Pro and Con 74, Uploaded 3-15-98
...I am a born again Christian and like to browse the Internet for spiritually minded web-sites. That's why I found yours so refreshing and interesting.
I find your view of the rapture(s) very interesting. You must realize by setting a date you are tying your credibility to that date. If May comes and goes with no rapture, it will be very hard to take anything you say as reliable anymore. This must have happened to the author of the book '88 Reasons Why the Lord will come back in '88'. I'm sure you've heard of it.
I don't mean to discourage you. I think you must've done an incredible job in bible study and research.
Are you aware of a web site that lists inconsistencies and errors in the bible.? I don't know the address off-hand but he did a very effective and in-depth study of errors in the bible. At first, I found it discouraging but it eventually served to strengthen my faith in God.
I have a question for you. Do you believe it's possible for a born again Christian to become unsaved.? I don't mean someone who almost became a Christian or someone who lives like a Christian. I mean someone who once honestly became a Christian and then became discouraged to the point that they renounce their beliefs. Would they be in danger of going to Hell.?
I thank you for providing such a spiritually minded, biblically based web site. It makes up for all the trash that is out there.
My reply I am glad you find my site refreshing and interesting.
> You must realize by setting a date you are tying your credibility to that date.
> If May comes and goes with no rapture, it will be very hard to take anything
> you say as reliable anymore.
Yes, but I saw a rectangle of light on Jer. 50:2 that said to publish and conceal not. I copyrighted my first book in 1987 to prove I knew no end-time event was going to happen in 1988.
> Are you aware of a web site that lists inconsistencies and errors in the bible.?
> Do you believe it's possible for a born again Christian to become unsaved.?...Would they be in danger of going to Hell.?
No. I believe once born again, we cannot get unborn, and therefore cannot go to Hell. However, I would fear for that person that got to that point, afraid that for them, it might be the sin unto death. The Lord might just take them out of here.
It was nice to see your Revelation 2000 book listed as the #2 seller on the Armageddon bestsellers for February according to Weekend News.
Since reading your books, I have given them to my wife, brother-in-law and mother-in-law to read. Although they like alot of your information the comment I seemed to be getting from them is "Well, what about Hal Lindsey, Van Impe, La Haye etc...? How do they feel about what you have written and why does your book seem to be less main stream then those author's books?" My mother-in-law told me she went to our local bookstore here in Arcadia and they didn't carry your books.
I and they understand that popularity doesn't necessarily = truth (maybe most of the time), but please answer the following if you would:
1) Do you know if any of the popular authors have commented on your materials before?
2) Why do you think that these people who seem to have studied the Bible as intently as you have don't have similar views regarding the end times?
3) Have you read these other books and if so who would you consider to be the most Biblically grounded?
4) Why do you think your books haven't penetrated "mainstream Christianity"?
5) In your 2007 book, you stated that the moon may have been scooped out of the earth when the asteroid impacted the earth and the impact of the asteroid caused the earth to become null and void. But how was it that later in Genesis chapter 1 it discusses the creation of the moon and the sun...wasn't the moon already there according to your interpretation?
Thank you so much for you ministry and dedication.
> It was nice to see your Revelation 2000 book listed as the #2 seller on the Armageddon
> bestsellers for February according to Weekend News. (Note: #1 was a video)
Thanks for letting me know. That does make me feel good.
> "Well, what about Hal Lindsey, Van Impe, La Haye etc...? How do they feel about what
> you have written
The previous emailer said it very well: "I find your view of the rapture(s) very interesting. You must realize by setting a date you are tying your credibility to that date. If May comes and goes with no rapture, it will be very hard to take anything you say as reliable anymore."
These men have reputations to uphold. They are afraid to be wrong. Hal Lindsey wished he had not put any mention of 1988 in The Late Great Planet Earth. Many ministers of churches are the same way. They feel that they just can't afford to be wrong. Personally, some agree with me, but don't teach anything about dates to the congregation. I don't blame them. I quit posting my email from ministers in a separate file because I did not want it known to the public what questions they were asking. Both of us could be free to discuss anything this way. Some of their email, I did not post at all.
I do not know how the men you mentioned feel about my books. I sent Exit: 2007 to Hal Lindsey asking him if he would want to write a Forward, and he never replied.
> why does your book seem to be less main stream then those author's books?"
Mainly because people are afraid of dates, and I am not out there in the public eye as they are.
> 1) Do you know if any of the popular authors have commented on your materials before?
Not to my knowledge.
> 2) Why do you think that these people who seem to have studied the Bible as intently as you
> have don't have similar views regarding the end times?
It would be hard to be as busy as they are and to have also studied as hard as I have. However, I can't be the judge of that. I read a stack of books 18" high every week for seven years. Then, not being able to find answers to some of my burning questions, I put my hands on my open Bible and told the Lord he would have to show me. I told him I wanted to know everything he wanted man to know about the Bible--everything. After that is when I learned things that no one else seemed to have found out. The credit should go to the Lord, not me.
