Pro and Con 789

Posted 8-8-01

Interesting maps of Israel:
http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1434.cfm

  

My note: Under the unfair 1947 UN Partition Plan, the country would not have had much chance to defend itself. Now, the Palestinians are in isolated areas hard to defend.

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Shroud (of Turin) is authentic, according to this guy
http://www.rense.com/general12/mystcont.htm
Probe Of Shroud Of Turin Mysteries Continues, By Deena Winter

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Re: More website comment/Chrolology observations.
...Another thing that is definitely not advisable is to publish your e-mail address in exact form on a web page. This is probably responsible for you getting lots of spam (unsolicited commercial email), and possibly many of the viruses. I don't know if you get lots of spam, but I guess you probably do. The reason you are at risk if you post your e-mail address in "clickable" form on your website is that spammers have "web-crawler" robot programs that just scan huge numbers of web pages, following hyperlinks. Every time they come across something that looks like an email address (several fields separated by dots and the @ sign, they collect it and thereby "harvest" millions of e-mail addresses, which are then sold off to whoever wants to send bulk e-mail.

The recommended thing to do...
Comments to:
-------- at
-------.---

That way it is clear to a human what the email address is if they want to send e-mail to me, but will not be picked up by a "harvester" program, because the "@" character is missing.

I realise that much of your ministry is to do with e-mail, so you may not want to do this...but I think if you did something similar on your web-site, with an explanatory note to say replace the "at" with an "@", that people would stll find it easy to contact you. It might save you some bother, though I guess to start you would still be on spammers' lists.

On the Chronology, your comments that not one year is left unaccounted is interesting, but in a way it only increases the problem, leaving the skeptic open to the argument that the figures had been deliberately contrived by humans to add up, rather than being natural. For example, it is commonly written that Methuselah died in the same year as the flood. (Whether or not as a result of the flood we cannot tell). But in fact going on the figures, and using the way we reckon ages nowadays, the flood could have been up to two years after M's death. Imagine that M is 187 years and 11 months old at the birth of Lamech, and that Lamech is 182 years and 11 months old at the birth of Noah; then it could be 971 years after Methuselah dies. The fact that they all add up so neatly looks unnatural, as the intervening months seem to have disappeared. Extending back to Adam, we have 11 generations to Noah, and for each one, we don't know how many months had elapsed (e.g. in Adam's 131st year) when Seth was born. On average, the excess months would average out to 6 months, which would put the expected flood date back by five and a half years. The only way I can reconcile this is to suggest that when it says Adam was 130 when Seth was born, it does _not_ imply necessarily that his 130th birthday had passed and he was in his 131st year, but that the _nearest_ number to his age in years was 130, i.e he was between 129.5 and 130.5 years old. This is the way one would round the numbers in computing. Hence the nearest integer to his age is 130. This way, there is not the constant slippage of intervening months, and the dates can easily agree (I calculate that over 11 generations there is a 70% chance that we would still be within the correct year). Do you have any thoughts on this, or ideas on how the ancient Hebrews reckoned the years? Agape -

My reply

I get spam, but will just keep blocking and deleting. It is probably way too late to do otherwise....

Since the Jews count a king's reign as starting Nisan 1 (beginning of their Regnal Year), regardless of when he actually started to rule, I think they would have done something like that in recording their lifetimes. Agape

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Re: More Questions for You
...I read your response, and that is sort of what I thought you might say. So, allow me to ask you to respond to what some other passages say about salvation. I just want to be certain you are not misleading me. I was also wondering, John 3:5 says: "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to the Spirit. You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You must be born again.'"Now, how can a person be born again, of water and Spirit, if all they do is pray a prayer I still cannot find in my bible?

And, one more thing. IN Acts 2, at the end of Peter's sermon, the people asked what they should do. Peter responded that they should 'repent and be baptized.' Now, if all that is necessary is that we should pray a prayer that, evidently, even Peter did not know, what did he tell them to 'repent and be baptized'? And, in Acts 8, Why did not Philip just have the Ethiopian pray? Why did they go through the hassle of getting into the water in the first place? Why is the prayer not recited for us? No confession. No nothing. Now, here are some other passages I need help with.

