Pro and Con 829

Posted 11-6-01

U.S. pounds Taliban front lines - Special Report: America Responds, By STEVEN GUTKIN
http://www.nandotimes.com/front/v-topstory/
DEH MESKIN, Afghanistan 11-3-01 AP - U.S. planes bombarded Taliban strongholds on Afghanistan's two main battle fronts Saturday, and the opposition northern alliance chose its representatives to negotiate with other Afghan factions to create a broad-based government to replace the Taliban....

Despite the attacks, Taliban Information Minister Qadratullah Jamal insisted Taliban morale remains high. "Even if a Taliban dies, his friend is behind him running forward. He is not afraid to lose his life. He knows he will go to heaven," Jamal told The Associated Press.

My note: Whew! Has he got a surprise coming.
---
Aurora Over Winnipeg
http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/astropix.html
a CME that occurred on October 9 impacted the Earth on October 11 and 12, causing nearly 12 hours of auroras..... The above-pictured aurora had to be very bright to be seen over the lights of Winnipeg, the city well below and in front of the cascading atmospheric airglow. Lights reflecting off of a slight haze cause an unrelated glow that emanates from some of the buildings.
---
Arabs Dismiss Bin Laden Appeal, Syria Rips U.S.,By Nadim Ladki
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011104/wl/attack_arabs_dc_3.html
11-4-01 DAMASCUS (Reuters) - The head of the 22-nation Arab League Sunday dismissed an appeal by Osama bin Laden to Muslims to join a holy war against the West, saying the Saudi militant did not speak for the world's Arabs and Muslims.

Egypt, the Arab world's most populous country, also rejected the appeal, saying the world was united against bin Laden.

"There is a war between bin Laden and the whole world, "Egyptian Foreign Minister Ahmad Maher told reporters ahead of a meeting of Arab foreign ministers in Syria when asked about bin Laden's appeal.

Arab League Secretary-General Amr Moussa, himself Egyptian foreign minister before taking up the Arab League post earlier this year, echoed Maher's comments, saying: "Bin Laden doesn't speak in the name of Arabs and Muslims."

But Syrian Foreign Minister Farouq al-Shara, in his address to the opening session of the meeting of the ministers, blasted the United States for its "unlimited" support to Israel.

The ministers issued recommendations after the meeting calling for Arab financial support to Palestinians to be extended to the first six months of next year.

Incoming email

http://watch.org/showart.php3?idx=19480&rtn=/index.html&showsubj=1&mcat=1

Wow! Look at section (1). Could the word "endorsing" be subsitituted by "confirming?"

If so, we are out of here very soon:

Daniel 9:27 "And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week..."

My reply

Here is an excerpt from that file:
House Congressional Resolution 253 Endorses the Mitchell Committee Report - Bill Koenig

Note from Bill: On October 25, 30 members of the U.S. Congress introduced H. Con. Res. 253. The sponsors are currently petitioning additional members of Congress to join them as co-sponsors....
----
107th CONGRESS
1st Session
H. CON. RES. 253 Expressing the sense of the Congress with respect to ending the violence in Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza, and endorsing the recommendations of the Mitchell Committee Report....
---
Dan. 9:27 says, "he ('the prince that shall come' whose people, the Romans, destroyed Jerusalem, i.e., the False Prophet) shall CONFIRM (gabar) the covenant with many for one week (shabuwa, sevened, i.e., a week of years, 7 years): and in the midst of the week (Mid-Trib, when the Great Tribulation begins) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations (idols) he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate (desolator).

The Hebrew word "gabar," means to be strong; by implication, to prevail, act insolently:--exceed, CONFIRM, be great, be mighty, prevail, put to more (strength), STRENGTHEN, be stronger, be valiant.

Endorsing means to express a definite approval of something, as confirming something does. We are in the ball park. After the Pre-Trib Rapture, I expect the Oslo Accords to be strengthened as the Tribulation begins. I also expect the Tribulation Pope to be put in command of the OWG and UR, with 10 subordinate kings over the 10 regions the world has been divided into already (Rev. 17:10-12). Rev. 13:4 says, "Who is like unto the beast? (i.e., no other)? who is able to make war with him?" He will be over "all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" (Rev. 13:7,8).

