Trumpets on Tishri 1, 5768 and Christ's return on Nisan 1, 5768, will have its share of tribulations for the unbeliever. The demons set free on the day of trumpets will torment them terribly for five of the seven months. (5768 is a leap year, when the Jews insert a 13th month.)

Rev. 9:1-6 says, "AND the fifth angel sounded (the fifth trumpet judgment), and I saw a star (Satan, Isa. 14:12-19) fall (fallen) from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit (the asteroid Satan lives on digs the pit for the wicked). And there arose a smoke out of the pit...the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. And there came out of the smoke locusts (i.e., demons) upon the earth...And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree (showing that they are not literal locusts); but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads. And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man. And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them."

Also, I think some of the Laodiceans will escape being executed and be taken to Heaven in Rapture II. Why else would Rev. 7:14 say they "washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb"?

   Pro and Con 69   Or Return  Home


Contact me for more information at: mjagee@kiwi.net

send me e-mail now.

8641 Sugar Gum Road, Riverside, CA, 92508, USA; (909) 653-4110, FAX (909) 697-8960


© 1997 Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 2-25-98