Romans 5:10: "For if when we were God's enemies we were reconciled to him through the death of his son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life."
1 Corinthians 15:2: "By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise you have believed in vain."
John 10:9: "I am the gate, whoever enters through me will be saved."
Matthew 10:22: "All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved."
Mark 16:16: "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned."
Ephesians 2:5 & 8: "It is by grace you have been saved...For it is by grace you have been saved through faith."
2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth."
Titus 3:5: "He saved us because of his mercy...he saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit."

Now, I am not trying to give you a hard time. I am genuinely seeking answers to these questions because I want to know the truth. I want to know who is teaching me correctly. I mean, if a prayer is all that is necessary (that is what I saw in those "Left Behind" books), then why are people telling me I also need to repent, believe, persevere, confess, be baptized (by someone else), have faith, and trust in God's mercy and grace. Well, I guess it appears that the Bible is also telling me these things. I just don't know. Can you help sort it out for me? Sincerely

My reply

> > > All that is necessary is in Rom. 10:9,10: "if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." I think a simple prayer telling God that you accept Jesus Christ as your own personal Saviour is appropriate.

> > I just want to be certain you are not misleading me.

Rom. 10:9,10 is God's word on the subject of how to be saved. It can be trusted implicitly.

> > ...how can a person be born again, of water and Spirit, if all they do is pray a prayer I still cannot find in my bible?

That prayer was written by a well-meaning person trying to cover all bases. Lay it aside, you seem to be looking at everything through it as if it was some kind of colored glasses. Forget it so it can't cloud your thinking. You can always use your own words to simply tell God that you accept Jesus Christ as your own personal Saviour. Don't try to make it hard. God didn't make it hard. Acts 2:21 says, "WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED."

Of water means being born of our mothers. You may have heard of the water breaking when a child is ready to be born. Being born of the Spirit is to be baptized with the Holy Spirit. That is salvation. It is Christ's obligation to baptize you with the Holy Spirit, which is the Spirit of Christ, when you accept Him. Rom. 8:9,10 says, "ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness." In Mt. 3:11. John the Baptist said, "I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance. but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: HE SHALL BAPTIZE YOU WITH THE HOLY GHOST." John 1:33 says, " I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is HE WHICH BAPTIZETH WITH THE HOLY GHOST."

> > IN Acts 2, at the end of Peter's sermon, the people asked what they should do. Peter responded that they should 'repent and be baptized.' Now, if all that is necessary is that we should pray a prayer that, evidently, even Peter did not know, what did he tell them to 'repent and be baptized'?

Acts 2:36-38 says, "know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and YE SHALL RECEIVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST." Repent means to turn around, change your mind, think differently, reconsider. An unbeliever needs to change his mind about Christ. Here, these people made a public statement of faith in Christ when they were baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Their previous sins were forgiven. Those sins were symbolically washed away when they were baptized, but they were really wiped off the books by their acceptance of Christ. We know that baptism is not necessary for salvation, because the thief on the cross was saved by his faith, but he was not baptized. A person has to decide that he will accept Christ and confess it with his mouth.

When people are baptized now, they are asked if they believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. They confirm that they believe in him. Then they are put under the water as a symbol that they identify with Christ in his death. It is like they died to the old life and are brought up to a new life in Christ.

> > in Acts 8, Why did not Philip just have the Ethiopian pray? Why did they go through the hassle of getting into the water in the first place? Why is the prayer not recited for us? No confession. No nothing.

Acts 8:35-39 says, "Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him. And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing."

The man asked if he could be baptized. Philip responded with "If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. The man said he believed in Christ and was baptized because he believed in Christ first. That is the correct order, faith and salvation first, then baptism, which is a public confession of faith and symbolic.

> > Romans 5:10: "For if when we were God's enemies we were reconciled to him through the death of his son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life."

II Cor. 5:19 says, "God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them." One of God's attributes is perfect justice. He cannot overlook sin. Sin must be punished. Without a Saviour, all men would have to die for their own sins. However, God planned a way that a person's sins would not stay written in a book against him. Jesus took our place and died to take sin out of the way as an issue in salvation. Now it is, "What think ye of Christ? whose son is he?" (Mt. 22:42). Jesus was resurrected as proof of who he really was, God in the flesh. John 1:1,14 says, "the Word was God....And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth."

> > 1 Corinthians 15:2: "By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise you have believed in vain."

The Lord wants us to change our mind about Christ, accept Him as our Saviour, and hold fast to our faith from that point on.