Confirming the covenant with many seems to point to the UN or OWG.

This document is probably what will be presented at the UN this week by either Bush or Powell. Agape

Incoming email

Meteor Clue To End Of Middle East Civilisations Found, By Robert Matthews:
http://www.rense.com/general16/meteorcluetoend.htm
The Telegraph 11-4-1 London - Scientists have found the first evidence that a devastating meteor impact in the Middle East might have triggered the mysterious collapse of civilisations more than 4,000 years ago.

Studies of satellite images of southern Iraq have revealed a two-mile-wide circular depression which scientists say bears all the hallmarks of an impact crater. If confirmed, it would point to the Middle East being struck by a meteor with the violence equivalent to hundreds of nuclear bombs.

Today's crater lies on what would have been shallow sea 4,000 years ago, and any impact would have caused devastating fires and flooding.

The catastrophic effect of these could explain the mystery of why so many early cultures went into sudden decline around 2300 BC.

They include the demise of the Akkad culture of central Iraq, with its mysterious semi-mythological emperor Sargon; the end of the fifth dynasty of Egypt's Old Kingdom, following the building of the Great Pyramids and the sudden disappearance of hundreds of early settlements in the Holy Land....

The crater's faint outline was found by Dr Sharad Master, a geologist at the University of Witwatersrand, Johannesburg, on satellite images of the Al 'Amarah region, about 10 miles north-west of the confluence of the Tigris and Euphrates and home of the Marsh Arabs.

"It was a purely accidental discovery," Dr Master told The Telegraph last week. "I was reading a magazine article about the canal-building projects of Saddam Hussein, and there was a photograph showing lots of formations - one of which was very, very circular."

Detailed analysis of other satellite images taken since the mid-1980s showed that for many years the crater contained a small lake.

The draining of the region, as part of Saddam's campaign against the Marsh Arabs, has since caused the lake to recede, revealing a ring-like ridge inside the larger bowl-like depression - a classic feature of meteor impact craters.

The crater also appears to be, in geological terms, very recent. Dr Master said: "The sediments in this region are very young, so whatever caused the crater-like structure, it must have happened within the past 6,000 years."

Reporting his finding in the latest issue of the journal Meteoritics & Planetary Science, Dr Master suggests that a recent meteor impact is the most plausible explanation for the structure....

A date of around 2300 BC for the impact may also cast new light on the legend of Gilgamesh, dating from the same period. The legend talks of "the Seven Judges of Hell", who raised their torches, lighting the land with flame, and a storm that turned day into night, "smashed the land like a cup", and flooded the area....

He said that craters recently found in Argentina date from around the same period - suggesting that the Earth may have been hit by a shower of large meteors at about the same time.

My reply

Thanks. This sounds like what happened in BC 1936, when Lot was brought out of Sodom just before it was destroyed by an asteroid. (It's a shadow of what will happen to Babylon on the first day of the millennial Day of the Lord.)

Incoming email

Re: Isaiah 24. This scripture is very intriguing Marilyn. Would you give us your interpretation and spiritual insight of the possiblity of this being a referernce to America? Pay close attention to verse 12 on. The city is NYC and the 'gate' which is battered could be the Golden Gate Bridge! This scripture goes to state that a revival will begin from the WEST COAST to the EAST COAST! "People will be saying "Glory to the Righteous One!" Then great troubles will come upon this nation. Worse than now. But the words, "The windows of Heaven are opened" is directly before the earth is tottering and reeling because it has been split. This scripture I have not studied the Hebrew meanings of but Isaiah 21 is America in prophecy. Many things that have been said about the terror attack like "we have set the table" and the fight for revenge " anoint the defense' (Homeland Defense) are mentioned in this portion of scripture of verses 1-10. Love in Christ

My reply

I don't think Isa. 21 or 24 has anything at all to do with the USA. Isa. 21:1 says, "The burden of the desert of the sea. As whirlwinds in the south pass through; so it cometh from the desert, from a terrible land." Verse 2 says, "Go up, O Elam: besiege, O Media." Verse 9 says,"Babylon is fallen, is fallen." I take that literally, and you probably will too if you look at a map of the area. The Arabian desert is to the south. Elam and Media are east of Babylon. There is nothing there to suggest the USA.

