Pro and Con 765

Posted 6-15-01

7 days before 6-20-01:
Virtual Jerusalem News - The cease-fire officially began at 3 P.M. on Wednesday (6-13-01) after U.S. CIA Director George Tenet held talks with Israel and the Palestinians to iron out a final timeline for its implementation.
http://www.virtualjerusalem.com/news/lateststories/
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Note: June 13 is 7 days from June 20, the last day of spring. I wonder if this cease-fire agreement could be a 7-day warning. Noah knew 7 days before he boarded the Ark the last time and the Lord closed the door.
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Sharon responds to continued Palestinian violence
http://www.jpost.com/Editions/2001/06/14/LatestNews/LatestNews.28359.html
Despite the fact that the Palestinians have announced that they accept the Tenet document, serious shooting incidents are still occurring on the ground and incitement is still taking place. This must stop forthwith....

The six-week cooling off period that was agreed upon in the Mitchell report will start only when there is complete quiet
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7 days before 6-20-01:
DIGITAL ANGEL COMMENCES FIRST PRODUCTION RUN - 6-13-01
http://www.jvim.com/cgi-bin/update.cgi
Boomberg.com reports: ...Digital Angel(TM) represents the first-ever combination of advanced biosensor technology and Web-enabled wireless telecommunications linked to Global Positioning Systems (GPS)...Delivery and beta testing will commence on or about the 15th of July, 2001... ---
http://www.msnbc.com/news/588075.asp

Incoming email

FWD: Mere conincidences?
God's Perfect Storm Warning — by John McTernan
http://www.watch.org/showart.php3?idx=12829&rtn=/articles.html&showsubj=1&mcat=1
6-13-01 - Koenig - From June 8 to June 9, 2001, one of the greatest rainfalls in the history of the United States happened in eastern Texas. In a 24-hour period, over 28 inches of rain fell in the Houston area. In fact, between June 4 and 11, three feet of rain fell on the area....

The destruction in Houston was catastrophic. An estimated 20,000 homes and businesses were destroyed or damaged, along with possibly 50,000 automobiles and trucks. The city was closed for three days. Twenty-eight counties in Texas were declared a disaster area along with 14 parishes in Louisiana....

Storms of this magnitude are usually connected to some national sinful event involving abortion, homosexuality, or the pressuring of Israel over her covenant land. This storm was no exception.

President George W. Bush sent CIA director George Tenet to Israel to try and broker a cease fire between the Israelis and the Palestinians and to implement the Mitchell Report. This was the Bush administration’s first real involvement in the MidEast crisis. Tenet wanted Israel to stop building in the settlement areas.

Tenet arrived in the Middle East on Wednesday. On Friday, June 8, the Central Intelligence Agency director hosted talks between senior Israeli and Palestinian security officials in Ramallah, while Assistant Secretary of State William Burns met Palestinian President Yasser Arafat in the West Bank city. This was at the same time Allison re-formed as a tropical storm and began dumping this tremendous rain. The two events exactly coincided!...

This was the third time since the Madrid Peace Process began that a sitting president's state has been the location of a powerful and damaging storm, occurring at the exact time the president was involved with Israel and the covenant land....

The first disaster literally destroyed President George H. Bush’s home in Maine. This storm, which came to be known as "The Perfect Storm," happened while President Bush was initiating the Madrid Peace process on October 31, 1991....

This was one of the most powerful storms ever. It generated waves over 100 feet high, the highest waves ever reported in the North Atlantic Ocean. As the storm moved west, it sent 30-foot waves smashing at President Bush’s home in Maine. This storm actually struck while the President was opening the Madrid Peace Process....

Clinton’s home state of Arkansas bore the brunt of the storm with 13 counties declared a disaster area. This storm brought record flooding to the Ohio River. Clinton met with Arafat, and the headline of a New York Times front page article on March 4, 1997, read, "President Clinton Rebukes Israel." The headline of the adjacent article read, "In Storms' Wake: Grief And Shock."...