> 3) Have you read these other books and if so who would you consider to
> be the most Biblically grounded?
I have read so many that to do justice to your question, I would have to go back and do it again to sort out who said what. I do not have any extra time left at all. I seldom have time to relax.
> 4) Why do you think your books haven't penetrated "mainstream Christianity"?
Because they are afraid of dates.
> 5) In your 2007 book, you stated that the moon may have been scooped out of the earth
> when the asteroid impacted the earth and the impact the asteroid caused the earth to
> become null and void. But how was it that later in Genesis chapter 1 it discusses the
> creation of the moon and the sun...wasn't the moon already there according to your
The sun and moon were already present, just obscured by the darkness. They merely became visible on the fourth day. Only three actual creative acts are recorded there, the heavens and earth, animal life, and human life. Other things were made to appear or rearranged. The Earth had become waste and desolation. It had to be refreshed to make it a fit habitat for Adam and the animals. Notice how carefully Gen. 2:5 is worded: "And every plant of the FIELD BEFORE IT was in the earth, and every herb of the FIELD BEFORE IT grew." That was not an entirely new creation. The roots and seeds that were already there in the ground, grew.
Incoming Email As time is running out and as I see judgement at our door (nuclear-biological war and terrorism; economic collapse; natural calamities; etc.) I am becoming more and more concerned about "making the first cut", especially when I consider the "if-by-any-means" comments made by Paul regarding being ready. What would you say are the critical criteria for making the First Fruits rapture? I know you must have addressed this somewhere in a previous Pro & Con. My thoughts on what is required:
1. Watch and pray. (Jesus warned 23 times on this).
2. Extra oil for our lamps. Matthew 25 and the parable of the 10 Virgins. One could argue, I guess, on just what this means.
3. Living in a very close state of repentance. Keeping a clean slate w/ the Lord.
You have poured your life into the scriptures on this issue for the last 36 or so years and the Lord has revealed so much to you. This is a most pivotal issue. There is little benefit in having all of that knowledge on the timing of events but missing out on the First Fruits rapture. Do you think you could summarize this issue or point me to the Pro & Con that deals with this? I'm probably not the only one with this concern on their mind.
My reply You could fill in #4 with II Peter 1:4-11: "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge; And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness; And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity (love). For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins. Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ."
Incoming Email I really enjoy your books and am most grateful that you have written to share this information with us. I have read End of the Age five times and have read Heaven Found, and also Revelations 2000. At the present time I am teaching your book End of the Age to a few insterested friends. Previous to that I was teaching Revelations and when that was finished it only seemed natural to expound of your book. The interest was there. Everyone bought your book and we continued our study. My daughter has given away your books for Christmas this year and I presonally have given away 15 or more of your books to family and friends.
Of course I keep up with your web page and am glad that it is available. Since we probably cannot chat here prehaps in heaven we can meet and greet.
I am a grand mother that loves Jesus and am looking forward to that great day of the catching up.
Incoming Email Praise the Lord for all your hard work. You are earning rewards. See you in Heaven.
Incoming Email I was just wondering is there any correlation between the time span running from the rapture of Enoch to the flood and the coming rapture to the tribulation?
Does the 669 years between the rapture of Enoch to the flood have any significence?
Is it just me, or do you sometimes feel the same way, that the closer May 31 gets the harder it seems to accept that the rapture will actually take place on that day?
Maybe I feel this way because the magnificence of the events that will take place on that day are somewhat hard to comprehend. It also could be because of the constant ridicule and rejection I've been getting from fellow christians who won't even consider that Pentecost 1998 COULD be a POSSIBLE date for our Lord to return for his bride, the church saints.
Keeping the faith, hoping to hear from you. Your friend in Christ Jesus
My reply > Does the 669 years between the rapture of Enoch to the flood have any significence?
I don't see how the years do, but the fact that Enoch was caught up before judgment is very significant, also because he was Gentile. There are Messianic Jews that are part of the Church today, but the large part is Gentile. Enoch was caught up because he "walked with God" (Gen. 5:24). That is what we need to do today.
> Is it just me, or do you sometimes feel the same way, that the closer May 31 gets the
> harder it seems to accept that the rapture will actually take place on that day?
No. I feel more confident. It looks to me like we have run out of alternatives. We only have one more Sunday Pentecost and one 2300-day period from the Feast of Weeks to the Feast of Trumpets six years later (the shortened Tribulation; Dan. 8:14). The final year of that set is the Jewish 5768, which is a leap year. It has to be for there to be 7 months between Tishri 1 and Nisan 1, when Christ returns on the first day of the Jewish regnal year and sacred year. During that 7 months, the Jews bury their dead (Ezek. 39:12). 1998 is the Jubilee year for Israel. It is the 6000th year since man began to be tested as mortals knowing both good and evil. Everything is falling into place on the world scene also, world government, even the MARC and implantable micro chips to be put in the forehead right under the hair line or in the back of the right hand.