Isa. 24 takes place on the Day of God's Wrath. Verse 1 says, "Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof." Because of transgression, verse 6 says, "Therefore hath THE CURSE devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left."

Zech. 5:3 says, "This is THE CURSE (a binary asteroid, a flying rolling thing twice as long as wide) THAT GOETH FORTH (orbits) OVER THE FACE OF THE WHOLE EARTH; for every one that stealeth shall be cut off as on this side according to it (as with one stone tablet with commandments written on it); and every one that sweareth shall be cut off as on that side according to it (as with the other stone tablet). I will bring it forth, saith the LORD of hosts (Christ, Isa, 44:6), and it shall enter into the house of the thief (like Judas Iscariot, the False Prophet is a thief), and into the house of him that sweareth falsely by my name (the Tribulation Pope, the Beast): and it shall remain in the midst of his house, and shall consume it with the timber thereof and the stones thereof." These houses will probably be twin towers in Babylon. In verse 11, the world church will be moved "To build it an house in the land of Shinar: and it shall be established, and set there upon her own base" (the Tower of Babel, Gen. 11:2). Isa 30:25 says, "there shall be upon every high mountain, and upon every high hill, rivers and streams of waters in the day of the great slaughter, WHEN THE TOWERS FALL." The water overflows the land when the globe is turned upside down. In Isa. 24:20, "The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard."

Isa. 24:21-23 says, "it shall come to pass in that day (the millennial Day of the Lord that starts with the Day of God's Wrath), that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high (the fallen angels), and the kings of the earth upon the earth. And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited. Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts (Christ) shall reign in mount Zion (Heavenly Zion), and in Jerusalem (earthly Jerusalem), and before his ancients gloriously." Agape

Incoming email

Subject: Re. P&C 823(Five books...)
I was browsing through your web site as I tend to do pretty frequently, since I share your belief that the rapture is very near. On p&c 823(Re. Five books...) the writer indicates that he is looking for a better translation of revelation, implying that the KJV of the bible is somehow lacking. I would like to encourage you and your readers to view an exaustive and very compelling video by Professor Gail Riplinger re. KJV perfection and new version perversions. The video gives compelling reasons why the newer versions will be able to be used to manipulate and even convince people in these last days of the "divinity" of the anti-christ. It presents a history of the bible chronologically and proves that versions that are commonly accepted (i.e. NIV, NKJV, NASV, NRSV, CEV, TEV, REB, KJ21, RV, NAB, et.al.) have been corrupted by people with there own agendas. A free verse comparison tract is available at A.V. Publications Corp. P.O. Box 280 Ararat, VA. 24053 or call 1-800-435-4535. you can also search for info through MSN search engine by just typing 'Gail Riplinger' on the search bar. I was a big proponent of the NIV and especially the NKJV making all the same arguments about how outdated the KJV English is and how difficult it supposedly was to understand it. After viewing the 2 hr. tape, my eyes were open to the fact that I was buying in to a "new age" lie. The KJV, I am now convinced, is and was inspired and perfectly preserved by God for the English speaking people of the world. Hope this helps some people who may be confused regarding what bible translation to use or someone who may be looking for factual research in order to defend continued use of the KJV. AGAPE