A clear pattern has developed here. Are these presidents being warned by God not to interfere with the covenant land of Israel? Can all of this just be a coincidence? Or is the hand of God signaling a perfect storm warning?

My reply

Thanks. I wonder if this Houston storm could be a 10-day warning. The deluge reminds me of "as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be" (Mt. 24:37). The previous waves over 100 ft. high remind me of Luke 21:25. It says, "there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring."

Note: Tornadoes, thunderstorms, high winds, hail spreading north to Iowa. Two counties there declared disaster areas. Outside Ft. Worth, roofs have been blown off. More rain predicted for Houston Friday night and Saturday.

Incoming email

FWD: Re: Bilderbergs...
Bilderberg is gloomy over setbacks in its plans for world government and the presence of an Arab leader suggests meddling in the Middle East lies ahead.

By James P. Tucker Jr. - Exclusive to The SPOTLIGHT STENUNGSUND, Sweden
...Further depressing Bilderberg is fear that "right-wing nationalists" in the United States will, with help from such countries as Brazil, block President Bush's Free Trade Area of the Americas from emerging as scheduled in 2005. (emphasis mine)

My reply

2005. hmmm. Dec. 20, 2001 + 1260 days = June 1, 2005 (Iyar 23, 5765) (Mid-Trib)?

My outgoing e-mail

...I think the only question I had was about the following:

> > Revelation 22:17
> > One last example of the two groups of believers being found in different locations during the tribulation is recorded in the last chapter in the Bible.
> > 17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come (on up). And let him that heareth say, Come (and get us). And let him that is athirst come (be raptured). And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
> > I used to hear people read this verse and interpret it to be saying that the Bride on earth is calling for Jesus to come and get her. If you read this verse carefully, that is not at all what this verse is saying. The Spirit and the Bride are in heaven calling to the tribulation saints to "come on up!" How do we know who the Spirit and the Bride are saying "come" to? This verse says that those "athirst" are the ones that are being told to "come." It is the tribulation saints on the earth who are physically hungry and thirsty having had to survive without taking the mark of the beast (which would allow them to buy food and drink). These tribulation saints are also spiritually thirsty, "hungering and thirsting after righteousness" (Mat. 5:6). They are to be filled with the "water of life" that verse 1 says flows from the throne (that is in the New Jerusalem) after their rapture. So here in this one verse we have the Bride pictured in the place where the water of life is located (the New Jerusalem) calling to those that are athirst (the tribulation saints on the earth) to Come up to be where they are.

Rev. 1:3 says, "Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep (tereo, keep the eye on, watch) those things which are written therein: for the time (kairos, set time, due season) is at hand (eggus, nigh, near)." Rev. 22:10 says, "And he saith unto me, Seal not the sayings of the prophecy of this book: for the time (kairos, set time, due season) is at hand (eggus, nigh, near)."

I think The Revelation of Jesus Christ is when we see him at the Pre-Trib Rapture, as he appears in the Preview in Rev. 1:13-16. I think the time in 1:3 and 22:10 is when the due season of the Pre-Trib Rapture is at hand.

In Rev. 22:7 Jesus says, "Behold, I COME QUICKLY: blessed is he that keepeth (tereo, keep the eye on, watch) the sayings of the prophecy of this book." In verse 12, he says, behold, I COME QUICKLY." As Jesus signs off in v. 20, he says, "Surely I COME QUICKLY." He will come quickly at the Rapture (Rev. 2:5; 3:11). In Rev. 3:11, Jesus says to the Philadelphians, "Behold, I COME QUICKLY: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown." I think these are all talking about the same thing, when he comes at the Pre-Trib Rapture.

In Rev. 22:16, I think Jesus is on "the bright and morning star," and the Bride is on Earth. In v. 17, since she is indwelt by the Holy Spirit, both the Bride and the Holy Spirit say to those that will hear, "COME," meaning come to Christ, as in the altar call (i.e., "Will you come?). "And let him that heareth say, COME" to others. "And let him that is athirst (on Earth) COME. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely." To me, this is like the last altar call of the Bible, and whosoever will, come.