> It also could be because of the constant ridicule and rejection
Don't worry, they didn't believe Noah either. The first Rapture is as the days of Noah. However, Noah and his family were saved. The rest were not. Keep on hanging on.
Incoming Email ...I came across your book in Dalton's at the mall in 1994, the same year I became a born-again Christian. Though I had read many books on prophecy, yours was validated both by the research and by the word of the Holy Spirit speaking to me. I spent my younger years in a cult (Armstrongism-1964 to 1974) and the years following in disallusionment and worldly pursuits. I have read much concerning prophecy over three decades and I frankly feel that you are right-or at least very close. I believe the Word when it says we will be guided into all truth by the Holy Spirit. I appreciate your research and now that I know you have written two other books, I will order and read those. I feel that the world, the new world order, the secret governments, and all the rest of the cabals, conspiracies, etc. all have their playing pieces in place, but cannot move until the Restrainer is taken out of the way. Many observers, both here locally, and nationally, are saying that it should have already begun to happen. The stock market should have crashed already, the upheavals should have begun in our cities, the UN troops should already have emerged from where they are stashed, the earthquakes should have happened--and on and on. But in fact, little or nothing has happened. It is all poised to happen, and I believe it is waiting for the Rapture to occur.
God bless you for helping some of us to focus
I found my way to your website by way of the Jeremiah Project link and I read the very unkind review of your work there. I don't agree--and I am far from naive or gullible. Methinks they protest too much! Everone is so against dates that I feel driven to a conclusion that perhaps some really would rather spend their life talking about the end of the world than actually seeing it happen.
Keep up the good work.
My reply ...It is nice to be appreciated. I work so hard, have next to no time for relaxation....
> I feel that the world, the new world order, the secret governments, and all the rest
> of the cabals, conspiracies, etc. all have their playing pieces in place, but cannot
> move until the Restrainer is taken out of the way....and I believe it is waiting for
> the Rapture to occur.
I think you are right. After the Bride of Christ is gone, the wicked one will be revealed.
What do they say at the Jeremiah Project? Could you give me their URL?
Incoming Email Thanks for the letter. I can totally understand all your points except Pentecost. why Pentecost. This is something that you have in variation with other bible teachers that I have heard which look for the rapture to be in the fall, around the end of September. I just don't understand how you arrived with Pentecost being one of the criteria. Don't misunderstand, I think your are probably right, but I don't know that I understand your reasoning. I think it fits because the church was born on Pentecost and it would be just like God to do it that way. Nevertheless, on what scriptural basis do you assert Pentecost as being a criteria for the rapture. I can see the Feast Of Trumpets as being a good candidate for a rapture day. If you can enlighten me, that would be great.
thanks. Blessings. Maranatha, Soon And Very Soon
My reply > why Pentecost. This is something that you have in variation with other bible
> teachers that I have heard which look for the rapture to be in the fall
There are those that pick Pentecost, I am not alone in this, but as far as I can tell, most who pick the fall feasts do so because they have had no fulfillment so far. Most pick the Feast of Trumpets because it is next in line. However, the spring feasts in Nisan had to do with Christ's first coming. The fall feasts in Tishri have to do with the beginning of the Millennium, which includes the terrible catastrophe on the Feast of Trumpets. Pentecost belongs to the Church.
There is a Rapture on the Feast of Trumpets, but it is for the Tribulation saints. There is a Pre-Trib Rapture in Revelation 4:1. Then you can see one in Revelation 7:14. It says, "These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." Between these is Revelation 6. It starts out with the opening of the first seal and the Beast riding forth on a white horse as a prince of peace. It ends with "For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?" This Day of God's Wrath is the day the seven trumpet judgments fall on Earth. They begin in Revelation 8. But in between the announcement that the Day of Wrath has come and the fall of the trumpet judgments is the Rapture of the Tribulation saints. It is that same day. The Jewish day begins at 6:00 P.M. Between then and the following noon when the "great mountain burning with fire" is cast into the Mediterranean Sea and the "great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp" hits Babylon is the Rapture of the Tribulation saints described in Revelation 7. Rapture II is on the Feast of Trumpets between the opening of the sixth seal in Revelation 6:12 and the opening of the seveth seal in Revelation 8.
Therefore, it is not likely that the first Rapture would also be on the Feast of Trumpets. What feast precedes the Feast of Trumpets? Pentecost, when the Church was born into this world. It would be a perfect time for the Church to be born into another new world, Heaven. Job 11:6 says that "the secrets of wisdom, that they are double to that which is!"