My reply

Thanks for your information. I have always used the KJV as my main study Bible for the simple reason that I could learn better from it. However, I have read as many other versions as I can get my hands on. In each one, something will come clear that I hadn't seen before. It is because the translators chose different words from the variety of meanings available. I go back and compare things with the KJV, Green's Interlinear, and look up words in Young's Concordance, etc. I know where a few errors are in the KJV, but there are not many. The Dead Sea Scrolls show that the KJV is reliable. They also show the error in Isa. 53:9, which says, "he (Christ) made his grave with the WICKED, and with the RICH in his death." The Isaiah scroll turns it around. He actually did make his grave with the rich and was with the wicked in his death. Transposing those two words is a very small thing when you consider that the rest of Isaiah was correct. Agape

Incoming email

From: the Philippines
wow that earthquake is different. rocking back and forth seems to me two plates are sliding together. Are you from california? anyway Im not a geologist. by the way i just read that in an article.

...another question is why 13?

i have been encuraged with your research and to tell you the best news is that my wife and i are now preparing...watching...telling to our friends about the coming of our Lord and that they should prepare too. I have had a chance to talk to three pastors in our church although a bit skeptical at first is slowly coming through in their messages. our head pastor has really been challenging the church to watch! praise the Lord....

I also looked at rev 14:1-20 (end time harvest) and the similarities of Gen 18-20 (days of lot). It is incredible similar. from the number of visitors. to "sweeping". through blood spilt representing the expansion of the dead sea due to blood, water, fire and brimstone. i looked at it and the dead sea after destruction of sodom and gomorah increased by about 300 km and 13 feet deep, as against the previous height of 1400 ft deep! exactly as how rev ended amazing. The Lord bless you Mrs. Agee.

By the way we are monitoring the dhalits of India. Our church is the first indian church outside of India t be formally established. Fil-Indian Fellowship. We are based in Manila Philippines. This was in our prayer today (Sunday). Would you happen to know what happened. Its midnight here Nov 4.

Do you have any prayer requests you might want us to pray for.

again Thank you so much. I hope to hear from you again. hugs and kisses from us. In Christ

PS. ever considering doing a chatroom in MSN or Yahoo on Revelation.

My reply

...I lived in Indiana and Tennessee before we came to California in 1955. Ed is from Tennessee.

We have felt several earthquakes. The ones that have affected us the most were the one that knocked down the VA hospital, I think in 1971, the Northridge earthquake, and the Whittier earthquake. We have gotten cracks in walls, ceilings, patio slab and concrete driveway, but only lost one ceramic swordfish in the house. It fell off a high ledge and smashed because it wasn't glued down. Before that, I had glued some things onto clear plastic squares with silicone sealer. Since then, I also have the plastic squares under top-heavy things glued down with pink clay they sell for that purpose. We have been very lucky, thanks to the Lord.

> > why 13?

That is when a Jew comes of age, when they celebrate their Bar Mitzvah (boys) or Bat Mitzvah (girls). When Jesus went to the temple, he was 12. A Jewish boy was required to start preparing for his Mitzvah at that time.

> > I also looked at rev 14:1-20 (end time harvest) and the similarities of Gen 18-20 (days of lot). It is incredible similar.

I think the Pre-Wrath Rapture was prefigured by Lot's escape from Sodom just before it was destroyed by an asteroid.

> > By the way we are monitoring the dhalits of India. Our church is the first indian church outside of India t be formally established. Fil-Indian Fellowship. We are based in Manila Philippines. This was in our prayer today (Sunday). Would you happen to know what happened.

I'm so glad you told me about this church. Lord, bless everyone associated with this church in every way. In Jesus' name, Amen. I haven't heard yet what happened at the meeting in India. I'd appreciate it if you would let me know when you hear the news.

> > Do you have any prayer requests you might want us to pray for.

Thanks. I appreciate prayers for Ed's health. He has consistently been having high blood pressure when they check him at Cardiac Rehab before he exercises. It was ok at the doctor's however, so the doctor didn't change his medicine. He has a physical scheduled for tomorrow.

> > PS. ever considering doing a chatroom in MSN or Yahoo on Revelation.