Incoming email

Re: Question on the 2300 days of Daniel 8
I am grappling with the 2300 days of Daniel 8:13-14. As you know it reads...13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

I, like you, thought that the time that the sanctuary and the host (Israel) was to be trodden under foot would end on the day of the Lord, feast of trumps, Sept. 13th, 2007. By Jesus stepping in and stopping the desecration of the temple I thought that would be considered "cleansing the temple." Now that Pentecost has passed, there has to be another way at looking at this passage. Could it be that the sanctuary and the host are considered to be trodden under foot until the wrath has run it's course and we come back with Him at the second advent? So could it be the day of the second advent that the temple is considered cleansed?

It seems that only two possibilities remain. One is for the temple sacrifices to start approximately seven months after the tribulation starts and the 2300 days to end on the day of the second advent. I think that is what you are saying when you say that if the tribulation started on June 21st (with the rapture of the Bride occurring on or before that date) and the temple sacrifices started on December 21st (about seven months later) . . . that it would be 2300 days to the date you projected for the second advent (was it April 6th, 2008?). I don't know any scripture that says that the temple sacrifices have to start at the beginning of the 7 year tribulation, do you?

The only other possibility is hard for me even to consider as a possibility. That is that the parentheses of the tribulation begins and the first of the two raptures happens in 2008 after the final generation ends and not before it ends. I can't see with the rapidity of the New World Order coming into place and what is going on in Israel, the beginning of the tribulation being put off seven more years. Plus the Sept 13th date of the Oslo accords in 1993 and the feast of trumps falling on Sept 13th, 2007 exactly 14 years later seems more than a coincidence. This year is a sabbatical year, the beginning of a seven year cycle. It would seem that the rapture of the Bride and the tribulation would occur on a sabbatical year. So if the rapture and the tribulation doesn't happen in the next 9 days, it seems that next open window would be in 2007-2008.

I am still looking for a rapture before the June 21st, but if we are still here after that I am going to need some more insight from the Lord as to how the 2300 days fit in. If you have any other insight as to how the 2300 days could possibly fit in after the 21st of June, please let me know....

Thanks for any new insight you might have on the 2300 days. Your Brother in Jesus

My reply

> > So could it be the day of the second advent that the temple is considered cleansed?...

Yes. I now think I have to accept that the 2300 days end at the Second Advent. I knew all along that Eze. 45:18 indicated that the sanctuary would be cleansed on Nisan 1. However, the 2300 days fit so well between Pentecost 2001 and Trumpets 2007, and the 7 months fit between Tishri 1 and Nisan 1, 5768, so I hung on to that and just kept wondering what Eze. 45:18 applied to.

The Lord has shown me by the process of elimination that the 2300 days don't fit where I thought they did. If the 2300 days end on Nisan 1, 5768 (Apr. 6, 2008), they will start on Dec. 20, 2001, the last day of autumn. Dec. 21 is the 1st day of winter. That fits Isa. 18:6: "the beasts of the earth (Rev. 13) shall winter upon them" (the foolish Laodicean virgins that are cut off at the Pre-Trib Rapture.

> > I think that is what you are saying when you say that if the tribulation started on June 21st (with the rapture of the Bride occurring on or before that date) and the temple sacrifices started on December 21st (about seven months later...that it would be 2300 days to the date you projected for the second advent (was it April 6th, 2008?).

I assume that the sacrificing, and the 2300 days, would both start at the beginning of the Tribulation because Rev. 11:1,2 mentions the temple when the two witnesses begin their prophesying. Thus the Tribulation would not start until Dec. 20.