> > John 10:9: "I am the gate, whoever enters through me will be saved."

The veil at the door of the Holy of Holies (representing Heaven) in the temple represented Jesus' flesh. When he died, the veil was torn from the top down, showing that now the way into Heaven has been opened. Jesus is the door through which we have to go to enter Heaven. When we accept Him, we are in Christ, connected to him by the Spirit of Christ. When he comes for us in the clouds, all firmly attached to him by the Spirit of Christ will be caught up and go back with Him through that door in Heaven (Rev. 4:1).

> > Matthew 10:22: "All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved."

Jesus was talking to his apostles. They would be hated for his name's sake. Most of them would be killed, but they will be resurrected and sit as elders on thrones near Christ's throne (Rev. 4:4).

> > Mark 16:16: "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned."

When we accept Christ, he baptizes us with the Spirit of Christ, and we are saved. Anyone who does not believe in Christ will be condemned to hell.

> > Ephesians 2:5 & 8: "It is by grace you have been saved...For it is by grace you have been saved through faith."

By God's grace, we are saved by faith in Christ. It is not of works, but of grace. The next 2 verses say, "Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." The Sovereign of the Universe decided how man could be saved. We have no say in the matter whatever. We either believe or we don't. God accepts believers as his adopted children and leaves unbelievers on their slick slide into hell.

> > 2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth."

God has foreknowledge of who will be saved and who won't.

This verse shows God's plan of Salvation was made in the beginning. We believe the truth about Christ, then he baptizes us with the indwelling Holy Spirit. This seals us until the day of redemption.

> > Titus 3:5: "He saved us because of his mercy...he saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit." Eph. 4:30 says, "grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption."

We are saved by His grace and His mercy. He gave us a way to be saved. If he hadn't, we would be sunk. We are born into our earthly family by water. Then after we accept Christ, we are reborn into God's family by the Spirit of God.

> > if a prayer is all that is necessary (that is what I saw in those "Left Behind" books), then why are people telling me I also need to repent, believe, persevere, confess, be baptized (by someone else), have faith, and trust in God's mercy and grace. Well, I guess it appears that the Bible is also telling me these things. I just don't know. Can you help sort it out for me?

If we first have faith, there are some other things to add to our faith so that we will be sure to be caught up to Heaven in the Pre-Trib Rapture like a wise virgin (Mt. 25:1f). Foolish virgins are left behind at the Pre-Trib Rapture and are caught up with the Tribulation saints at the Pre-Wrath Rapture.

II Peter 1:1-11 says, "Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that HAVE OBTAINED LIKE PRECIOUS FAITH with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ: Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord, According as HIS DIVINE POWER HATH GIVEN UNTO US ALL THINGS THAT PERTAIN UNTO LIFE AND GODLINESS, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue: Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that BY THESE YE MIGHT BE PARTAKERS OF THE DIVINE NATURE (Spirit of Christ/Holy Spirit/Spirit of God), having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. And beside this, giving all diligence, ADD TO YOUR FAITH VIRTUE; and to virtue KNOWLEDGE; And to knowledge TEMPERANCE; and to temperance PATIENCE; and to patience GODLINESS; And to godliness BROTHERLY KINDNESS; and to brotherly kindness CHARITY (God's agape love).For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But he that lacketh these things is blind (like the Laodiceans), and cannot see afar off (Heaven), and hath forgotten that HE WAS PURGED FROM HIS OLD SINS (when he accepted Christ). Wherefore the rather, brethren (believers), GIVE DILIGENCE TO MAKE YOUR CALLING AND ELECTION SURE: FOR IF YE DO THESE THINGS, HE SHALL NEVER FALL: FOR SO AN ENTRANCE (the Pre-Trib Rapture) SHALL BE MINISTERED UNTO YOU ABUNDANTLY INTO THE EVERLASTING KINGDOM OF OUR LORD AND SAVIOUR JESUS CHRIST."