I just don't have time to do more than I am doing. I'd rather answer by email. That gives me time to look up scriptures to show why I believe the way I do. Otherwise, it would just be my word. That's not good enough. Agape

Incoming email

Re: markc1030.htm, Mark Copfer (30 Oct) "7 Year Trib? Or Doctrine Of Man?"

I could not disagree more when you said The time of Jacob's Trouble is one day, the Day of God's Wrath.

With all due respect, this could not be further from the truth. The time of Jacobs Trouble, known as Daniels 70th week, is for a period of exactly 7 years, and that period of time cannot and will not be changed or shortened according to the words of God, when he says "I changeth not". Thus, since this period of time cannot be changed or altered in any way shape or form, BUT, the 7 year covenant of the AC in Daniel 9 IS changed, as it is shortened for the ELECTS SAKE, that brings us to the finality that these 2 periods of time are totally different events....They are events that overlap each other. And I firmly beleive by seeing with my own eyes, and hearing it come from the mouths of the Jews over in Israel, that Jacobs Trouble started on the day that the 6000th year since creation ended, right on Rosh Hashanah 2000. And just a few days prior to that, the 7 good years had ended.

This 7 year period of Jacobs Trouble, also known as Daniels 70th week, will not be shortened.. as it will fulfill out in its entirety, ending on Rosh Hashanah 2007, with the start of the second coming of Christ..... The covenant of 1 week, which is another 7 year period of time, will be broken, and then shortened, and NOT fulfilling its own 7 years in its entirety. So you see, 2 different time periods, 2 different events, but events that will certainly overlap each other. The rapture window opened when the 2nd day ended the 6000th year since creation on Rosh Hashanah last year... we are now in the 3rd day, and that is the day in which he will raise us up. The rapture is at hand, and could happen anytime now... and most likely will occur before the summer of 2003. Thanks for your website Marilyn... as it has been a true blessing, even if we do not agree on every single thing... I really enjoy reading your thoughts and the info on your site... Blessings to you and your hubby... YBIC
Mark:
http://pub28.bravenet.com/forum/show.php?usernum=2340524032

My reply

> > I could not disagree more when you said The time of Jacob's Trouble is one day, the Day of God's Wrath. With all due respect, this could not be further from the truth. The time of Jacobs Trouble, known as Daniels 70th week, is for a period of exactly 7 years

I'd like to see you find Scripture that will back you up on the time of Jacob's trouble being "exactly 7 years." I hear that out of the mouths of people, but I have never seen it in the Lord's Word. Daniel's 70th week is a 7-year period, but Daniel's whole 70th week is not the time of Jacob's trouble, although it includes the single day of Jacob's trouble.

The time of Jacob's trouble is mentioned in the Bible just one time. Jer. 30:1-9 says, "The word that came to Jeremiah from the LORD, saying, Thus speaketh the LORD God of Israel, saying, Write thee all the words that I have spoken unto thee in a book. For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it (i.e., modern Israel). And these are the words that the LORD spake concerning Israel and concerning Judah. For thus saith the LORD; We have heard a voice of trembling, of fear, and not of peace. Ask ye now, and see whether a man doth travail with child? WHEREFORE DO I SEE EVERY MAN WITH HIS HANDS ON HIS LOINS, AS A WOMAN IN TRAVAIL, AND ALL FACES ARE TURNED INTO PALENESS?"

Do you suppose that men hold their abdomens for 7 years? or one day? If you say for 7 years, how could they work, eat, sleep, bathe, change clothes or drink with their hands on their abdomens? Are all faces pale for 7 years? or one day? I think it is the Day of God's Wrath, one day, when the asteroids of Rev. 8:8,10 impact Earth. That is the day that all men say "to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb. For the great DAY OF HIS WRATH is come; and who shall be able to stand" (Rev. 6:16,17).

Continuing, Jer. 30:7-9 says, "Alas! for THAT DAY (one single day) is great, so that NONE IS LIKE IT (no other day is like it ever; therefore, it is not 2520 days, 7 years of days, it is one single day like no other day--ever): IT IS EVEN THE TIME OF JACOB'S TROUBLE; but he shall be saved out of it. For it shall come to pass in THAT DAY (one day), saith the LORD of hosts, that I will break his yoke from off thy neck, and will burst thy bonds, and strangers shall no more serve themselves of him: But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them."