I said Dec. 21 one day and then recounted it the next day. It comes out on Dec. 20 instead. In my haste that night, I counted back 207 days from Nisan 1, 5768 to Tishri 1, 5768. Then I counted 207 days from May 28, Pentecost, to Dec. 21, 2001. The next day, I counted it twice and it is 2300 days, counted by inclusive reckoning, from Dec. 20, 2001, to Apr. 6, 2008. I went back and updated the previous Pro and Con to change that date.

> > I don't know any scripture that says that the temple sacrifices have to start at the beginning of the 7 year tribulation, do you?

When the 1st 1260 days begin, Rev. 11:1 mentions "the temple of God, and THE ALTAR, and them that worship therein." Verse 2 says, "But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months." I thought the Jews might be allowed to build their temple next to the Dome of the Rock. Some people, like Dr. Kaufman, think that the Holy of Holies was over the small Dome of the Tablets, not the rock inside the Dome of the Rock. Personally, I can't see the high priest going into the Holy of Holies on the Day of Atonement to sprinkle blood on the mercy seat if the floor wasn't level there. I just can't picture the Ark in the Holy of Holies if the floor had a big rock in it, either.

> > I can't see with the rapidity of the New World Order coming into place and what is going on in Israel, the beginning of the tribulation being put off seven more years.

Neither can I.

> > if the rapture and the tribulation doesn't happen in the next 9 days, it seems that next open window would be in 2007-2008.

The number 40 means testing and probation. I think Adam was tried 40 years and that we have already passed the 6000th year since he was cast out of Eden. It seems that Israel will be tried 40 years since they fulfilled the fig tree parable in Mt. 24:32-34 in 1967. I think this 40-year generation will end in 2007....Agape

Incoming email

Re: Live Western Wall Camera at Aish. The face is back.
http://aish.com/wallcam/

My reply

Thanks. I found out that I can see the face even when the wall is sunlit. I had thought that the wall had to be in shadow. Agape

Incoming email

Re: days
Parenthetically, I'm sorry to report that Mike continues to proceed down the road to perdition. However, that is not the subject of this missive.

I've long had a fascination with the identities of the angels who left their first estate, the Nephilum and the NT demons and spirits. By inference I've speculated that the NT demons and indwelling apirits are the disembodied spirits of the Nephilum. Anyway, I recently started to explore the book of Enoch, which led me to Jubilees, which contained the following which I speculated that you might not have seen (although it is hard to imagine anything you have not read and considered). Agape
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http://wesley.nnu.edu/noncanon/ot/pseudo/jubilee.htm