At the moment of Salvation, we are purged from our old sins and sealed with the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption. When we sin after accepting Christ, we must confess those sins to God. He is faithful and just to cleanse us from all unrighteousness (including unknown sins) (I John 1:9). It is like when Peter had to let Jesus wash his feet. John 13:8 says, "Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me." The Tribulation saints have washed their robes in the blood of Christ by confessing their sins by the time they are caught up to Heaven (Rev. 7:14). Agape

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...if we add 40 years to 1967...(6 day war), we get 2007. Do you believe we are IN the Tribulation now? if so, the AC would be obvious?? thanks God Bless

My reply

As long as we are here, I don't think the Tribulation can begin We are the salt of the Earth, and salt retards the growth of leaven in bread making. The Rapture (departure, escape) comes first, then the False Prophet is revealed. 2Th 2:3-8 (WEB, World English Bible) says, "Let no one deceive you in any way. For it (the millennial Day of the Lord) will not be, unless THE DEPARTURE COMES FIRST, AND THE MAN OF SIN IS REVEALED (SECOND), the son of destruction, he who opposes and exalts himself against all that is called God or that is worshiped; so that he sits as God in the temple of God, setting himself up as God. Don't you remember that, when I was still with you, I told you these things? Now YOU KNOW WHAT IS RESTRAINING HIM (the Holy Spirit in the salt of the Earth), TO THE END THAT HE MAY BE REVEALED IN HIS OWN SEASON (THE TRIBULATION). For the mystery of lawlessness already works. Only there is one (the Holy Spirit) who restrains now (before the Rapture), until he is taken out of the way (at the Pre-Trib Rapture). Then (tote, at the same time) the lawless one will be revealed."

Remember that the Great Tribulation is shortened. Dec. 19, 2001 is 2300 days (Dan. 8:13,14) before the Second Advent on Nisan 1, 5768 (Apr. 6, 2008). I hope we will be raptured before Dec. 19.

Hosea 6:3 says, "the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth." Christ came as the former rain (Tishri 1) at the First Advent and will come as the latter rain (Nisan 1) at the Second Advent. Since I think the Pre-Wrath Rapture will be on Tishri 1, 5768 (Sept. 13, 2007), the Feast of Trumpets that begins the Millennium, maybe the Lord planned for the Pre-Trib Rapture to also be on the Feast of Trumpets (Sept. 18, 2001). We don't have long to find out. That is still summer, and the parable of the fig tree in Mt. 24:32 says, "ye know that summer is nigh." Luke 21:31 says, "summer is now nigh at hand...know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand." It seems very close. Agape

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Re: study aids?
would you or any of your readers know of a good Hebrew - English interlinear or dictionary on the net? Thank you, K Lecorre

My reply

I'll post it and see. I have Green's 4 volumes, so I haven't looked for it on the Internet. Agape

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The next Jewish pope
http://www.smh.com.au/news/0108/06/world/world7.html 8-6-01 - His mother was burned in the ovens of Auschwitz, yet he converted to Catholicism, rose to the zenith of power in the church, and could become its next leader. Jean-Marie Lustiger spoke with Paul Sheehan.

He started life as Aaron Lustiger. Now he is Cardinal Jean-Marie Lustiger, prince of the Catholic Church, confidant of Pope John Paul II. As the Pope grows more and more frail, Cardinal Lustiger, the Archbishop of Paris, grows more crucial to the leadership of the church....

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Just checked my StarNavigator and see that Venus and Jupiter are kissing, as is the Sun and Mercury. Looking up!

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Re: counting days
Is there any reason why the 1260, 1290 and 1335 day counts couldn't start on the same day, the day of Desecration or the day of the Daniel 9 covenant? Could there just be a "great trib" of 3.5 years rather than a 7 year trib? Could the Daniel 9 covenant have been Wye? (Just trying to figure this out) Thanks as always!!

My reply

I think the 1260, 1290 and 1335 day counts are all three counted from Mid-Trib, when the abomination of desolation is placed at the temple. In Rev. 12, Satan is cast down to Earth Mid-Trib. He enters into the False Prophet and places the abomination of desolation at the temple. The Messianic Jews have to flee Judea. They are to be fed in Petra 1260 days (3.5 years) "from the FACE of the serpent" (Rev. 12:6,14).

Dan. 7:24-26 says, "And the ten horns (kings) out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise (at the beginning of the Tribulation, Rev. 13:1; 17:12): and ANOTHER (the False Prophet) SHALL RISE AFTER THEM; and he (the False Prophet) shall be diverse (different) from the first (the Beast, Tribulation Pope), and he (the False Prophet) shall subdue three kings. And he shall speak great words against the most High (Christ), and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and THEY SHALL BE GIVEN INTO HIS HAND UNTIL A TIME AND TIMES AND THE DIVIDING OF TIME (the last 3.5 years, the Great Tribulation). But the judgment (Judgment Seat of Christ) shall sit (probably on Trumpets, Sept. 13, 2007), and they (Christ and his saints) shall take away his (the Satan-possessed False Prophet's) dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end."