Is David raised up over a 7-year period, or on one day? To me, none of this fits a 7-year period. If you want to believe the time of Jcob's trouble is a 7-year period, you will be in good company. Many authors I have read would agree with you. I don't agree with them. The scriptures above prove to me that it is one literal day. I learned long ago to search the scriptures and see if these things are so. This is one I think is not so.

> > 7 years, and that period of time cannot and will not be changed or shortened according to the words of God, when he says "I changeth not".

You said it. God "changeth not." He didn't say that the time of Jacob's trouble changeth not, just that God changeth not.

> > Thus, since this period of time cannot be changed or altered in any way shape or form, BUT, the 7 year covenant of the AC in Daniel 9 IS changed, as it is shortened for the ELECTS SAKE, that brings us to the finality that these 2 periods of time are totally different events....They are events that overlap each other.

The "finality"? Scripture please. If they are overlapping 7-year periods, that will be in Scripture somewhere. Jesus said, "take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things" (Mk. 13:23). Surely you can find his words to back you up.

> > I firmly beleive by seeing with my own eyes, and hearing it come from the mouths of the Jews over in Israel, that Jacobs Trouble started on the day that the 6000th year since creation ended, right on Rosh Hashanah 2000. And just a few days prior to that, the 7 good years had ended.

The good years ended, but the shortened Tribulation has not begun. The fact that we are here attests to that. We are to be kept out of the trial that will come upon the whole world (Rev. 3:10) that starts when the covenant is strengthened with "many" (Dan. 9:27). That will probably include the UN or OWG.

In Isa. 57:1-4, we see that the righteous escape before the Tribulation. It is "near." This passage says, "The righteous perisheth (abad, vanish, escape), and no man layeth it to heart: and merciful men are taken away (acaph, removed, evacuated), none considering that THE RIGHTEOUS IS TAKEN AWAY (acaph, removed, evacuated) FROM THE EVIL TO COME. He shall enter into peace: they shall rest in their beds (Psa. 149:5), each one walking in his uprightness. But draw near hither, ye sons of the sorceress (the Beast and False Prophet), the seed of the adulterer and the whore. Against whom do ye sport yourselves? against whom make ye a wide mouth, and draw out the tongue? are ye not children of transgression, a seed of falsehood".

> > The rapture is at hand, and could happen anytime now...... and most likely will occur before the summer of 2003.

I can't see it going to 2003. Things seem to be coming to a head faster than that. Do you think the UN will allow Israel and the PA to keep escalating the violence until 2003?

Glad you enjoy the web site. I like friendly discussion of the pro and cons on many different issues. We can learn from each other. It looks like the Lord gives understanding of different pieces of the prophecy puzzle to different people. We can gain more by discussing things than we can alone. Just being obliged to dig into Scripture to back up our beliefs can bring new things to light and straighten us out if we took a wrong turn somewhere, like I did by thinking the 2300 days of Dan. 8:13,14 would start last Pentecost. The Lord is showing us what can't be by the process of elimination. He didn't say "Watch" for nothing. We can learn by watching too. It is a great time to live in. That's in spite of all the awful things that happen. We can see how it all fits together to bring the Lord's prophecies to pass. I imagine him ticking this and that to get everything lined up correctly. Right now, we are the salt that is retarding the growth of leaven. Heaven help those left behind at the Rapture. The whole loaf will be leavened fast then. If we think evil is mushrooming now, what will it be after the salt is taken out of here? Whoosh! Shalom and agape

   Pro and Con 830   Or Return   Home


Contact me for more information at: mjagee@pe.net


Send me e-mail now


8641 Sugar Gum Rd, Riverside, CA 92508, USA; (909) 653-4110


© 1996-2001, Marilyn J. Agee
Updated 11-6-01