For this reason it is ordained and written on the heavenly tablets, that they should celebrate the feast of weeks in this
18 month once a year, to renew the covenant every year. And this whole festival was celebrated in heaven from the day of creation till the days of Noah -twenty-six jubilees and five weeks of years [1309-1659 A.M.]: and Noah and his sons observed it for seven jubilees and one week of years, till the day of Noah's death, and from the day of Noah's death his sons did away with (it) until the days of Abraham, and
19 they eat blood. But Abraham observed it, and Isaac and Jacob and his children observed it up to thy days, and in thy days the children of Israel forgot it until ye celebrated it anew on this mountain.
20 And do thou command the children of Israel to observe this festival in all their generations for a
21 commandment unto them: one day in the year in this month they shall celebrate the festival. For it is the feast of weeks and the feast of first fruits: this feast is twofold and of a double nature:
22 according to what is written and engraven concerning it, celebrate it. For I have written in the book of the first law, in that which I have written for thee, that thou shouldst celebrate it in its season, one day in the year, and I explained to thee its sacrifices that the children of Israel should remember and should celebrate it throughout their generations in this month, one day in every year.
23 And on the new moon of the first month, and on the new moon of the fourth month, and on the new moon of the seventh month, and on the new moon of the tenth month are the days of remembrance, and the days of the seasons in the four divisions of the year. These are written and ordained
24 as a testimony for ever. And Noah ordained them for himself as feasts for the generations for ever,
25 so that they have become thereby a memorial unto him. And on the new moon of the first month he was bidden to make for himself an ark, and on that (day) the earth became dry and he opened
26 (the ark) and saw the earth. And on the new moon of the fourth month the mouths of the depths of the abyss beneath were closed. And on the new moon of the seventh month all the mouths of
27 the abysses of the earth were opened, and the waters began to descend into them. And on the new
28 moon of the tenth month the tops of the mountains were seen, and Noah was glad. And on this account he ordained them for himself as feasts for a memorial for ever, and thus are they ordained.
29 And they placed them on the heavenly tablets, each had thirteen weeks; from one to another (passed) their memorial, from the first to the second, and from the second to the third, and from the
30 third to the fourth. And all the days of the commandment will be two and fifty weeks of days, and (these will make) the entire year complete. Thus it is engraven and ordained on the heavenly
31 tablets. And there is no neglecting (this commandment) for a single year or from year to year.
32 And command thou the children of Israel that they observe the years according to this reckoning- three hundred and sixty-four days, and (these) will constitute a complete year, and they will not disturb its time from its days and from its feasts; for everything will fall out in them according to
33 their testimony, and they will not leave out any day nor disturb any feasts. But if they do neglect and do not observe them according to His commandment, then they will disturb all their seasons and the years will be dislodged from this (order), [and they will disturb the seasons and the years
34 will be dislodged] and they will neglect their ordinances. And all the children of Israel will forget and will not find the path of the years, and will forget the new moons, and seasons, and sabbaths
35 and they will go wrong as to all the order of the years. For I know and from henceforth will I declare it unto thee, and it is not of my own devising; for the book (lies) written before me, and on the heavenly tablets the division of days is ordained, lest they forget the feasts of the covenant
36 and walk according to the feasts of the Gentiles after their error and after their ignorance. For there will be those who will assuredly make observations of the moon -how (it) disturbs the
37 seasons and comes in from year to year ten days too soon. For this reason the years will come upon them when they will disturb (the order), and make an abominable (day) the day of testimony, and an unclean day a feast day, and they will confound all the days, the holy with the unclean, and the unclean day with the holy; for they will go wrong as to the months and sabbaths and feasts and
38 jubilees. For this reason I command and testify to thee that thou mayst testify to them; for after thy death thy children will disturb (them), so that they will not make the year three hundred and sixty-four days only, and for this reason they will go wrong as to the new moons and seasons and sabbaths and festivals, and they will eat all kinds of blood with all kinds of flesh.

My reply

Sorry about Mike. At least, he has been told. Maybe he will wake up in the Tribulation. Thanks for sending this. I read it so far back I forgot what it said.

> > By inference I've speculated that the NT demons and indwelling apirits are the disembodied spirits of the Nephilum.

Gen. 6:1,2 says, "it came to pass, when men [adam, i.e., mortals] ( began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, That the sons of God [bene elohim, angels, Job 1:6:2:1, each one created by God, as was Adam, Lu. 3:38] saw the daughters of men [adam, i.e., mortals] that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man [adam, i.e., mortals], for that HE ALSO IS FLESH: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. There were giants [nphiyl, fellers, tyrants, giants] in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God [bene ha elohim, angels] came in unto the daughters of men [adam, i.e., mortals], and they bare [yalad, to bear young] children to them, the same became mighty men [gibbowr, giant, mighty, strong men] which were of old, men [enowsh, MORTALS] of renown."

The giants were not called by the term "adam" here. They were designated as "enowsh," MORTALS, probably so we would not assume that they were otherwise.

I think the nephilim were hybrid children born to fallen angels and daughters of men. The mother passed on to those children her mortality. The last giants to die were Og and his sons. Nu. 22:35 says of Og, "So they smote him, and his sons, and all his people, until there was none left him alive: and they possessed his land."

I don't see why the nephilim would later be allowed to roam as demons, men don't do such. I think the demons are fallen angels. They seem to be larger and stronger than mankind.