Psa. 149:5-9 says, "Let the saints be joyful in glory (i.e., in Heaven): let them sing aloud upon their beds. Let the high praises of God be in their mouth, and a two-edged sword in their hand; To execute vengeance upon the heathen, and punishments upon the people; To bind their kings with chains, and their nobles with fetters of iron; To execute upon them the judgment written: this honour have all his saints. Praise ye the LORD."

Just as the 1260 days start Mid-Trib, so do the 1290 and 1335 days each start when that abomination of desolation is placed in the temple (Dan. 12:7f). However, all three sets will probably be shortened by whatever the 1260-day portion is shortened.

> > Could there just be a "great trib" of 3.5 years rather than a 7 year trib?

I see a 7-year Tribulation. It's the 5th cycle of discipline for Israel. A time can mean a year. Lev. 26:28 says, "Then I will walk contrary unto you also in fury; and i, even i, will chastise you SEVEN TIMES for your sins."

> > Could the Daniel 9 covenant have been Wye?

I don't see how it could. We are still here. The Holy Spirit in us is still restraining the revealing of who the False Prophet is. Agape

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Subject: REquest to start a movement establishing a real 40-days of Lent...Repentance..Teshuvah..in the Amercan Christian community...in line with Jewish period of Repentance starting on Elul one, 40 days before Yom Kippur.

My reply

It is in our best interest to repent and confess our sins (I John 1:9). Five of the seven churches are told to repent. That five ties in with the five foolish virgins. They shouldn't wait. Jesus told the Laodiceans, "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent" (Rev. 3:19).

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Re: Rev. 6:9
May God continue to richly bless you! Can you help me with this verse? Rev. 6:9 "And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held."

THEM THAT WERE SLAIN...are these Tribulation saints? if so, are there some that will be slain/martyred and others that will be raptured?

And, if so, what will differentiate those that are 'slain' and those that are raptured? In other words, what will the Tribulation saints have to do to escape being slain and be raptured instead? tks

My reply

> > THEM THAT WERE SLAIN....are these Tribulation saints?
if so, are there some that will be slain/martyred and others that will be raptured?

These slain ones are Tribulation saints, for if they had been wearing white robes, they would have been part of the resurrection at the Pre-Trib Rapture. At the Pre-Wrath Rapture, there will be both resurrection and rapture of the living saints.

> > what will differentiate those that are 'slain' and those that are raptured?...what will the Tribulation saints have to do to escape being slain and be raptured instead?

I don't know what I can say besides not get killed. Those in Judea are to flee to the wilderness. The rock city of Petra has been prepared for them. When the Bible says to run, RUN! Agape

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Re: YOUR AUGUST 6th POST
You made an interesting post on Monday. It had not crossed my mind to tie the word ESCAPE in Luke 21:36 in with the word ESCAPE in 1Thessalonians 5:3. Of course you are right.

I'm wondering about something though, and don't have a Greek or Hebrew dictionary. Luke 21:35 speaks of the SNARE, and Luke 21:36 speaks of the ESCAPE. I have said for a long time that Psalm 124:7 speaks of the Rapture. In this single verse the words SNARE and ESCAPE are used TWICE EACH.

My question is do the words Snare and Escape in Psalm 124:7 have the same definition or connotation in Greek and Hebrew, as do the two words in Luke 21:35-36? Thanks for you insight. Jesus is Lord

My reply

Psa. 124:7 says, "Our soul is escaped as a bird out of the snare (pach, a spring net) of the fowlers: the snare is broken, and WE ARE ESCAPED" (malat, leap out, let go, preserved, saved). That does seem to represent the Rapture.

If you have enough memory, E-Sword is a good free Bible program: http://kingdomnet.com/freebibles/e-sword.htm
You can click on tabs to see different versions of the Bible. One is KJV+, which has Strong's numbers. You just set your arrow over a number and without clicking, a Tool Tip box comes up. It has the original word and its meaning. Agape

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