As you said,
> it fits because the church was born on Pentecost and it would be
> just like God to do it that way
There are other reasons that Pentecost makes sense. We are called wheat (Matthew 13:30), and Pentecost is the wheat harvest. Two wave loaves are brought "out of your habitations" (Leviticus 23:17). The two loaves suggests a double fulfillment. Nehemiah 10:35 tells us of Pentecost. It says "to bring the firstfruits of our ground, and the firstfruits of all fruit of all trees, year by year, unto the house of the LORD: Also the firstborn of our sons."
We are called "a kind of firstfruits of his creatures" (James 1:18). Exodus 23:19 says, "The FIRST of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring into the house of the LORD thy God." We are the FIRST of these firstfruits because these Pentecost loaves are baked with leaven. Christ is the Firstfruits that has no leaven. He is already in Heaven. The next to go is the Bride of Christ, the wise virgins with enough oil of the Holy Spirit that go with the Bridegroom when he comes.
The foolish virgins are left behind. This too fits Pentecost. Leviticus 23:22 says, "when ye reap the harvest of your land, thou shalt not make clean riddance of the corners of thy field."
Ruth is a type of the Bride of Christ. Boaz, the kinsman redeemer type of Christ, chose her as his bride on Pentecost at the time of the wheat harvest.
Israel was espoused to the Lord on Pentecost at Mount Sinai (Jeremiah 2:2,3), and things happened to Israel as samples of what would happen to us.
The first trumpet of the Bible sounded on Pentecost the day the Ten Commandments were given at Sinai. Jewish tradition says the first trump sounds on Pentecost, the last trump on the Feast of Trumpets and the great trump on the Day of Atonement. These tie in well with the Rapture of the Bride of Christ when the first trump sounds and the Rapture of the remainder of the Body of Christ on the Feast of Trumpets. The great trump probably applies to the Lord's acceptance of the remnant of Israel.
According to "The Romance of Redemption: Gleanings from the book of Ruth" by Chuck Missler, Enoch was born on the 6th of Sivan and was raptured on the 6th of Sivan. This could foretell the dates of the birth of the church into this world and the birth into another new world (Heaven). It paints a perfect picture.
Jer. 5:24 (KJV) says, Neither say they in their heart, Let us now fear the LORD (YHVH) our God, that giveth rain (YHVH will come as the rain, Hos. 6:3), both the former (Tishri 1) and the latter (Nisan 1), in HIS ("his redeemer the LORD [YHVH] of hosts," Isa. 44:6) SEASON: he reserveth unto us (believers) the appointed weeks (plural) of the harvest."
The Feast of Weeks is Pentecost, the wheat harvest, the time when Boaz chose Ruth as his bride. Weeks being plural suggests a multiple fulfillment of Pentecost. The first was the outpouring of the Holy Spirit in 30 A.D. I expect the second to be the Pre-Trib Rapture in 5758/1998. I think the third will be the beginning of the Seventieth Week of Daniel on the Feast of Weeks in 5761/2001.
The exact time, Feast of Weeks to Feast of Weeks, between the last two fulfillments is explained in Luke 13:6-9. It says, "He spake also this parable. A certain man (YHVH of hosts, Yeshua) had a fig tree (Israel) planted in his vineyard; and he (YHVH of hosts) came (on Pentecost, 5758) and sought fruit thereon, and found none (it is spring, but the figs are still green, Song of Sol. 2:10-14). Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years (counted by Jewish inclusive reckoning, 5758, 5759, 5760) I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground? And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year (5761) also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it: And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down."
I want to thank you for your work. I have been feeding at the sheep trough you have been filling by the instruction of the Lord for quite a while now, and have been forever changed in how I perceive the Word of God. The Lord has used you to remove some wax from my spiritual ears that I might hear and know more correctly the person of the Lord Jesus Christ. Thank you, thank you, thank you...Please continue this work as you are able. Some of us need you very much. Thank you again.
I just read your testimony and saw your face, after having caught your study on a two-rapture theory at another site. Praise the Lord. Believing in Paul's eternal salvation [not born-again, and then unborn-again] I wondered at his high prize, what he was running so very hard to obtain, his hope . . . etc. I see also a phasing or ranking [Paul's own word, as you quote also] to the rapture. I was saved at an early age and grew up with this teaching from a non-denominational group called, "Grace and Glory" out of the midwest. I was taught "rank, rank, rank," all of my life. However, in keeping with your study, I have additional insights. I am writing them for a paper and would love to trouble you with a copy. Shalom and bless your labor of love.
So nice to hear from you. Re: Paul and the prize. He didn't want to be a castaway. Only way I could figure he could be a castaway was to be like a foolish virgin or Laodicean. How about you?
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