> > ...the feast of weeks in this 18 month once a year, to renew the covenant every year. And this whole festival was celebrated in heaven from the day of creation till the days of Noah -twenty-six jubilees and five weeks of years [1309-1659 A.M.]: and Noah and his sons observed it for seven jubilees and one week of years, till the day of Noah's death, ...it is the feast of weeks and the feast of first fruits: this feast is twofold and of a double nature:

I had read this before, but too long ago to remember what it said. As I started to read this time, something jumped out at me. Whoever figured 1309 years used the 49-year Jubilee cycle (26 x 49) + ( 5 x 7) = 1309. I think that is correct. It keeps the Sabbatic Years and Jubilee Years aligned. The 50th year is both the Jubilee and the 1st year of the next cycle.

I think it was 1056 AH (year of man) when Noah was born. He was 600 when the Flood happened, and virtually all Bible chronologers agree that the Flood was in 1656 AH.

I have heard Charles Capps support his 6000-year theory by multiplying Gen. 6:3's 120 years by 50 Jubilees. I think the 6000 years is valid, but I don't think we can arrive at it this way. I am convinced that the Jubilee Cycle is a 49-year cycle.

This document also shows that man had knowledge of the feasts before the commandments and laws were given to Israel at Mt. Sinai. For sure Noah knew which animals were clean and which were unclean (Gen. 7:2), and he was not a Jew. Noah's father, Lamech, lived 56 years while Adam was still alive. People lived a long time in those days. Adam, Seth, Enos, Cainan, Mahalaleel, Jared, Enoch, Methuselah and Lamech were all contemporaries. Enoch was a prophet (Jude 14). It seems that both Adam and Enoch were given special instructions by the Lord. Even Noah was contemporary with Enos, Cainan, Mahalaleel, Jared, Methuselah and Lamech for some time. Noah died 2 years before Abraham was born.

This author makes it clear that Pentecost/Feast of Weeks/Firstfruits was of "a double nature" and celebrated on one day.

> > And on the new moon of the first month, and on the new moon of the fourth month, and on the new moon of the seventh month, and on the new moon of the tenth month are the days of remembrance, and the days of the seasons in the four divisions of the year. These are written and ordained 24 as a testimony for ever. And Noah ordained them for himself as feasts for the generations for ever,

Since this was before the Israelite encampment at Sinai, the 1st month was Tishri (autumn), the 4th Teveth (winter), the 7th Nisan (spring), and the 10th Tamuz (summer). In 2001, Tamuz 1 is our June 22nd. It is a day of remembrance and a Noahic feast day. It makes me wonder if we will celebrate it in Heaven this year. The Rapture is as the days of Noah. Agape

Incoming email

Here you have the astronomical phenomenon for
June
6 - 01:41 - FULL MOON
6 - 19 - Mars 3.9sS of Moon
8 - 05 - Venus at Greatest Elong: 45.8sW
11 - 20 - Moon at Apogee: 404630 km
13 - 14 - Mars at Opposition
14 - 03:33 - LAST QUARTER
14 - 14 - Jupiter-Sun Conjunction
14 - 19 - Venus at Aphelion
16 - 13 - Mercury at Inferior Conjunction
17 - 23 - Venus 1.7sN of Moon
19 - 22 - Saturn 0.9sN of Moon: Occn.
21 - 07:39 - Summer Solstice
21 - 11:59 - NEW MOON
21 - 12:04 - Total Solar Eclipse; mag=1.047
23 - 17 - Moon at Perigee: 363135 km
28 - 03:20 - FIRST QUARTER

My reply

Thanks. That's quite a few things to happen on the 21st. Agape

Incoming e-mail

FWD: Mars set to dazzle - by Dr David Whitehouse
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_1384000/1384828.stm
6-12-01 - BBC News - On Tuesday, Mars is at its brightest. It is also nearly at its closest approach to Earth....The pair are closest together on 21 - 22 June..

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